2008 Vent Thread (part 4)

[Brew Guzzler]

There is some logic behind putting Craig Counsell at 3B. Our entire lineup is full of hitters who strike out or crush the ball. Utility CC adds some versaitility to our line-up and creates some disruptions in the six hole. He isn't going to produce high stats, but he will battle; which is something the Brewers have been lacking this season. They haven't had anybody up there, except Prince who will battle a pitcher. Nost probably is playing for a few more hit & runs/run & hit's for his random hitter of the week.

[danzig6767]

There is some logic behind putting Craig Counsell at 3B. Our entire lineup is full of hitters who strike out or crush the ball. Utility CC adds some versaitility to our line-up and creates some disruptions in the six hole. He isn't going to produce high stats, but he will battle; which is something the Brewers have been lacking this season. They haven't had anybody up there, except Prince who will battle a pitcher. Nost probably is playing for a few more hit & runs/run & hit's for his random hitter of the week.

What exactly does it mean for a hitter to "battle" at the plate?

 

Yea i can give him credit for taking pitches and managing to amazingly coax a good number of walks from pitchers even though he has absolutely zero power and carries a terrible batting average. In the end though, he still makes a ton of outs and carries a lower OBP than Branyan. Russell obviously adds the dimension of being able to hit more than weak singles or walks given his vastly superior power. Being able to make more contact means very little to me if he gets on base less than Branyan and has vastly less power. The stats don't lie, .628 OPS vs a .928 OPS, that's a vast gulf.

Counsell does bring better defense, i won't deny that, he's a fabulous defensive player. My issue is he comes to the plate to often with runners on base by batting 6th and the end result is to often an out, or at best a weak single or walk. Branyan simply is a much better and more productive hitter, regardless of the battleness levels people want to put on hitters.

 

[Fatter than Joey]

Here's my vent. Yesterday we're told that we shouldn't have Counsell starting discussions in the IGT, now the 3B thread is locked. So what are we supposed to do now? Ridiculous that that thread was locked.

 

I agree -- Counsell continuing to get starts is a topic worth discussing. Anyone that wants to talk about it can do so here.

[rluzinski]

There is some logic behind putting Craig Counsell at 3B. Our entire lineup is full of hitters who strike out or crush the ball. Utility CC adds some versaitility to our line-up and creates some disruptions in the six hole. He isn't going to produce high stats, but he will battle; which is something the Brewers have been lacking this season. They haven't had anybody up there, except Prince who will battle a pitcher. Nost probably is playing for a few more hit & runs/run & hit's for his random hitter of the week.

 

I'm sure that this is exactly the kind of thinking Yost is using to justify all these starts but it just doesn't make much sense to me. 99% of a batters job is to get on base and hit for power. If you have a batter who stinks at both of those things but excels at the 1%, he still has practically no offensive value. Replacement level hitter.

[lcbj68c]

It's getting to the point now where I am just assuming Branyan or Hall have some undisclosed injury, because if they don't, than Yost really has lost it to a degree.

Very Nice assumption. Rants involving Counsell can now resume normal levels. LOL

[Gobias Industries]

Very Nice assumption. Rants involving Counsell can now resume normal levels. LOL

I thought the same thing.........last week. Branyan hasn't been getting starts since Mid-July and supposedly he tweaked it last night. I wouldn't be surprised if he has made his last start as a Brewer.

[MadisonBrewerBlue]

a vent thread for a team 18 games over .500, hasnt been in the playoffs since 1982, seems somewhat ridiculous complaining about something and everything just for the sake of it

[1992casey]

Messages discussing Haudricourt's recent blog comments have been moved to a new thread:

 

Haudricourt condescension toward blog participants

[TooLiveBrew]

a vent thread for a team 18 games over .500, hasnt been in the playoffs since 1982, seems somewhat ridiculous complaining about something and everything just for the sake of it

 

Pretty amazing that, in one day, it got up to 89 pages, huh?

[2008 world champs]

I can't stand people that complain. I am going to write a complaint to the local paper about how much i hate it when people complain....http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/tongue.gif

 

 

[rluzinski]

a vent thread for a team 18 games over .500, hasnt been in the playoffs since 1982, seems somewhat ridiculous complaining about something and everything just for the sake of it

 

I think it's just as ridiculous when people have to frantically look for a scapegoat after the Brewers lose, as if a team just can't be outplayed on a given day.

 

Pretending that everything is 100% perfect when they win or 100% junk when they lose just doesn't make much sense to me. When I vent, it's a about a situation I am unhappy with and it's independent of whether they won or lost.

[DougJones43]

a vent thread for a team 18 games over .500, hasnt been in the playoffs since 1982, seems somewhat ridiculous complaining about something and everything just for the sake of it

 

I think it's just as ridiculous when people have to frantically look for a scapegoat after the Brewers lose, as if a team just can't be outplayed on a given day.

 

Pretending that everything is 100% perfect when they win or 100% junk when they lose just doesn't make much sense to me. When I vent, it's a about a situation I am unhappy with and it's independent of whether they won or lost.

The even bigger thing is the consequences it could have moving forward. Just because (to this point) the team has won in spite of Counsell starting at 3B and batting 6th, doesn't make it a good decision. And it also shouldn't shield it from criticism, whatsoever.

 

What if Counsell continues to play there all year, and his terrible hitting causes the team to lose 1 or 2 extra games? That could be the difference between playoffs and no playoffs. What if the Brewers actually make the playoffs, and our ridiculous manager decides that justifies continuing to play him? A dropoff of 300 potential OPS points from your #6 hole could have huge ramifications in a 5 or 7 game series.

 

There's so much to consider - so much more than "well, we've been winning with Counsell for like 9 days, so just shut up about it and everything will continue to be great you dirty rotten complainer!"

[moofnelson]

a vent thread for a team 18 games over .500, hasnt been in the playoffs since 1982, seems somewhat ridiculous complaining about something and everything just for the sake of it

So, if the Brewers play their worst baseball ever in the next five games and Yost makes some of the stupidest moves in his managerial career, will you make this post: "The Brewers are 13 games over .500 and haven't been in the playoffs since 1982, seem somewhat ridiculous..."

 

Once again, my vent is against those that criticize others for using the vent thread. It's getting old.

[strawbossisevil]

So if I understand this correctly, people can vent about people venting about people venting in the vent thread. Where as, venting about people venting should not be included. I thought all vents could be included here.

 

Consider this my vent about people venting about people venting about people venting in the vent thread.

[Invader3K]

My vent is that the Cubs won both their games yesterday, so we weren't able to gain any ground at all on their division lead. This was despite Soriano totally hot dogging it on a hit that bounced off the wall and only got a single out of it. Go back and watch that one the next time someone complains about Fielder or Braun pausing for half a second out of the box.

[fondybrewfan]

Soriano was just awful yesterday and I was happy BBTN really ripped into him. That was just awful. I would hope if one of our guys did that that Ned would sit his butt on the bench. We all thought Braun might have hot dogged that would in St Louis but Soriano was 10x worse and his didn't make it out. That exact scenario is what most people were complaining about in the Braun episode. If Braun's ball didn't get out he would have looked just as foolish as Soriano, although Braun was running a little harder he probably would have still made it to 2nd.

[Postseason2006]

Not only did it bounce OFF the wall but the base of it.

 

He is a turd like 3/4 of the team counting Dumpster, Shambrano, and Turd Lee.

[jhart05]

Didn't know where else to put this...

 

I think I have a theory for the "Counsell starting at 3B" deal.

 

The pitching has been more than stellar in August. Team ERA is under 2.00 and team WHIP is under 1.00.

 

They just want Counsell's defense in the game and don't care about his offense right now.

 

As far as why he's batting 6th, besides the sarcastic "because he's playing 3B" reasoning...Cameron seems to be comfortable in the 7 spot and Kendall in the 8 spot, why mess with that?

[tysoncbulls423]

Not only did it bounce OFF the wall but the base of it.

 

He is a turd like 3/4 of the team counting Dumpster, Shambrano, and Turd Lee.

Those are some outstanding nicknames. Where did you come up with them?

[OOOverbay]

Not only did it bounce OFF the wall but the base of it.

 

He is a turd like 3/4 of the team counting Dumpster, Shambrano, and Turd Lee.

Those are some outstanding nicknames. Where did you come up with them?

I started cracking up when I read that. I'm going to have to agree with the Cubs fan here... we can be more witty than that.

 

[TooLiveBrew]

Not in the vent thread we can't. Take rational brain functions elsewhere! http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[moofnelson]

Tough loss today. Just once I'd like to see Yost pinch hit for Kendall in the 9th with the team trailing. That soft fly ball to right center wasn't predictable, was it?

[bigredrobbo]

Not only did it bounce OFF the wall but the base of it.

 

He is a turd like 3/4 of the team counting Dumpster, Shambrano, and Turd Lee.

Those are some outstanding nicknames. Where did you come up with them?

I started cracking up when I read that. I'm going to have to agree with the Cubs fan here... we can be more witty than that.

 

 

Really? Over at NSBB, Fielder is "Fatty".

 

Ours are like Oscar Wilde compared to that!

[homer]

Turd Lee......I mean that's comic gold!

 

Wait, that's not a vent. Never mind.

[OOOverbay]

And now I'll agree with a Brewer's fan (moof)... I was thinking the same thing... "this would be a great time to pinch hit for Kendall." I thought he should have started the game anyway, but I suppose that would have made too much sense.