Designated Yost Thread... Latest: No accountability and lack of urgency (part 5)

[Thurston Fluff]

When his team doesn't have as much talent as other teams, that is what he needs to do.

 

He's always been that way so I don't think it's due to this team's makeup.

[Bucky Rules]

TLB -- Great post. I agree with you on more than enough of those points to not even bother with a couple of minor issues. I think the reason that some (including myself) give credit to Yost for things that he probably doesn't deserve is to try to compensate for those that believe he has far more negative impact than what we believe. In my world, the coaching staff in general is one of the least critical components of an organization. They are wayyyyyyyyyyy overrated.

[Bucky Rules]

Could this come back around to bit Tony in the long haul?

No. It just doesn't matter. Yost was unjustly criticized for it. It makes almost no difference at all.

[TooLiveBrew]

One of those things again that Ned was criticized for last year, and has fixed this year. Could this come back around to bit Tony in the long haul?

 

Considering a 'different lineup' can be the exact same players with your 5 & 6 guys swapped, no. The media tends to salivate on this issue, which is really a non-issue imo. Just another example of how poorly most sportswriters understand baseball.

 

 

I agree with you on more than enough of those points to not even bother with a couple of minor issues.

 

Please -- 'bother' away. I'd love to hear your thoughts.

 

 

I think the reason that some (including myself) give credit to Yost for things that he probably doesn't deserve is to try to compensate for those that believe he has far more negative impact than what we believe.

 

I can understand this.

 

 

In my world, the coaching staff in general is one of the least critical components of an organization. They are wayyyyyyyyyyy overrated.

 

I like your world then.

[pretendastronaut]

I'm surprised again to find this thread still sitting on page 4 after a day like today.

 

"He got to two outs and was one pitch away," said Yost. "Then, Blum hit the three-run homer.

 

"A lot of times, in those situations, if you can get them through that, a veteran pitcher, the score was still 5-4, the way we've been scoring runs. We had two outs. You get him through that and a lot of times he'll settle in. His pitch count was still low enough where he could get you another inning or two.

 

"The problem came when he didn't get Blum out."

 

Ya, because facing a career .500+ Suppan hitter who had aleady nailed a shot over the wall, seemed like the good call in that situation.

 

Even TH was ripping into Yost in the game thread on the blog. You know its bad when TH is going to town on Yost.

 

I really hate these games where Yost almost seems to decide the game is out of our reach, so he'll just see how ugly it can get. Simply amazing.

[brewmann04]

Ned was on another planet today leaving Suppan in. He had a big hand in today losss.

[giffted1]

Ya, because facing a career .500+ Suppan hitter who had aleady nailed a shot over the wall, seemed like the good call in that situation.

You really think Yost should be looking at 24 ab samples?

[dvoiss]

You really think Yost should be looking at 24 ab samples?

No, Yost shouldn't have pulled him because the guy had hit well against him. He should of pulled him because he was very tired. He had been laboring for a while and clearly getting his pitches in the fat part of the zone. That coupled with the fact the guy had killed Suppan in those 24 at bats and had taken him deep in the 2nd were more than enough clues to make the move. Why keep him in? To save the bullpen for the Cubs? There is no logical reason to leave him in at that point. Ned screwed up. Simple as that.

 

 

(fixed code --1992)

[owbc]

Tired?

 

He's a veteran and he was at 70 pitches. He's pitched twice in the last 3 weeks.

 

When are the players going to be held accountable around here?

[DougJones43]

I love seeing Tom Haudricourt stick it to Yost, finally, after all these years. Looks like their strained relationship from the "Badger Blogger" incident may have been what it took to allow TH to start letting it all hang out...

 

I predicted to a colleague on the way down to the interview room that Yost would say he thought Suppan was one pitch away from getting out of the inning, and sure enough, that's what he said... Here's the problem with that logic: Blum just wears out Suppan. He entered the game batting .524 against him (11 for 21) for his career and already had socked a long home run off Suppan in the second inning... Hey, Suppan did retire the next hitter to get out of the innning, then pitched a scoreless sixth. Which reminds me of an old saying about closing the barn door AFTER the horse has gotten out.

[thablingster]

It was pretty amazing that they didn't even mound visit Suppan until the lead was gone. Ned stood there in the dugout gritting his teeth like he knew what was coming but he had no control over it.

 

Not to say Suppan gets a pass for pitching like a chump, but he was obviously laboring (or at least doing his best human rain delay impression) and his defense wasn't helping him at all. With that being the case and McClung being ready, it may have made more sense to get the guy with the strikeout potential in there. No fielding needed.

[danzig6767]

Tired?

 

He's a veteran and he was at 70 pitches. He's pitched twice in the last 3 weeks.

 

When are the players going to be held accountable around here?

 

 

What?

Plenty have questioned whether Suppan is the best option for a rotation spot, but the managers job during a game is to put the team in the best positions to win. I think 90% of people watching the game were yelling for Yost to get Suppan out of the game before the damage got out of hand, yet Ned sat there with his arms folded and a relief pitcher already warmed up and let Suppan get hammered until the game was out of hand.

It's not like the long relief pitchers were overused and we needing 7-8 innings from Suppan. McClung and Villanueva were rested, plus CC and Sheets are the two next schedules starters.

What was even the point of having McClung get warmed up that inning if Ned wasn't going to bring him in after Suppan was obviously fooling nobody and one more big hit off Jeff could blow the game wide open?

We very well could have lost anyways, but Ned leaving in Suppan until he allowed 7 friggin runs was baffling to say the least to nearly anybody watching the game.

 

[1992casey]

Besides Haudricourt, Brian A., Bill, Trenni, and the WTMJ loudmouth were all pretty much flabbergasted at the way that inning was handled. One batter to get out of the inning? What about what happened with the previous nine or so batters? There were a number of points where Suppan could have been lifted, and he should have been lifted at one of them.

[craigharmann]

I didn't watch the game, but I tried to follow along on the in-game chat and gameday, and I'm not surprised Ned said that Soup was one pitch away from getting out of it before Blum hit the homer. But what happened after that? Was it because he was one pitch away and then just couldn't do anymore after that? Ned can only get so much of the blame, because the players are out there to execute. Granted, in this game, there was a lack of execution, and Ned does deserve some blame. I get being a players' manager, but there's got to be accountability!

[sweepscc]

It's Bananas for Yost to get blame because he doesn't yank our highest paid player in the 5th. Soon people will start complaining about bullpen overuse. The only thing I can get on Yost for is not making Suppan go out there until at least the 7th no matter if it becomes 20-5 Astros. Suppan eventually needs to earn the ungodly amount of money Melvin handed him. And if Soup continually needs to be bailed out then obviously our GM shouldn't have put him on the roster.

[tigerbrew]

Got Yosted again today. If the Brewers don't make the playoffs this year, a huge amount of blame has to go to Yost.

[pretendastronaut]

It's Bananas for Yost to get blame because he doesn't yank our highest paid player in the 5th. Soon people will start complaining about bullpen overuse. The only thing I can get on Yost for is not making Suppan go out there until at least the 7th no matter if it becomes 20-5 Astros. Suppan eventually needs to earn the ungodly amount of money Melvin handed him. And if Soup continually needs to be bailed out then obviously our GM shouldn't have put him on the roster.

 

So the way he earns that money is just by innings pitched, regardless of outcome? He shouldn't be yanked because he's high paid? There is no water in your argument.

People always act like complaining about Yost is in leiu of any accountablity on the player themselves, which is ridiculous. Yes, Suppan was miserable today, but as was often noted with Turnbow, it is Yost's job to put the team and his players in the proper positions to succeed. I don't see how anyone can possibly excuse Ned for not taking Suppan out today. Amazing.

[giffted1]

Yost sacrificed Soup, and we start the Cubs series with a somewhat fresh bullpen. Not as crazy as some are making it out to be and certainly not a Yosting.

[bucks2281]

Sabathia and Sheets are pitching the next two games. Considering Sabathia has pitched three consecutive complete games, I'd have a fair amount of confidence that the bullpen won't be overworked tomorrow. Plus, Yost would have used McClung, who is well rested. Suppan was not pitching well enough at a critical juncture of the game -- the bleeding should have been stopped before the game got out of hand. Yes, Suppan hasn't come close to earning his salary, but it's Yost primary responsibility to put his players in the best position to win. A playoff berth will come down to a game or two -- we can't afford to lose games just because Jeff Suppan makes a lot of money, so therefore we can't pull him.

[Teatoe993]

Yost sacrificed Soup, and we start the Cubs series with a somewhat fresh bullpen. Not as crazy as some are making it out to be and certainly not a Yosting.

 

 

Dude. The Brewers were ahead 3 runs beginning that inning. By the end of that inning we were down 4 runs without any changes being made to stop the bleeding. How can that not be a Yosting?

 

And sweepscc. If you truly believe that Yost makes his decisions, or lack of decisions based on a players salary, how could you possibly support and defend that thought process?

[jeffy]

What was even the point of having McClung get warmed up that inning if Ned wasn't going to bring him in after Suppan was obviously fooling nobody and one more big hit off Jeff could blow the game wide open?

We very well could have lost anyways, but Ned leaving in Suppan until he allowed 7 friggin runs was baffling to say the least to nearly anybody watching the game.

 

 

That was the most baffling thing McClung was warmed up and ready to go, what exactly would have needed to happen for Yost to bring him in?

[fondybrewfan]

I am usually a Yost defender but that move was idiotic. So what if Suppan was "one pitch" from getting out of it, he proved that inning that that "one pitch" was not working out so well. Whats worse is how bad Suppan's numbers were against Blum. I almost guarantee Yost completely forgot that Blum kills Suppan, at least that is the only logical explanation to me. And for cripes sake we have CC and Sheets going the next 2 days, at most you'll need 5 inning out of the bullpen the next 2 days, use em up!!!!

[naivin]

Leaving Suppan in was definitely a head scratcher...While I can understand the reality that he really was a pitch away from getting out of the inning, and the bullpen had worked 4+ the previous night (I think), and he would obviously like to keep them fresh, the problem was there was no indication he was going to be able to make that one pitch.

 

Was this just a case of being willing to risk Suppan taking a pounding and losing the battle in the interest of winning the war? Possible, but it seems he just made a bad decision.

[FVBrewerFan]

Saving the bullpen may be a good explanation by Yost, but it doesn't make sense. They ended up using McClung and Shouse anyhow. So what's the difference if McClung pitches another inning or so? Blum is hitting over .500 against Suppan and took him deep earlier in the game, still waiting for a valid reason why you wouldn't have taken Suppan out at that point.

[bklynbrewcrew]

"Was Brewers manager Ned Yost asleep throughout the Astros' entire seven-run inning vs. Jeff Suppan on Sunday?" That is a direct quote from Jon Heymans si.com article.