Tommy John Surgery Roster grows: Jarrod Parker, Medlen, Beachy, Corbin, Hochevar and more

[lcbj68c]

Color me convinced. All this time I thought TJ surgery was simply making the player whole, when in reality it was making them better than whole. Not better than whole for the purpose of lifting a grandson atop one's shoulders or putting milk away in the fridge, but better than whole for garnering future higher contracts, outperforming your opponent and producing better than average results in professional sports. Pretty much PED's, except one is "accepted/legal" and one isn't. #enlightened

[jerichoholicninja]

Cory Gearrin of the Braves to go under the knife.

[Fear The Chorizo]

sounds like Moore has at least a partial UCL tear and is weighing trying to rehab it or opt for surgery. I know Billingsly tried to avoid surgery only to eventually need it - to anyone who knows, have there been examples of pitchers with partially torn UCL's that don't opt for surgery and end up avoiding going under the knife entirely, or do they just delay the inevitable surgery a few months? I think Matt Harvey was faced with the same choice late last year and ended up getting surgery.

[lcbj68c]

sounds like Moore has at least a partial UCL tear and is weighing trying to rehab it or opt for surgery. I know Billingsly tried to avoid surgery only to eventually need it - to anyone who knows, have there been examples of pitchers with partially torn UCL's that don't opt for surgery and end up avoiding going under the knife entirely, or do they just delay the inevitable surgery a few months? I think Matt Harvey was faced with the same choice late last year and ended up getting surgery.

 

IIRC, Wainwright pitched for several years after a partial UCL tear. Quite successfully, with only rehab and not surgery.

[jerichoholicninja]

I like talking with my fiancee about TJ surgery because she's a Physical Therapist who actually wrote a paper on it. Which is weird because she wasn't a baseball fan until we met. Point being, according to her, a normal person could probably get by with rehab of a partial tear but a professional pitcher most likely could not.

[TheCrew07]

sounds like Moore has at least a partial UCL tear and is weighing trying to rehab it or opt for surgery. I know Billingsly tried to avoid surgery only to eventually need it - to anyone who knows, have there been examples of pitchers with partially torn UCL's that don't opt for surgery and end up avoiding going under the knife entirely, or do they just delay the inevitable surgery a few months? I think Matt Harvey was faced with the same choice late last year and ended up getting surgery.

 

There haven't been many around baseball, I'm sure there's someone I'm just forgetting off the top of my head, but not a single pitcher in the Brewer organization has evaded TJ surgery with rehab. The Brewers have repeatedly tried this option with pitchers only to give up after 2-4 months and have the surgery anyway, which in the end cost the pitcher 2 seasons instead of 1.

 

If the timing was right, like say in September, and it was a partial tear on the lower of the scale a pitcher could probably rehab it and be okay for the next season, you just don't see that combination of factors very much. Pitching injuries generally seem to be frontloaded on the season, I've always been kind of curious as to why that is.

[reillymcshane]

Really interesting article in the rise of TJ surgery.

 

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/matt-moore-baseball-tommy-john-surgery-historic-rate/

 

In 2014, 20 players have had the procedure - the most ever. And that doesn't include Matt Moore, Braves reliever Cory Gearrin and Angels prospect Brian Moran - who all will need the surgery.

 

A lot of the blame (from baseball people) goes to young kids pitching too much. They pitch year around and train to make themselves throw harder (and thus look better to scouts). We're making young kids better - and doing it at an earlier age. But that may be making them more at risk for arm problems later.

[LouisEly]

Daniel Hudson certainly wouldn't call TJ surgery an enhancement. He still hasn't come back from the procedure in 2012, and reinjured his repaired elbow last year during rehab and needed a second TJ surgery.

[Eye Black]

Matt Moore decided to undergo TJ surgery on his partially torn UCL. Link

[TheCrew07]

Ask BA: How Bad Is A Second Tommy John Surgery For A Pitcher?

[reillymcshane]

Some more information on the rise of TJ. The argument (again) is that high school kids are trained to throw harder (specialized coaches, training, etc.), throw more often (in addition to their HS, traveling all star teams, showcases, etc.) and at a younger age.

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mlb/news/20140415/tommy-john-surgery-high-school-pitchers-jameson-taillon/

 

The article doesn't go into the abuse put on arms in college - just focuses on high school students.

[jerichoholicninja]

Ivan Nova is almost certainly the newest member.

[reillymcshane]

I hadn't seen this, but Josh Johnson might be looking at TJ surgery as well.

 

http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2014/4/16/5619442/josh-johnson-may-require-tommy-john-surgery-padres

[Fear The Chorizo]

So how much of the recent spike in Tommy John surgeries could be the result of the game trying to clean itself up from a PED/HGH standpoint? From a pitching standpoint, PED use was most beneficial to help guys recover faster and prevent chronic fatigue that often leads to injuries, particularly HGH. If pitchers aren't taking PEDs to help recovery and are being conditioned to throw harder than ever before, breakdowns would inevitably occur more frequently.

 

I'm not saying today's pitchers who blew out their UCLs were former PED users - I think it could speak more to why there weren't more occurences of that injury at the major league level sooner than what we're seeing presently.

[jerichoholicninja]

If anything I would say PED use would increase the risk of TJ. Pitchers aren't meant to be muscular in their arms and shoulders.

 

I wonder if it's become a matter of over-prescribing the procedure because of the number of pitchers who have successfully recovered from it. Teams might have come to the thinking that it's better to just have the surgery and miss a season rather than rehab or play at less than 100% knowing that surgery could very well just fix the problem.

[RightFieldCoder]

PED's don't build muscles. They help you recover from fatigue. Guys like McGuire/Sosa/Bonds used the extra energy to spend more time in the gym. The extra time in the gym built muscles. There were many players (like Bruan) who used PEDs without doing extra reps.

[Fear The Chorizo]

"Another extremely important benefit for anyone that is physically active, is that as your levels of HGH increase, your bones and ligaments and tendons will be strengthened. HGH regenerates the processes that builds healthy tendons, ligaments, and increases bone density. This can help you avoid common sports and exercise related injuries due to a weakness in any of these joint and bone related components. More recent studies have shown that neurologic injuries are also less likely with amino acid supplementation. "

 

This was pulled from a resource talking about benefits of HGH use...there are tons of PEDs out there that won't turn a pitcher into a 250-lb linebacker who can bench press a buick.

[endaround]

Pitchers have been using PEDs for at least 40 years to recover between starts and relief appearances.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Pitchers have been using PEDs for at least 40 years to recover between starts and relief appearances.

 

In a way that's what I'm saying - what if over the past few seasons PED use among pitchers dropped significantly due to MLB imposing the testing program and intense scrutiny throughout baseball to clean the game up? What we're seeing over the past few seasons in terms of a spike in MLB Tommy John surgeries is resulting from the combination of:

 

1 - pitchers 'maxing out' with regularity to increase velocity and movement on breaking pitches to strike hitters out, and

2 - fewer pitchers using PEDs to assist with recovery than what had become the norm through 2010

 

I also think it's a product of the type of pitcher today's game values the most - guys who can throw it through a wall and who have breaking stuff that buckles knees...strikeout artists. A pitcher like Maddux could beat a great offensive team throwing all of his pitches 75-85mph with location and command. He'd probably have a tough time today getting a shot beyond AA if he had been born 25 years later. The emphasis on radar gun readings over the past 10 seasons for players, scouts, and fans has dramatically shifted how pitching is developed at even the youngest levels of baseball.

[PrinceEatMeat]

@AdamMcCalvy 4m

Bad news in #Brewers MInor Leagues: RHP Johnny Hellweg has a torn elbow ligament & is heading to see Dr. Andrews. Details to come.

 

Looks like Hellweg has joined the list. NOOOOO!!!!!

[djoctagone]

let's hope johnny hellweg isn't a candidate for tommy john surgery.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Hellweg sucks and is way overrated anyways.

[torts]

Hellweg sucks and is way overrated anyways.

 

GO AWAY YOU ARE SUCH A DEBBIE DOWNER EVERYWHERE ON THIS BOARD

[torts]

so who gets promoted to AAA with Hellweg inevitably going on the 60-day? Could Jungmann get promoted?

[yfinn6]

Hellweg sucks and is way overrated anyways.

 

GO AWAY YOU ARE SUCH A DEBBIE DOWNER EVERYWHERE ON THIS BOARD

 

Use the ignore function; it works great and has made the in-game threads 100x better.