The Combined 'We're Trading Greinke' Thread (part 3)

[PrinceEatMeat]

I read that the Rangers are looking at him, but would prefer Hamels or Greinke.

[TheCrew07]

All we can hope for is Greinke for Olt. That may be a big reach. Remember we got Sabathia for Laporta who wasn't even in the top 25. I know they got Brantley as well, which turned out pretty nicely for the Indians.

 

I would be pumped to get Olt straight up for Greinke.

 

LaPorta was in the top 25 at the time of the trade, he didn't fall out of the top 25 until after the 2008 season (came in at 27). He didn't hit very well in AA after the trade but he destroyed AAA in 2009 and spent enough time in the majors that he lost his prospect status but I bet he would have broken back into the top 25 had he not gotten enough MLB ABs.

 

I like where people are going targeting Olt, the only problem is that when has Melvin ever made a domino effect trade where he acquired a great young player via one trade and moved the existing MLB player to make room(or the reverse, trading the vet first)? He just plays "whack-a-mole" putting bodies into the holes in the MLB roster, I think he'll be looking to fill a specific hole on the MLB roster today.

 

Melvin has many positive qualities, but he's not playing chess setting up a domino effect which in the end makes the organization stronger, he's playing checkers and just patching whatever hole he sees from year to year.

[splitterpfj]

I don't think there's any question at all, the team wants to keep Greinke, not trade him. I don't know that it'll happen, but the fact that they went up to, and over 100M in their offer tells you this was not a PR move, this is a real attempt to keep this player.

 

There are several teams who are interested in Zack, and all of them want to see him pitch again, while Doug wants to exhaust all efforts to keep him right here.

 

The team knows what players they want from other organizations, and everyone in the world will be scouting Greinke tomorrow night...this decision could go right the wire either way.

 

Cue Ned Yost...."Patience, Grasshopper..."

[paul253]

Does anyone else have the feeling that Melvin is going to completely blow this?

[jjfanec]

Does anyone else have the feeling that Melvin is going to completely blow this?

 

Define "blow it". He wont get the imaginary trades that some on this board come up (the Hart for Matt Cain trade rumor comes to mind). However, I am afraid he will get a lower ceiling, close to the majors pitcher. I hope I am wrong. I remember being so underwhelmed about the Carlos Lee trade that I am fairly worried about the return here. I dont think he completely blows it but he does seem to go for the single instead of the home run when he sells.

[Kelbysdaddy]

doug seems like he has a better grasp of his job now then he did when he made the carlos lee trade. i'm just crossing my fingers that the phillies get hamels extended or they decide they'd have a better shot at resigning him if they dont trade him.

[dlk9s]

It just all depends on what the other teams are willing to give up. So many fans think DM is just a dummy who hasn't talked to any other GM's yet, thinks the Brewers still have a realistic shot at the playoffs, and will just ask for an average MLB-ready player or two for Greinke. While I obviously have no insight as to what goes on in the front office, I'll guarantee he diagrammed all sorts of scenarios weeks and weeks ago and has certainly decided it's time to trade Greinke if he won't re-sign. As for what he'll get for Greinke, who knows, but I'm sure he's going for the gold. Trading partners might only offer him silver or bronze, but he won't settle for that unless he has to.

[paul253]

Define "blow it"

 

You said it:

 

However, I am afraid he will get a lower ceiling, close to the majors pitcher

 

And the fact that he's asking for a first base prospect. We have Gamel. We have Morris. And first base is the easiest position to fill. Why waste valuable trade bait on a first baseman? He'll probably get like......Erving Santana and CJ Cron from the Angels. That's what I mean by blow it.

[berniebrewer4life]

He likely will reject it but I don't think thats the case yet.

 

Why doesn't Melvin put a drop-dead date on offers? Why hamstring the franchise while waiting for a player to make up his mind?

 

With the Cub rumors flying around, I'd tell Greinke we need to know what he's going to do right now, and then I'd start making calls to other teams. If he's traded before he gives you an answer, too bad.

 

 

With all due respect, how do we know he hasn't? Just because he hasn't said it to the media, doesn't mean he hasn't said so to Greinke behind closed doors. Doug has never been the kind of person to show his hand to the media.

[splitterpfj]

Contract talks are off at this point, it'll be a trade if there's a good enough offer, otherwise the team will decide whether to simply plan on taking the draft pick, or trying to sign Greinke again as a free agent.

 

This next start by Greinke may be given more importance than it's worth by some teams, but there's no getting around it right now...it MATTERS.

 

http://host.madison.com/sports/baseball/professional/brewers-melvin-says-busy-week-coming-up/article_dc38594e-d512-11e1-a1e9-001a4bcf887a.html

[splitterpfj]

If Zack appears to be healthy tomorrow, he's gone. All it will take is an offer that brings more value than a single draft pick...with a talent like Greinke, there's no way the draft pick is going to be the best return on the table.

 

If you want to read the details, the link is in the Greinke thread in the major league forum, but Melvin confirmed tonight that talks to re-sign Greinke are off at this point.

[dlk9s]

Next I expect to hear some anonymous GM spin it by saying that Greinke is too mentally unstable to handle in-season contract discussions, so teams won't want to give up any top prospects for him.

[slappzilla]

Gotta hope Zack throws a good game tonight. If he throws another stinker teams are going to hesitate.

[slappzilla]

Contract talks are off at this point, it'll be a trade if there's a good enough offer, otherwise the team will decide whether to simply plan on taking the draft pick, or trying to sign Greinke again as a free agent.

That will suck (the bolded), especially because of the new rules.

 

Please pitch good tonight Zack. We need a solid return!

 

For those of you holding out hope that he signs with the Brewers, I'm sorry, but if he turned down the 5yr $112M deal, he's not coming back.

[Invader3K]

For those of you holding out hope that he signs with the Brewers, I'm sorry, but if he turned down the 5yr $112M deal, he's not coming back.

 

Exactly. We saw how things played out with Sabathia and Fielder. Clinging to naive hope at this point is foolish.

[Eye Black]

He'll probably get like......Erving Santana and CJ Cron from the Angels. That's what I mean by blow it.

I understand there is a good possibility of being underwhelmed by the return for Grienke, but it isn't going to be Ervin Santana. He is owed $13 million next season with a $1 million buyout.

 

I really hope Zack pitches well. As long as he shows he is healthy tonight I am confident they will at least get more return than the value of one supplemental round draft pick (which admittedly isn't a very high bar). I really like the guys the Tigers gave up for Sanchez and Infante, and hope the Brewers can get something along those lines.

[jjfanec]

Define "blow it"

 

You said it:

 

However, I am afraid he will get a lower ceiling, close to the majors pitcher

 

And the fact that he's asking for a first base prospect. We have Gamel. We have Morris. And first base is the easiest position to fill. Why waste valuable trade bait on a first baseman? He'll probably get like......Erving Santana and CJ Cron from the Angels. That's what I mean by blow it.

 

Well if he does that I agree he blew it big time. By lower ceiling close to the majors guy, I meant a guy who projects as a 3 starter and is under the teams control for a while. Not a guy with one year left and who is having a horrible year.

[Invader3K]

The trades so far show that teams are giving up pretty good prospect value for rentals, so I think we'll do OK as long as Greinke has a semi-decent outing tonight.

 

Rosenthal had a commment today that the Nationals are also interested. Sounds like half the league may be scouting him tonight.

[paul253]

Texas' Colby Lewis is now out for the season. Hopefully this increases their interest in Greinke.

[JohnBriggs12]

Wasn't Fiers a "lower ceiling" close to the majors pitcher? Starting pitching inventory that's "close to the majors" is gold. Smart GM's are thinking one or two moves ahead. Going to the winter meetings with a stockpile of major league ready arms will make you very popular. Ceilings are in the eyes of the beholder.

[Funketown]

Here's the difference between CC, Prince, and Greinke: I wanted CC and Prince at 5 years/100 million. I don't want Greinke at anything over 5 years/100 million or so.

 

Just trade him to a contender and get over with it. There has to be a team willing to part with a couple of solid chips for three months of Greinke and a WS run. Texas, I'm looking at you!

[fondybrewfan]

If Grienke pitches well tonight I don't think he is on the team on Saturday. It might take a couple of days to drive the price up but I definitely think there are a lot of suitors and Doug will eventually get a pretty solid package. Doug is so secretive about trades/FA/etc that it is virtually impossible to get a good read on the guy. I am sure he is keeping his options open and will take the best package available. However I imagine he would have no interest in a bunch of high level A prospects; I think he is shooting for AA or higher.

[jjfanec]

If Grienke pitches well tonight I don't think he is on the team on Saturday. It might take a couple of days to drive the price up but I definitely think there are a lot of suitors and Doug will eventually get a pretty solid package. Doug is so secretive about trades/FA/etc that it is virtually impossible to get a good read on the guy. I am sure he is keeping his options open and will take the best package available. However I imagine he would have no interest in a bunch of high level A prospects; I think he is shooting for AA or higher.

 

I agree. I think the players we get in return here will be AA ball at the lowest but likely AAA or recently called up guys. Doug is not going to do a complete rebuild here. I feel as though some on this board think Doug is a big dummy who has no idea what he is doing so they have braced themselves for a terrible trade. I am more in the middle on Doug so I am expecting a good return but one that some on this board will just hate. I am afraid if we dont get Olt some on this board will consider it a failure

[JohnBriggs12]

Here's the difference between CC, Prince, and Greinke: I wanted CC and Prince at 5 years/100 million. I don't want Greinke at anything over 5 years/100 million or so.

 

Just trade him to a contender and get over with it. There has to be a team willing to part with a couple of solid chips for three months of Greinke and a WS run. Texas, I'm looking at you!

 

 

Couldn't agree more Funketown. It's a blessing he turned down the offer. Can't believe they offered him more than they (publically) offered Fielder and Sabathia though. Greinke doesn't belong in the same breath as either of those two.

[JosephC]

Olt is the only "high-end" prospect that I think the Brewers could possibly get in the Greinke deal. And when I say "high-end," I'm talking about the top 30 (roughly) on Baseball America's latest top 50 prospects list. The Ranger's system is just so loaded they could afford to give up someone like Olt for a 2 month rental and Greinke should be a pretty big help to them. But for other guys like Machado from the Orioles, I just can't see a deal like that happening. I'd love to get Olt. He might have some problems with big league off-speed pitches, but even if he does I think he'll be an average OBP, good power offensive player and it sounds like his defense should be really good. That being said, I don't see Melvin making a straight-up deal for Olt because he'll be looking for pitching that can help in 2013 before anything else. But we'll see, if Melvin is unimpressed by the pitching offers then he'll have to go in a different direction, and if that's the case Olt could be the biggest prize he can land.

 

Martin Perez is really interesting and I'd love to know what Melvin thinks of him. Super high upside, but frankly the stat sheet has not been impressive at all once he got past A-ball. I'd sure be extremely interested in him, but would Melvin have enough confidence that Perez could hold onto a major league rotation spot in 2013 (even though he is in the majors right now)?