2008 Vent Thread (part 5)

[Jay Zahn]

Did Ned answer why he took Braun out after hitting his homer? We have maybe one of the two best players in baseball and we replace him? There is no strategy that makes this a good move. Double switching? Come on! Take out any of the other seven but not your best player. Or better yet, don't even worry/do a double switch.

Once the decision was made to go to Villanueva (Torres may not have been available), he wanted the chance to get multiple innings out of him. Pitcher's spot was up 5th, which easily could have come up in the 10th and would in the 11th. If Braun's spot comes up in the 10th, you've already scored at least 2 runs. If it comes up in the 11th, you've already shut down the Dodgers in the 9th and 10th (which didn't happen anyway making it a moot point.) Kapler is a respectable hitter anyway; the difference between him and Braun for 1 AB is not catastrophic. Villanueva not making the pitches is what mattered, which shows you how much impact most moves have on a game anyway...

[rluzinski]

Considering what the 'Stros and Rockies have done to get to the postseason, not even mentioning why the Phils found themselves in the playoffs last year, it would seem no lead is safe in baseball.

 

Until a team is physically eliminated, they always have a chance. Take enough teams with a 1% chance at the playoffs and they will make it... about 1% of the time. That fact does not improve the Astros odds one bit.

[thunderbat30]

I think this is only my second vent ever but not giving Mike Rivera any starts (even after he pretty much won the game his last start) is absolutely crazy. There is no explanation the Brewers can give. Rivera is not a great defender but he's not Estrada back there.

[brewcrew00]

FSN is complete crappy garbage.

[TooLiveBrew]

The handling of CC Sabathia was very unwise tonight. The highest PC of his entire career according to BA during the broadcast.

 

I just hope we don't see any ill-effects in his next start(s).

[fondybrewfan]

There was no good reason to bring CC back in the 9th. I am not sure what Ned was thinking. The game wasn't in doubt, CC had to bat in the 8th, and he had 110 pitches after 8. The only reason Ned brought him back was so he could get another complete game and that is just stupid

[BrewCrewForever]

Poor pitching management by Yost tonight. Just dumb to have CC throwing that many pitches in a blowout.

[southpaw121505]

Ditto on abusing CC, count me in the bunch that would like to see him have some left for his next start, and the one after that and the one.....etc

[Hate those Rodents]

But it's pretty cool to keep CC getting complete games and a great way to justify trading LaPorta away. I am being sarcastic but this must be the only explanation Ned could possibly have. That, or he planned on him closing the 9th with 120 - pitches, which he could have done had his defense been better for him. Still, I'd have gladly brought Mota out there in the 9th and given Rivera a pinch hit at bat for CC.

[danzig6767]

Even though i'd have pulled CC after the 8th, i could remotely live with him going out for the 9th so long as he had a quick inning. What really annoyed me was Ned waited so long to get Mota up in the pen. Someone in the bullpen should have started getting loose the second CC stepped on the mound for the 9th inning.

 

As much as anything Yost does with the pitching staff that bugs me is how often he's so late in getting someone loose in the pen, then Ned gets stuck and has to try one stall tactic after another because he was so late getting the pen up.

[jhart05]

There was no good reason to bring CC back in the 9th.

 

 

How about that we've all seen this pen give up what should have been wins before.

 

Can anyone here honestly say they feel comfortable with Mota or Gagne on the mound with any kind of lead?

 

I have no problem with Sabathia going 130 tonight.

 

That grown-ass man is 6'7", 300 pounds, he can handle it, once in a while.

[Ennder]

There is no excuse, Yost has been just horrible with the SP all year long leaving Sabathia, Sheets and Parra in for blowouts for no good reason. I almost want to see us miss the playoffs just so that idiot can be fired.

 

130 pitch CGs in a blowout with a rested bullpen and Sheets pitching the next game is inexcusible, no defense for it at all.

[Hate those Rodents]

I agree that Mota can be quite uncomfortable to have in there at times and also that CC can do 130 once in a while, but would you rather not have him do his 2-3 130 pitching outings in a one or two run game type situation instead of in a blowout?

[owbc]

I don't see what the big deal with 130 pitches is. He's going to get 5-6 days rest in his next few starts. Our bullpen has been shaky. He doesn't work that hard considering the # of pitches. Yost clearly asked him in the dugout if he could pitch another inning and he agreed.

 

I just wish people would calm down and actually enjoy it when we win.

[AJAY]

Ned makes me sick. I was at the game and I was begging for Sabathia to come out after the 7th inning. I was appalled that he not only pitched the 8th inning but also then came out for the 9th. Most of the fans around me were concerned too.

 

I was upset last week when Sabathia pitched the 8th inning in San Diego. You hate to see Ned abuse Sabathia's arm with absolutely no regard for the longer picture.

[Jay Zahn]

Yost got in trouble because he thought CC could get a clean inning pitching to the bottom of the order. Then you had an error and a couple of infield hits, and Tejada and Berkman come up and a tiring CC seems like a better idea than a fresh Guillermo. Can't say that I blame Yost for that. In retrospect Mota should have started the inning. Yost got caught up in it a bit, which shouldn't happen, but at least I can understand it in this case.

 

If you're wondering when the last time a major league pitcher threw 130 pitches in a start, actually 9 days ago Halladay did it. He didn't make it out of the 7th either, and Toronto's going nowhere.

 

CC will have the extra day off given that they aren't going to bump any of the starters, so maybe that will help some.

 

Sabathia's 120+ pitch count games by year:

2001 - 3

2002 - 2

2003 - 3

2004 - 2

2005 - 0

2006 - 2

2007 - 0

2008 - 5 (2 Cle, 3 Mil)

 

There were complaints about Sabathia being tired and not performing well in the postseason last year because of a high number of pitches thrown. Obviously it wasn't because of high numbers in any one game, more that he'd pitched better than ever before and so was getting left in games longer.

 

Sabathia, not counting tonight's stats, has a 140 pitch lead in total pitches thrown, 2950 to 2810 for Verlander. Pretty impressive actually, and obviously it's not all due to Yost. Sheets is 32nd in MLB. Ryan Dempster is 13th; you'd think that would catch up to him but we'll find out.

[afeter]

There are many very smart baseball minds that wouldn't let CC pitch 130 to complete a perfect game. Ned opts to bust his career high in a blowout win against the astros. This after consistently working his arm in every single start for the brewers this year. Ned you are officially less intelligent than the producers of klements commercials. It'd say this one takes the cake, but they have a game tomorrow and he is still the coach.

 

[Ennder]

I don't have a problem with Sabathia throwing 130 pitches. I have a huge problem with him being over 110 pitches and coming out for the 9th in a 7 run game with a rested bullpen and Sheets pitching the next day. There is simply no excuse for it and it is a problem that has been going on all year. Yost has pushed Parra and Sheets all year in similar situations even though they both should be trying to shave innings because of their last few seasons innings count. When the team is up by 6+ runs you don't push your SP unless the bullpen is fried and ours clearly is not.

[giffted1]

Another win, another page to the vent thread. Do other teams' fans complain this much?

[rluzinski]

How about that we've all seen this pen give up what should have been wins before.

 

This was a SEVEN run lead.

 

Can anyone here honestly say they feel comfortable with Mota or Gagne on the mound with any kind of lead?

 

SEVEN run lead. You could put Jeff Cirillo out there and he will secure the win 95% of the time.

[Jay Zahn]

How about that we've all seen this pen give up what should have been wins before.

 

This was a SEVEN run lead.

 

Can anyone here honestly say they feel comfortable with Mota or Gagne on the mound with any kind of lead?

 

SEVEN run lead. You could put Jeff Cirillo out there and he will secure the win 95% of the time.

6/19/2008. And I don't know if Torres was available for a bailout this time.

[bucks2281]

And I don't know if Torres was available for a bailout this time.

 

TH said in his blog that Torres was available on Monday night.

 

I, too was upset with the way it was handled. 130 pitches is too many. I don't see why he couldn't let Mota handle the entire 9th inning with a 7 run lead. Why push it? If Sheets was pitching, I bet Ned turns to Mota for the 9th. I believe that Ned has continually pushed Sabathia too hard -- I don't care if he's getting extra rest. There was no need for him to pitch in the 9th inning with a 7-run lead.

 

6/19/2008.

 

Why would a fatigued CC Sabathia be any more effective than a fresh bullpen arm? Even if Mota entered after Tejada walked and served up a homer, the Brewers would still lead 9-7 with two outs.

[PeaveyFury]

As yet another reminder, this is the vent thread. If you don't like what someone has to say here about Yost's use of Sabathia last night, there's another thread already discussing that to debate it in.

[brewcrew00]

Somehow Braun's injury will be Ned's fault. Depending on length of injury, Ned should draw the appropriately proportioned amount of pages bashing him for being a human being.

[Teatoe993]

I was at the game last night. When my clock radio woke me up this morning, the first thing I heard was this, "In sports today......Ned Yost is trying to kill CC Sabathia." I'm glad to know that I wasn't the only one freaking out about Yost throwing CC out there for the 8th and the 9th last night with his high pitch count and the game in hand. The dude sitting next to me was trying to justify the situation by saying "We'll at least we got to see a complete game." We'll I'll be sure to remember not to be disappointed when CC's arm falls off the last week of September because I was there to see that one complete game. If I was Mark A., I'd be calling Ned up at 3 A.M. reaming him out. It'd probably go something like this, "You know Ned, I get you a Ferrari to help you win the world championship. But the thing isn't even gonna make it to the end of the year if you keep taking it on those Cannonball cross country runs."