Competition for Maldonado?

[JohnBriggs12]

Nobody has brought it up but coming off a poor offensive year, does anyone else think they should bring in some competition for the backup catcher spot?

 

The Giants just DFA'd Johnny Monell, a lefty swinger who put up a nifty .858 OPS at AAA last year. Don't know about his defense as he had a high amount of PB in his career, but he's average (29%) at throwing out runners. I like the fact that he hits from the left side, has some pop and on base skills. He's also played a significant amount at 1B.

 

I'm not suggesting they replace Maldonado, just bring in some real competition.

[logan82]

Why bring in anybody to finish in 4th place again this year?

[Mass Haas]

Why bring in anybody to finish in 4th place again this year?

 

Wow, guess you won't be wasting time buying tickets, watching on TV, listening on the radio. Gee, we should just shut down this forum. Thanks for clearing that up...

[And That]

He's been nothing but injured the past few years, but it wasn't too long ago that Taylor Teagarden was very highly regarded. Might be worth a shot on a minor league deal.

 

Robinzon Diaz has already been brought back. I assume he'll get a long look in spring training as insurance.

 

Logan, to answer your question... are the Brewers going to win the division next year? Probably not. Do they need to field a team? Yes. I don't see how or who it hurts to bring in cheap competition at any position.

 

The 2011 BA Prospect Handbook called Monell's defense raw, with evolving game-calling skills. He has a tick above-average arm. No idea how he's progressed since then, though. He was the Giants' 28th best prospect that year and hasn't been ranked the past few years.

[jerichoholicninja]

Martin is on the team for his defense, unless there is someone out there as good or better than he is defensively it would be pointless to bring in someone else. Also I don't think you can discount the success Peralta had once Maldonado starting catching him exclusively. However, if the team is doing something as stupid as trying to play Lucroy at first more, then they would need to bring in a catcher that could hit.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Why bring in anybody to finish in 4th place again this year?

 

Wow, guess you won't be wasting time buying tickets, watching on TV, listening on the radio. Gee, we should just shut down this forum. Thanks for clearing that up...

 

This got a chuckle out of me. Fans are going to be pleasantly surprised by this Brewers team this year. However, if they are surprised they really shouldn't be if they actually paid attention to what happened last season, the good, and also paid attention to what Doug Melvin has done since 2008. Mainly the parts about getting what the team needs to contend.

[logan82]

Maldanodo is already on the roster and you can't get much cheaper than he is. No reason to dump resources into a position that is already covered.

[And That]

I think "dump resources" is a little strong for finding a non-roster player or a younger guy with options remaining. I don't think the intent was to bring in Jared Saltalamacchia.

[logan82]

They could bring in somebody they intend to flip at the deadline provided Maldonado has options. Like K-Rod last year.

[brewcrewdue80]

Really don't see an issue with Maldonado being backup. He's cheap. Plus defensively. For as bad a year he had last season he was just a -.1WAR.

This after being 1.6WAR the year prior. He's the backup with Plus WAR ability/potential for under 1mil/yr.

I remember when Lucroy was on the DL in 2012 people calling Maldonado the true Brewers Catcher long term. Obviously it was premature, but I'm not forgetting what he did in 2012 because of 2013. Personally I look forward to him being the Brewers capable backup for another 4-5 seasons. And it'll likely cost the team 4-6mil total for his time served as backup. We know what Maldonado provides as Catcher. Great Defense,Reliable. The Offense if it comes is a plus. No need to try finding and paying for essentially another Maldonado. If there's a FA Backup catcher on the market it will be of the same short-comings Maldonado has offensively. Or the opposite, defensive shortcomings with offensive upside, but I promise you that will cost 3mil or more. Not worth it.

 

Also, Maldonado is one of those players that I see being excellent trade fodder for Milwaukee. A decent run offensively or at least an avg. ability offensively with his defense could be very appealing to many a team when one of their catchers may go down. I've wondered Tampa's potential buyer for Maldonado before. I just see him as fitting a small market's playoff push roster addition if they need a Catcher down the stretch that won't hurt their bottom line. What would he return? Depends when that trade happens, what his offensive stats have been, how many more years of team control exists.

Baltimore is another team that if they move on from Wieters and his rising cost, could look at Maldonado for value at C.

 

With the thought of trade value in mind I'm sticking behind every appearance Maldonado makes. Because you don't know how much added value he may accumulate with each. And I don't want to take that chance to accumulate added value away.

[TURBO]

As long as Lucroy stays healthy, I'm fine with "Maldy" as our back-up, however, if he became our every day catcher, I wouldn't be as fine with that... If Lucroy goes down, we would be in deep crap.

[brewcrewdue80]

As long as Lucroy stays healthy, I'm fine with "Maldy" as our back-up, however, if he became our every day catcher, I wouldn't be as fine with that... If Lucroy goes down, we would be in deep crap.

 

Yes we would have a backup Catcher problem no doubt. But Maldonado's true success was when he replaced Lucroy playing every day in 2012. Catching every day may make him that .240ish Catcher you hope for vs. being the maybe .200mendoza line Catcher he is when playing sporadically.

[Warning Track Power]

As long as Lucroy stays healthy, I'm fine with "Maldy" as our back-up, however, if he became our every day catcher, I wouldn't be as fine with that... If Lucroy goes down, we would be in deep crap.

Agreed. I don't think the Brewers are solid enough overall as a team to sustain a .200 hitting catcher. With Rickie Weeks still listed as the 2B (subject to change) and not showing any signs of ever returning to being even a .250 hitter, I think having Weeks and Maldonado at #7 & #8 in the lineup would cause for a ton of quick innings.

[RobertR]

Really don't see an issue with Maldonado being backup. He's cheap. Plus defensively. For as bad a year he had last season he was just a -.1WAR.

This after being 1.6WAR the year prior. He's the backup with Plus WAR ability/potential for under 1mil/yr.

 

 

He also has negative WAR ability/potential based on last season. There's no harm in looking around for depth when you have a player like that. Because "we have nobody better" isn't an excuse.

 

Nobody is saying replace him. Just have a Plan B. Heck, what happens if one of Lucroy or Maldonado goes down with injury for a few weeks anyways? The debacle at first base last year should be a lesson that there's no such thing as too much depth.

[brewcrewdue80]

Really don't see an issue with Maldonado being backup. He's cheap. Plus defensively. For as bad a year he had last season he was just a -.1WAR.

This after being 1.6WAR the year prior. He's the backup with Plus WAR ability/potential for under 1mil/yr.

 

 

He also has negative WAR ability/potential based on last season. There's no harm in looking around for depth when you have a player like that. Because "we have nobody better" isn't an excuse.

 

Nobody is saying replace him. Just have a Plan B. Heck, what happens if one of Lucroy or Maldonado goes down with injury for a few weeks anyways? The debacle at first base last year should be a lesson that there's no such thing as too much depth.

 

I believe McHenry was just dropped by the Pirates. So was Arencibia by Toronto. When/if that scenario happens, I'm not worried about potential available Backup Catchers that are Maldonado clones being available. Hey where's John Buck these days? I mean even in trade what is that going to cost? Kottaras netted Fautino De Los Santos. All 16 minor League IP since then?

Sure the drop off from Lucroy to whoever takes the field in his place is a lot. But Lucroy is on that top 5?-8? Catcher in all of MLB level. It's a huge dropoff for just about any team from him at C.

To put it simply: only 17 Catchers last season reached 2WAR in value. 18th to 50th ranked 0-1.9WAR or Replacement level type players. There simply aren't many every day Starting Catchers out there to begin with. Milwaukee is lucky to have 1. You're asking them to find a second? Half the League doesn't have an every Day Starting Catcher and you are concerned that we need a 2nd?

[jerichoholicninja]

From what I've read Arencibia is somewhat of a butcher behind the plate but the guy's a guaranteed 20 HR playing only 130 games a year. Boy his OBP sucks but 20+ HR potential on the bench isn't bad to have.

[RobertR]

To put it simply: only 17 Catchers last season reached 2WAR in value. 18th to 50th ranked 0-1.9WAR or Replacement level type players. There simply aren't many every day Starting Catchers out there to begin with. Milwaukee is lucky to have 1. You're asking them to find a second? Half the League doesn't have an every Day Starting Catcher and you are concerned that we need a 2nd?

 

No, I'm asking them to keep their eyes open to see if they can scoop up somebody who is potentially above replacement level if Maldonado tanks again. Especially since it looks like the Brewers are actually going to put a team on the field that they think could contend and every win likely matters.

 

This might seem like a radical idea, but a guy that's below replacement level is someone you should look to replace. No matter how cheap. Admittedly, since budget is an issue, the likeliest thing to happen is to trot Maldonado out there at the beginning of the season and if the Brewers are in contention and he's not hitting a lick, you likely can pick up a catcher cheap at the deadline. But, a backup catcher typically doesn't make all that much either and if you can pick up a win, that's a good marginal return on an extra couple of hundred thousand.

 

I feel the same way about Logan Schafer, Juan Francisco, and Jeff Bianchi too. Death by a thousand paper cuts. Those three plus Maldonado could reasonably be expected to get about 1000 PAs in 2014. If you're looking to find wins on the margins and cheaply, i'd suggest that not just handing a roster spot to guys with sub-replacement level potential is a good place to start.

[brewcrewdue80]

And yet we went all of last season with Yuni on the Roster? I understand your wanting to have a better backup. But I just don't believe Maldonado will be a .169 hitter again. And any improved numbers offensively for him has to change him from that -.1WAR to a positive no? I mean how much worse can he possibly hit than last season? That's how I am looking at it, is if his absolute bottom is that of 0WAR then he's going to be a positive WAR player more likely than not until his defensive abilities erode.

[And That]

And yet we went all of last season with Yuni on the Roster? I understand your wanting to have a better backup. But I just don't believe Maldonado will be a .169 hitter again. And any improved numbers offensively for him has to change him from that -.1WAR to a positive no? I mean how much worse can he possibly hit than last season? That's how I am looking at it, is if his absolute bottom is that of 0WAR then he's going to be a positive WAR player more likely than not until his defensive abilities erode.

 

Ok, but what is the harm in bringing in competition?

[RobertR]

And yet we went all of last season with Yuni on the Roster? I understand your wanting to have a better backup. But I just don't believe Maldonado will be a .169 hitter again. And any improved numbers offensively for him has to change him from that -.1WAR to a positive no? I mean how much worse can he possibly hit than last season? That's how I am looking at it, is if his absolute bottom is that of 0WAR then he's going to be a positive WAR player more likely than not until his defensive abilities erode.

 

Yeah, we went all of last season with Yuni on the roster. And it was a disaster. What's your point, that we shouldn't have been proactive in bringing in first basemen that would likely be at or above replacement level?

 

Depending on how you value defense, there's a good chunk of the depth of the team that's likely to be at or below replacement value. Being cheap means squat if you're at replacement value. The Brewers shouldn't be automatically handing a roster spot to anyone if they're cheap and bad, especially if they have options. Now, I'm not expecting the Brewers to go hog wild in free agency to address all those spots, but I'd like for them to keep their eyes open.

[Rock hard Brouhard]

Granted I know nothing about Lalli's defense but I wondered why he was not given a better shot at backup catcher last year.

[brewcrewdue80]

And yet we went all of last season with Yuni on the Roster? I understand your wanting to have a better backup. But I just don't believe Maldonado will be a .169 hitter again. And any improved numbers offensively for him has to change him from that -.1WAR to a positive no? I mean how much worse can he possibly hit than last season? That's how I am looking at it, is if his absolute bottom is that of 0WAR then he's going to be a positive WAR player more likely than not until his defensive abilities erode.

 

Yeah, we went all of last season with Yuni on the roster. And it was a disaster. What's your point, that we shouldn't have been proactive in bringing in first basemen that would likely be at or above replacement level?

 

Depending on how you value defense, there's a good chunk of the depth of the team that's likely to be at or below replacement value. Being cheap means squat if you're at replacement value. The Brewers shouldn't be automatically handing a roster spot to anyone if they're cheap and bad, especially if they have options. Now, I'm not expecting the Brewers to go hog wild in free agency to address all those spots, but I'd like for them to keep their eyes open.

 

 

What's my point? That Maldonado on a terrible season was a 0WAR player. He hit to the tune of .768OPS in AAA and .668OPS in AA I would imagine that his .520OPS last season is one that isn't about to be repeated. A .660OPS out of him likely makes him a 1-2WAR Catcher with his defense. So you are searching for somebody the team already has. If he bats to a .760OPS he's 2WAR+ on the season. I just don't get how 1 awful year by a guy playing backup vs. everyday has he was accostumed to means that moving forward he's automatically a .520OPS hitter? He's having an offseason to make new adjustments. I fully expect him to bat in the .650 or better OPS moving forward and that should be a +WAR backup C.

 

Say he fails this season the team sends him back to AAA so be it, Lucroy can just start 9/10 games. vs. 4/5games.

If Lucroy goes down for a long period of games, either Maldonado will perform like 2012 with the added games started or we'll make a move to find a replacement. You're searching for a replacement catcher among replacement catchers? That's my point. Anybody from the available pool of catchers you can get to be Lucroy's backup are likely Catchers who can be -2WAR to 1WAR depending if they happen to get hot for a stretch or never do. That's what we have now.

[RobertR]

Again, my point isn't necessary that Maldonado needs to be replaced as much as the Brewers aren't in a position to not see what depth is out there. There are a number of players on the roster that were around replacement level last year and none of them should be immune from competition if there is someone out there that's acquirable.

 

Plus, I categorically reject the notion that Maldonado couldn't be worse, like defensive performance is perfectly repeatable. It's easily possible that he's better offensively and not as good defensively and is right back at replacement level or worse. That's the type of assumption that leads to banners of Henry Blanco in front of Miller Park.

 

I don't think I have any kind of radical stance by saying replacement level players are guys you should have Plan Bs for. Yeah, there's nothing you can do if Lucroy goes down. But, if Maldonado goes out and is sub-Mendoza line again, which I think is a lot more likely than you do, having an option at AAA is a good idea. Or if the Brewers aren't going to acquire depth in the offseason, I hope they're a lot more willing to pull the trigger if it becomes a problem in 2014 than they were in 2013.