The Combined 'We're Trading Greinke' Thread (part 4)

[slappzilla]

The last two posts should be in blue as well.

 

If any of you truly think Greinke will sign with Milwaukee in the offseason, I have a bridge to sell you.

[Brewers ST920]

Cliff Lee had no signs of even wanting to go back, and possibly even getting more money elsewhere, yet he went back to the Phillies. Not sure why it isn't looked at as being possible.

[slappzilla]

Are you really comparing the two situations?

 

Phillies = WS contender (at the time) and big money market. The offer the Yankees made to Lee did end up being less than what the Phillies gave him when it was all said and done as well.

 

Brewers = not a WS contender, not a big money team.

[afeter]

holy mother me too. that sheep rubs me the right way. i can't stop watching it. I laugh every time

[dlk9s]

I don't think anyone truly thinks Greinke will come back to the Brewers. People are just having fun with hopeful scenarios.

[chuckiehacks]

It's not like anyone declared it "a lock."

 

I agree it's a long shot, even if Greinke wanted to come back, the players' union strongly discourages players from signing anywhere but the highest offer, which I'm sure the Brewers wouldn't have.

[JackNicholson1974]

I know we are all spoiled internet junkies, but please, let this deal happen so I can stop wasting my time checking this board, twitter and mlbtraderumors constantly.

[SRB]

the players' union strongly discourages players from signing anywhere but the highest offer

I doubt that's true.

 

But yeah, Greinke re-signing is a longshot. Who knows though, Yankees/Phillies/Red Sox likely won't be bidding.

[fondybrewfan]

The Crew has just as good of odds of signing Grienke as any other team. Offer the most money and he'll come back. Obviously the odds of the Brewers offering the most money are not very good. There won't be any discount to come back to the Brewers thats for sure. This is an opportunity that comes along once in a lifetime for a pitcher; can't blame him for seeking other opportunities. Honestly he seems to like the management side of baseball and probably is really curious to go through the process with teams. I wouldn't be suprised if Grienke comes back; but I am certainly not counting on it. The market would have to be seriously depressed this offseason to bring Grienke down to the level MIL can pay.

[slappzilla]

"I wouldn't be suprised if Grienke comes back"

 

 

I cannot, I don't even, I...

 

GREINKE WILL NOT BE BACK IN MILWAUKEE GUYZ

 

Seriously, I don't know if you guys are being sarcastic or not. I'm hoping you are.

 

There is as much chance of Greinke resigning with the Brewers as there is Lebron James asking to be traded to the Bucks.

[chuckiehacks]

the players' union strongly discourages players from signing anywhere but the highest offer

I doubt that's true.

 

 

It's been true in the past. I've dug up the quote and story from when ARod signed in Texas. He specifically said he preferred Atlanta, but was strongly encouraged to take the Texas offer. There was a very good article about this, the union feels that "a rising tide lifts all boats." Not saying it couldn't happen, but when was the last time a player took a home-town discount? Everyone made a big deal about Cliff Lee turning down the Yankees, but once the details of the contract came out, it was determined that Philly's offer was higher anyway.

[jmeks23]

"I wouldn't be suprised if Grienke comes back"

 

 

I cannot, I don't even, I...

 

GREINKE WILL NOT BE BACK IN MILWAUKEE GUYZ

 

Seriously, I don't know if you guys are being sarcastic or not. I'm hoping you are.

 

There is as much chance of Greinke resigning with the Brewers as there is Lebron James asking to be traded to the Bucks.

 

 

And that's a lock guys

[ninja33]

I'm certainly not expecting it, but I think it is within the realm of possibility. Assuming that 5 year/$112M offer was true, Greinke knows where the Brewers stand. There's a very good chance someone blows it out of the water in FA (Hamels type deal, something for 6 years) and it's a moot point. But if the best offer comes out in the $120-125M range, maybe Greinke decides he really does love Milwaukee. It's hard to make that decision before you see all of your options. I doubt he would do that, but I don't think it's impossible.

 

And I don't think wanting to play for a winner will have anything to do with it. Greinke almost went to a world series with the Brewers. In order to be a world series contender, you merely need to be a playoff contender....once you're in it's a whole new season (see: the stupid cardinals of the past decade). This team isn't THAT different than last years, except the bullpen has turned into a dumpster fire. More often than not bullpens are a crapshoot from year to year. I don't agree with the "it cost us the season" mentality, because there are some other flaws (most teams have them)....but with an average bullpen I do think the team is around .500 and close to a wildcard. We can disagree about what the wildcard means now....but either way Greinke has seen success in Milwaukee and knows that Melvin and Attanasio are going to do what it takes (or attempt to) to make the team a winner. Their approach is a whole other argument that comes up in every thread ever, so that's not the point. But the Brewers are a team with major league talent that has seen success....Greinke wouldn't be coming into some rebuilding project after he got 9 figures.

 

All of that said, I fully expect Zack to get $140Mish somewhere, and will not hold it against him at all when he goes there. I just hope the return we get for him (I'm thinking it happens today) is as good as it should be.

[SRB]

It's been true in the past. I've dug up the quote and story from when ARod signed in Texas. He specifically said he preferred Atlanta, but was strongly encouraged to take the Texas offer. There was a very good article about this, the union feels that "a rising tide lifts all boats." Not saying it couldn't happen, but when was the last time a player took a home-town discount? Everyone made a big deal about Cliff Lee turning down the Yankees, but once the details of the contract came out, it was determined that Philly's offer was higher anyway.

That's because players like $$$

 

Union is used as a scapegoat by fans (and players apparently). Like they are calling up the player and telling him which offer to take? I really doubt it.

[ninja33]

"I wouldn't be suprised if Grienke comes back"

 

 

I cannot, I don't even, I...

 

GREINKE WILL NOT BE BACK IN MILWAUKEE GUYZ

 

Seriously, I don't know if you guys are being sarcastic or not. I'm hoping you are.

 

There is as much chance of Greinke resigning with the Brewers as there is Lebron James asking to be traded to the Bucks.

 

 

And that's a lock guys

 

i get it.

[fondybrewfan]

So you just felt like qouting one part of my post without reading the rest? Nice.

 

If the Brewers put a competitive offer (basically equal to other offers) out there than I wouldn't be suprised if he comes back; but like I said the odds of the Brewers having a competitive offer aren't very good.

[slappzilla]

1) The Brewers can't make a competitive offer. They do not have the payroll to devote almost a 3rd of their payroll to one person.

 

2) In his last two interviews regarding where Zack would like to go, all Zack said was he wanted to win. He even said he didn't care how he pitched, as long as the team wins. The Brewers look nothing like contenders in the near future. Even with Zack back, it's arguable.

 

Greinke is going to go to a big money contender. He'll get something comparable to Hamels, maybe even more (as ridiculous as it sounds) because he'll hit the FA waters, unlike Hamels.

[fondybrewfan]

1) Any contract for Grienke would be no where near 1/3rd of the payroll unless you think Grienke is going to get $27 Million a year

 

2) And how do we know the Brewers won't be competitve next year? It is July of 2012.

[Brewers ST920]

Slappzilla, no one is saying "Greinke will be back, I guarantee it". There are reasons out there that give some of us fans the indication it may be possible.

 

Your above comparison with Lebron James makes it sound like there is -550% chance of it happening. Do I necessarily think he will come back? No. Do I think he will be interested in the idea? Absolutely. For all we know this could be Greinke's fun little game to see how things run.

[StearnsFTW]

"I wouldn't be suprised if Grienke comes back"

 

 

I cannot, I don't even, I...

 

GREINKE WILL NOT BE BACK IN MILWAUKEE GUYZ

 

Seriously, I don't know if you guys are being sarcastic or not. I'm hoping you are.

 

There is as much chance of Greinke resigning with the Brewers as there is Lebron James asking to be traded to the Bucks.

 

I nominate this post for crazy rant of the year.

 

Bravo.

 

FTR, I don't think it'll happen either, but I certainly think it's possible. Very unlikely, but possible.

[monty57]

It's been true in the past. I've dug up the quote and story from when ARod signed in Texas. He specifically said he preferred Atlanta, but was strongly encouraged to take the Texas offer. There was a very good article about this, the union feels that "a rising tide lifts all boats." Not saying it couldn't happen, but when was the last time a player took a home-town discount? Everyone made a big deal about Cliff Lee turning down the Yankees, but once the details of the contract came out, it was determined that Philly's offer was higher anyway.

That's because players like $$$

 

Union is used as a scapegoat by fans (and players apparently). Like they are calling up the player and telling him which offer to take? I really doubt it.

 

It's been pretty widely noted that the union puts pressure on the top free agents every year to take the biggest deal. That sets the market so all the other free agents can get more than they would have if the top free agent took a lower money deal. Seems pretty logical as many deals in baseball, whether we're talking contracts, trade value, arbitration, or whatever, are based on precedence. If Greinke signs for "X," the next best free agent will probably get less than "X." If Greinke gets "2X," the next best free agent will get more than "X."

 

The union gets a percentage of the wages of every player, so they have a vested interest in making sure the players get every dollar possible.

[slappzilla]

There is -550% chance of it happening

 

Brewers payroll will be around $80M next year (2013), by season's end (2013) probably $87-$90M assuming they add pieces as the season goes. Doug said the $96M payroll this year is way over budget and was not intended (KRod accepting arb, panic signing or Aramis cause thought was Braun was missing 50 games, etc).

 

Can you tell me why Zack would be interested in playing for the Brewers vs. a contending big money team? I'd really love to hear it...

[ninja33]

1) The Brewers can't make a competitive offer. They do not have the payroll to devote almost a 3rd of their payroll to one person.

 

2) In his last two interviews regarding where Zack would like to go, all Zack said was he wanted to win. He even said he didn't care how he pitched, as long as the team wins. The Brewers look nothing like contenders in the near future. Even with Zack back, it's arguable.

 

Greinke is going to go to a big money contender. He'll get something comparable to Hamels, maybe even more (as ridiculous as it sounds) because he'll hit the FA waters, unlike Hamels.

 

why don't the brewers look anything like contenders in the near future? They have a lot of the same talent they won the division with last year (sans prince, and the offense hasn't tailed off very much) IF, a very big if, Greinke came back. It's not like it's unheard of for a team to win something like 77 games and come back the next year and win the division. I swear it happened recently......

[ninja33]

I mean, you're the guy who said the bullpen "single handedly cost the team the season", which implied with a league average bullpen the brewers would be winning the division (i believe those are your words in there). Bullpens can be a crapshoot, and are also not that difficult or expensive to fix in the offseason. so why can't they be contenders with Greinke back?

 

Again, I don't expect him back. But saying it's because the Brewers can't be contenders is something I disagree with.

[slappzilla]

Why don't the brewers look anything like contenders in the near future?

 

Because there's 2 other teams in the division that look better, and 6 other teams in the NL that look better.