Braun to 1B?

[logan82]

the more I think about it, the more I think Braun would be worse, defensively, than Prince Fielder at 1B. And that is pretty bad

I just don't see that. I really don't. Braun is a better athlete than Prince and Braun's problem at 3rd was throwing the ball. 16 of his 26 errors were throwing the ball.

How many bad throws were the result of not fielding the ball cleanly because he can't field a ground ball very well? He was bad at everything about fielding at 3B not just throwing. How many balls did he screw up that didn't count as errors? He fielding at 3B was historically bad. Range, throwing, fielding, everything.

[FVBrewerFan]

Hopefully Coulter can stick at 3B. I thought I read that Coulter will be playing 3B in 2015

 

They are trying him there in the instructional league. I don't think they know yet what position(s) he will be playing in 2015.

[TURBO]

He fielding at 3B was historically bad. Range, throwing, fielding, everything.

 

Which is why I always wonder why anyone would want him at 1B... He will have to make a lot of plays at 1B too, not just receiving throws... Did everyone forget just how bad he was?

[Bombers]

the more I think about it, the more I think Braun would be worse, defensively, than Prince Fielder at 1B. And that is pretty bad

I just don't see that. I really don't. Braun is a better athlete than Prince and Braun's problem at 3rd was throwing the ball. 16 of his 26 errors were throwing the ball.

How many bad throws were the result of not fielding the ball cleanly because he can't field a ground ball very well? He was bad at everything about fielding at 3B not just throwing. How many balls did he screw up that didn't count as errors? He fielding at 3B was historically bad. Range, throwing, fielding, everything.

I certainly don't remember each play he had at 3B to emphatically say he was horrendous and everything was bad. I believe the Brewers really need to take a deep look at where Braun fits into this team. And as more guys come up and move to the upper levels, having Braun being able to play multiple positions will be a positive. What if Coulter is bad at 1B? Maybe he ends up as a decent OF? Who knows. Even if Braun can just play an acceptable first base, it gives you options. In all honesty, there isn't any reason they shouldn't have tried Braun at 1B this Spring. We all saw the hole at 1B in Spring, Melvin just refused to believe it.

 

So we now have trotted out players who have qualified for bottom 5 in the league for 2 years running. And 2015, we are banking on Rogers and Clark to end the rut? I guess I just wouldn't put all my eggs into 1 unknown basket (again.) The Brewers need help at 1B and need all avenues looked into, IMO.

[Bombers]

He fielding at 3B was historically bad. Range, throwing, fielding, everything.

 

Which is why I always wonder why anyone would want him at 1B... He will have to make a lot of plays at 1B too, not just receiving throws... Did everyone forget just how bad he was?

 

Yes. I have certainly forgotten. I remember there being errors but not to the point of frustration that Yuni brought me. My point is just, why not try him there? (Especially in Spring Training) ... What if he can play it? and if he can't, don't you want to at least know?

[reillymcshane]

I am intrigued by the idea of Braun at 1B.

 

However, there are some BIG questions about Ryan playing the position. Some people point to his horrible fielding at 3B, which is a legitimate issue. Others say the main issue he had was with throwing. Still others note that Braun had really poor instincts. Bad instincts lead to bad reactions, poor first steps, etc. This latter thing - bad instincts - is what worries me most. 1B limits the throwing issue, but 1B does require good instincts.

 

It's been a lot of years since Braun played 3B. I don't remember it that well, other than the bad throws (which were many). Maybe his instincts were terrible and will translate poorly to 1B. But I think it's worth considering. Braun is an athletic guy. He might thrive with the move, even if his 3B time was awful.

 

This would allow us to keep Parra and put him into RF. This improves our defense, because Ryan is not a good RF. Parra's left handed bat should help balance our lineup. Also, the cost of Parra (around $6 million) is less than adding a free agent like LaRoche.

 

The move would fill an obvious organizational hole (unless you think Rogers and Clark are the answer at 1B for the next few years).

 

In some ways, I'm loathe to move Ryan to 1B because he does have the ability to play LF/RF. It seems a waste. But on the other hand, the options aren't attractive. And you have someone (Parra) who can ably play the outfield, so why not investigate the move.

 

Again, it all comes down to Braun's ability at 1B.

 

Perhaps the move will help Ryan physically. Not just the thumb/hand, but the various bumps that have cropped up over the years.

 

In the end, if it helps Braun get back to being a .300/30HR hitter, I'm for it.

[3and2Fastball]

Honestly I think we'd be better off moving Carlos Gomez to SS than moving Braun to 1B. Not kidding

[Bombers]

Honestly I think we'd be better off moving Carlos Gomez to SS than moving Braun to 1B. Not kidding

Lol. Carlos says yes!

[HiAndTight]

the more I think about it, the more I think Braun would be worse, defensively, than Prince Fielder at 1B. And that is pretty bad

 

I just can't wrap my head around this. Are we still operating on the assumption that because Braun played 3rd poorly, he couldn't play 1st?

 

They're not even comparable positions. Braun could field his position decently. Certainly much better than Prince could have ever dreamed of if he played 3rd. He did have problems throwing the ball, mainly the routine plays, but Prince didn't have a very good arm either.

 

Braun would have to work at it like anyone, but his failures at 3rd really don't translate to what he'd be required to do at 1st.

 

And people forget, Braun made some incredible plays at 3rd and I think would have developed into a much better 3rd basemen had the Brewers given him the leeway they gave Weeks(which would have still made him a very bad 3rd basemen).

[fondybrewfan]

It all comes down to what the best combination of RF and 1B players we can get this offseason. If more and/or better options are available in the OF I would be OK moving Braun to first. If you can find a good 1B then just leave Braun out there. Just do whatever you can to put the best team on the field. You can probably throw 3rd base in the mix too if you wanted to move Aram to 1st. All options should be open IMO.

[HiAndTight]

the more I think about it, the more I think Braun would be worse, defensively, than Prince Fielder at 1B. And that is pretty bad

I just don't see that. I really don't. Braun is a better athlete than Prince and Braun's problem at 3rd was throwing the ball. 16 of his 26 errors were throwing the ball.

How many bad throws were the result of not fielding the ball cleanly because he can't field a ground ball very well? He was bad at everything about fielding at 3B not just throwing. How many balls did he screw up that didn't count as errors? He fielding at 3B was historically bad. Range, throwing, fielding, everything.

 

 

I don't know, I would guess very few were. The majority came on routine plays where he had plenty of time to make the throw or on balls he had to come in on. He was NOT historically bad at everything(in his rookie year). And his range was actually exceptional. Just his ability to get to the ball.

 

People remember that he was a disaster as a whole, but forget many of the extraordinary plays he made going into foul territory to make plays, or other more difficult plays. Limit the long throws and he's fine.

[TooLiveBrew]

Braun was awful at every aspect of infield defense at 3B short of being fast & athletic. Nothing looked natural to him... bad instincts, bad hands, horrifically inconsistent (but strong) arm. He might well adapt fine to 1B, but yes he was awful at basically everything.

[HiAndTight]

Braun was awful at every aspect of infield defense at 3B short of being fast & athletic. Nothing looked natural to him... bad instincts, bad hands, horrifically inconsistent (but strong) arm. He might well adapt fine to 1B, but yes he was awful at basically everything.

 

 

Nobody is saying he wasn't bad. How bad in certain areas is being exaggerated a bit, but either way, everyone agrees when he played 3rd base, he was very bad. But again, I just don't see much of a correlation between 3rd and 1st. The degree of difficulty in the average play at 1st is just so much lower than at 1st. I honestly don't think Corey Hart would have fared any better at 3rd, much like how most 1st basemen would be trainwrecks across the diamond.

 

They are trying him there in the instructional league. I don't think they know yet what position(s) he will be playing in 2015.

 

I'd hate to see him end up at 1st. Having an athletic 1st basemen is obviously an advantage, but I believe Coulter's athletic ability and arm would be wasted over there. I still think if they were willing to take their time with him, he could develop into a good catcher.

[TooLiveBrew]

Braun was awful at every aspect of infield defense at 3B short of being fast & athletic. Nothing looked natural to him... bad instincts, bad hands, horrifically inconsistent (but strong) arm. He might well adapt fine to 1B, but yes he was awful at basically everything.

 

 

Nobody is saying he wasn't bad. How bad in certain areas is being exaggerated a bit, but either way, everyone agrees when he played 3rd base, he was very bad. But again, I just don't see much of a correlation between 3rd and 1st. The degree of difficulty in the average play at 1st is just so much lower than at 1st. I honestly don't think Corey Hart would have fared any better at 3rd, much like how most 1st basemen would be trainwrecks across the diamond.

I was responding to your point that he wasn't really bad at everything (sorry, should've quoted your post directly). It's my opinion that, yes, he was really really bad at everything aside from being fast & athletic. I don't think it's being overstated. Now will that matter at 1B? Maybe not, but his glovework/hands were never good at 3B, & that will be a relevant part of defending at the opposite corner spot.

 

I'm glad the club's considering trying him there, as maybe it can help keep him on the field a bit more. Plus there's not exactly anyone in the org. just screaming 'I should be the first-choice at 1B!'

[Roderick]

All options should be open IMO.

 

This is the one benefit to how the season is closing out. If the Brewers would have won enough games to squeak into the playoffs, lets say got past the play-in game, and won 1-2 games in their first round and then exited, DM would have been content to let the roster sit the way it is sitting now and just reshuffle 1B.

[IndyCrew]

Gamel was horrible at 3rd, and decent at 1st.

[logan82]

Gamel was horrible at 3rd, and decent at 1st.

Gamel looked decent at 3B other than his throws. That is what we heard about him coming up as well. Braun just looked bad.

 

I remember there being errors but not to the point of frustration that Yuni brought me.

Probably because Braun could hit.

[reillymcshane]

I'm glad the club's considering trying him there, as maybe it can help keep him on the field a bit more. Plus there's not exactly anyone in the org. just screaming 'I should be the first-choice at 1B!'

I'm available. Gotta like the smile.

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/headshots/mlb/players/full/6218.png&w=350&h=254

[gregmag]

I've thought Braun to 1b was a good idea for quite a while, and it makes even more sense now than it did a year ago. He's a defensive liability in RF, and 1b is the last place you can hide his defense. I think he'd probably be okay defensively at 1b, but even if he isn't, the bottom line is that he has to play somewhere. I can't remember the last time I heard a team keeping a guy in the OF because they were afraid he'd be worse at 1b. We're analyzing this a lot, but 1b remains an easier position than corner OF, and it also remains a less important one (assuming your 1b can at least catch normal throws without dropping them).

[logan82]

Last time they kept a guy in the outfield because he couldn't play 1B, Khris Davis.

[pogokat]

I have no doubt Braun could play a competent 1st base---it's easier to field than outfield. To me, the bigger question is how this actually improves the offensive impact of the team. Moving Braun to first and putting Parra in right leaves us with essentially the same lineup we currently have. It also limits at bats for Lucroy, unless your still going to let him play first when he's not catching, which means benching Braun or Parra.

 

I'm all for moving Braun to 1st if it means acquiring a RF that's net worth is greater than Parra's hitting+defense, but moving the parts we have currently around just so we can keep the same guys doesn't sound like a good plan. In fact, it sounds like a great way to finish about .500.

[torts]

wasnt part of the problem with his thumb that it was getting blisters from gripping the ball to hard when fielding in RF earlier in the season?

[jerichoholicninja]

wasnt part of the problem with his thumb that it was getting blisters from gripping the ball to hard when fielding in RF earlier in the season?

 

The blisters were from hitting.

[torts]

wasnt part of the problem with his thumb that it was getting blisters from gripping the ball to hard when fielding in RF earlier in the season?

 

The blisters were from hitting.

 

http://disciplesofuecker.com/braun-hand-injury-surgery/17611

[gregmag]

Logan -- Point taken, though I still wonder whether that was the whole of the reasoning. But yes, I remember that now.

 

Pogo -- I think any move should be contingent on how we can improve the team. If we can add a difference maker at 1b, then we should definitely do it. But right now I think it's worth considering what the best deployment of our current players would be.

 

I'm not quite sure I get your reasoning about how the move would just maintain the status quo. Moving Braun to 1b would essentially mean replacing Reynolds / Overbay with Parra. That's certainly likely to be an offensive upgrade, and you also get a big, big defensive upgrade in rf in exchange for probably a minor defensive downgrade at 1b.