2008 Vent Thread (part 5)

[Invader3K]

Yeah, I really didn't get the thinking. I guess Yost probably checked with CC and he said he was fine to go one more inning, but why not just use someone like Mota to mop up the 9th with such a big lead? I don't get it.

[jason21nl]

add me to the list of people that thought it was moronic to let CC go the whole way, add in the fact that Braun was obviously not 100% healthy and was playing and I have even more fuel to hate Yost.

[brewcrew00]

There's the first Ned is responsible for Braun's injury, faster than I thought.

 

They have trainers, by the way.

[jason21nl]

Who puts the player in the lineup? We all could see Brauns swing wasn't right. So yeah if he aggravated his injury because he came back too soon, thats all on your boy Ned.

[brewcrew00]

We have had this whole argument before with Yo's injury. Obviously Ned was given the OK from the training/medical staff for Braun to play, or he wouldn't have been out there. The medical professionals are there for a reason, if you are not going to trust what they have to say, what's the point of keeping them around?

 

Funny how none of this was mentioned after Sunday's home run...

[jason21nl]

I'm sorry, you can tell when a player is "right" or not. Everyone can see that Brauns swing wasn't right. Ned being the smartest man alive should be able to see that. Even with the season they are having, Ned is still a horrible manager.

[brewcrew00]

Nice jab at Ned after avoiding my entire point about having a medical staff.

 

Add that to my vent, "Ned's horrible/an idiot" is not sound argument.

[MJLiverock]

Players know nothing of how they feel, managers are idiots for asking how a player feels and listening too him, trainers don't know anything.

 

But a bungch of guys who get winded running to the fridge for a beer between pitches are the almighty expert on how tired, injured, or the mental state of every player the see on TV.

[brewcrew00]

MJ, thank you.

[jason21nl]

Who knows what the trainers said or didn't say. They probably asked Braun if he was good to go, and Braun probably told him that he was. I'm not a trainer, but I, some dude sitting on the couch could see Braun wasn't swinging right. You would think Ned could see that. Maybe he was getting coffee during Brauns ABs.

 

The trainers can give the OK on a guy, but the manager has to use better judgment. And with injuries, I will never trust Ned.

[jhart05]

So what would the attitude around here be like if Yost did take Sabathia out after the 7th inning and they end up loosing that game last night?

 

He brings in Mota and Gagne because they are in a "mop-up" situation. Remember this is Houston, a pretty good hitting team, this isn't the Nationals.

And let's say they proceed to give up 3-run HR's to loose the game? Because we've all seen the bullpen puke up leads. Heck even Villanueva isn't a sure thing right now.

 

What are you all saying then?

 

No, you don't want to see Sabathia go 130 every game, but he does have an extra day of rest before his next start, and two extra days off before his start after that. Calm down everyone, it's not that big of a deal. He'll be fine.

[brewcrew00]

Just to be clear, Ned and all managers for that matter, shouldn't trust their medical staffs, but rather make their own decisions based on what a player looks like to them, AND seeing as this wasn't an issue with Braun until last night, Ned made the right decision on Sunday, and the wrong decision on Monday?

 

I'll never understand I guess...

[bklynbrewcrew]

There is no reason whatsoever to abuse Sabathias arm like that. He should not be throwing 130 pitches in a blowout. If the bullpen cant hold onto a 6 run lead in the eighth and ninth inning then we arent a playoff team. Ned is definitely becoming another Dusty Baker with his handling of the pitching staff and its just one more reason to hate him. This team has to win despite the inept job that Yost does and it will be a shame if we miss out on the playoffs because of his dopey decisions.

[sheethead]

Why risk injury of any kind (fatigue related or not) to your stud pitcher with 2 innings of garbage time? If our bullpen cannot close out a win for 2 innings with a 6 run lead, we have problems. I would trust Mota/Gagne to get that job done.

[Fatter than Joey]

So what would the attitude around here be like if Yost did take Sabathia out after the 7th inning and they end up loosing that game last night? He brings in Mota and Gagne because they are in a "mop-up" situation.

 

I know my attitude is that Mota & Gagne should not be on a MLB roster if the 2 of them can't help whoring up 7 runs in an inning.

 

If CC was pulled and Mota+Gagne gave up 7 runs, I'd would have understood Yost, but would have blamed DM for the clowns in the BP.

[Fatter than Joey]

Obviously Ned was given the OK from the training/medical staff for Braun to play, or he wouldn't have been out there.

 

This is not obvious. For all we know trainers told Ned that Braun could aggravate his injury, and Ned told them to go sit on the couch.

[Invader3K]

Come on...I really doubt Yost would go against the trainers' advice, in such a way as you are posturing right now.

 

Yost has a lot of faults as a manager, but I doubt he is actively trying to jeopardize the health of any of his players.

[Fatter than Joey]

Come on...I really doubt Yost would go against the trainers' advice, in such a way as you are posturing right now.

 

I'm not saying he did -- only it is "far from obvious" what input the trainers had into last night's decision.

 

I doubt he is actively trying to jeopardize the health of any of his players.

 

I doubt this as well.... maybe... sort of.

[brewcrew00]

My curiousity from the whole Braun thing, is where was ANY of this on Sunday as he was hitting a game tying home run? Nobody seemed to mind him being back then, now that he may have tweaked something, it's an issue, and Ned is an idiot.

[TooLiveBrew]

It's because he didn't re-aggravate his injury, bc. The idea that people have just been waiting in the weeds here to jump on Yost asap is a bit far-fetched.

[brewcrew00]

I'm not saying they've been waiting in the weeds, but how in the world is it remotely Ned's fault for Braun re-aggravating his injury? Point is, it's not. With the opinions of the medical staff, Braun himself, coupled with the fact Braun is the best offensvie player, there's no reason he shouldn't have been in the lineup yesterday.

[olliegjw]

What if it were released that the medical staff had cleared Braun to play, but Yost kept him on the bench anyways? And the reason for the benching was "it just does not look right when he swings". This board would be in an uproar, and ask for Yost's firing on the spot. Oh wait, that happens anyways. Guess the guy just can't win.

[olliegjw]

There is no reason whatsoever to abuse Sabathias arm like that. He should not be throwing 130 pitches in a blowout. If the bullpen cant hold onto a 6 run lead in the eighth and ninth inning then we arent a playoff team. Ned is definitely becoming another Dusty Baker with his handling of the pitching staff and its just one more reason to hate him. This team has to win despite the inept job that Yost does and it will be a shame if we miss out on the playoffs because of his dopey decisions.

There is a big difference between Baker running first and second year young studs out for that many pitches consistently versus Yost having an 8 year veteran throw 130 pitches in one start. Not to mention, Wood, Prior, et al got injured in the year's after Baker abused them, not in the 1st or 2nd year. CC won't be on the team next year, so I have no problem stretching him out a bit, especially with extra days off coming up.

[bklynbrewcrew]

What exactly does it accomplish to have him throw 130 pitches? Is the bullpen overworked or incapable of holding a 7 run lead in the last two innings? Letting Sabathia throw 130 pitches has lots of downside and absolutely no upside whatsoever. If the score was 2-1 I can see taking the chance but a 9-2 game is no time to be taking chances with Sabathia.

[LordBeerMeStrength]

If you don't trust your bullpen to get 6 outs with a 6/7 run lead then you should stop thinking about the playoffs.