2007 Vent Thread, Part 7

[JohnBriggs12]

Believe me nobody wants to come on here and pound the manager day after day. But the fact is, he has the best team by far in the division and at best they might scrape into the playoffs by a game. Knowing they have the best team makes his continued mistakes intolerable by this fan. How many times can we say we've had the best talent in our division in the last 25 years? Now that we do, it might not be enough to overcome the managerial shortcomings.

 

Ned is a likable guy, a guy who'll go down in Brewer history for his 3 run home run in Boston. It would be great to have him around as a third base coach on another Brewer pennant winner. But not the manager.

[Brian the Automator]

It's not Derrick's fault that he's sucked consistently on 0 days rest. That one's all on Ned, in my opinion.

[sgtcluels]

It's not Derrick's fault that he's sucked consistently on 0 days rest. That one's all on Ned, in my opinion.

 

Agreed. And if you pitch him, make sure you have a back up plan incase he shows signs of struggling.

[trwi7]

as a relief pitcher if you walk 2 batters in a row, you deserve to be yanked.

 

Too bad the guy who makes the decisions didn't yank him.

[Brian the Automator]

It's not Derrick's fault that he's sucked consistently on 0 days rest. That one's all on Ned, in my opinion.

Agreed. And if you pitch him, make sure you have a back up plan incase he shows signs of struggling.

They could signal for derrick to fake an arm injury so they could warm someone up.

 

[brewmann04]

i have to believe you never know which boe your getting and their has to be other options there

[brettac1]

I'm with Brian. Why Turnbow pitched last night is impossible to comprehend. You can't "manage every game like it's the last one" when there are in fact more games to be played.

[bsglorydays]

Its hard to blame the manager when he goes with the "best" guy and that guy doesn't get the job done. The fact that Turnbow pitched yesterday means absolutely nothing. He was obviously available today or he wouldn't have been used. Nobody is rested at this point in the season, but I'm sure (I hope) they all want the ball and proclaim themselves available every day.

 

If anybody but Turnbow or Linebrink would have been used and got the loss today, Yost would have been bashed for that, too. Linebrink pitched last night, too, so take your pick.

 

Using Turnbow to start the 8th was the right move IMO. That said, if somebody else was already warmed up in the pen after the 2nd walk, I would argue that Turnbow should have been pulled at that point. But, I don't know if anybody was ready or not. I'll take my chances with Turnbow vs the likes of Josh Phelps any day.

[brettac1]

Turnbow pitching last night does factor into the decision, because he historically is bad on zero rest, as Brian said. There was no reason for him to have pitched last night, since the game was in hand by the time he came in (regardless of them blowing leads this year, you cannot actually expect them to squander a 5 run lead against the likes of the Pirates).

 

The "manage like it's the last game" philosophy is the only reason I can see for why he used him last night, but that's just not a smart move, when there are more games, including one the next day. I'm not even saying he should have used Linebrink, but why is Cordero not considered as an option? He was on three days of rest, with his last outing being 11 pitches on Saturday. He could throw two innings and probably be fine.

 

Using Turnbow today was definitely the right move. Using him last night was not.

[TauPentaRei]

It's not Derrick's fault that he's sucked consistently on 0 days rest. That one's all on Ned, in my opinion.

 

I don't get this. Ned is George W in this respect: willing whipping boy. Sure Ned has to stand in front of the camera and bungle his way forward to another line-up card, but where is the porportionate blame to Maddux, Castro, Ash, Melvin? What does Sveum do all day that is more important than forecasting the bullpen and anticipating poor returns on book decisions?

[endaround]

Not to mention Linebrink was likely ready to go since he was warming after the second walk and was warming while Stetter was in.

[sheethead]

Ned is George W in this respect: willing whipping boy.

 

I would say they are both equal in brain capacity as well. And they look alike. And they are both terrible at what they do. Wait... Ned Yost = George W. It all makes sense now.

[Fatter than Joey]

Ned is George W in this respect:

 

Both these guys sought out the positions they are in, they are hardly martyrs or whipping boys.

[Ennder]

Using Turnbow to start the 8th was the right move IMO. That said, if somebody else was already warmed up in the pen after the 2nd walk, I would argue that Turnbow should have been pulled at that point. But, I don't know if anybody was ready or not. I'll take my chances with Turnbow vs the likes of Josh Phelps any day.

 

I agree with this completely.

 

Turnbow has this habit of coming out and not being able to throw strikes at all. This habit usually shows up when he's been used a lot lately. He has pitched a lot lately, comes out and completely misses the strike zone repeatedly and walks the first two guys up to bat. At that point a good manager takes him out, he has had more than enough chances in the past to prove he can work through these situations and he almost always fails in them.

 

Now at this point you can say that its a gray area and letting him face the next guy is fine, the next guy singles and Yost leaves him out there, now it is just bad. The next guy hits a ball pretty hard that is caught and Yost STILL leaves him out there to give up 2 more runs.

 

Turnbow is left out there to throw 24 pitches, of those 24 pitches, 14 are balls, 7 are strikes(3 of which were to the first batter) and 3 are put in play. At some point in there Yost has to realize that Turnbow is not going to get the job done and its before he has given up 3 runs.

[markedman5]

Agreed.

 

Not hard to defend bringing him in really but very hard to defend letting him stay in after the 2nd walk.

 

ps. Lets keep the political crap off the board.

[iluvlamp]

I still fail to see how people who went to Yale and Harvard are stupid. Don't care if it's Bush Or Gore...anyway.

 

Ned Yost is an idiot. If he is managing every game like it's the last game he failed. Jenkins? Really? Turnbow not out after 2 walkshttp://static.yuku.com//domainskins/bypass/img/smileys/mad.gif? Really? I thought he went by the percentages and all that junk. SO WHERE WAS A RIGHTY FOR JENKINS! Did Estrada get locked in the bathroom? Doesn't Ned realize he has another catcher on the bench so he doesn't have to worry about...know what...forget it!!!(

[BrewCityUnit]

Cubs announcers make me very mad.

[AJAY]

I can't believe the stupid Astros blew a golden opportunity to demoralize the Cubs.

 

Now I am feeling demoralized instead.

[bsglorydays]

To anybody who thinks Yost mishandles his pitching, I hope you saw Cecil Cooper blow a chance for the Astros to at least tie the game in their (offensive) half of the 9th tonight.

 

Scenario: 3-1 Cubs lead, no outs in the bottom of the 9th. Loretta leads off with a single that should have been an out (it caromed off first base). He's replaced by a "faster" player (notice the use of speed in this inning). The next hitter gets a hit to left center and then ends up at 3rd base on an error in the outfield. 3-2 Cubs, runner on 3rd, still nobody out. The next hitter, Luke Scott, swings at the first pitch and hits a "cue shot" off the end of his bat to 3B. 1 out, runner still at 3rd. Cooper summons a PH, Orlando Palmeiro, who walks. He's replaced at first base by another (assumingly faster player, since Palmeiro is not exactly slow) pinch runner. 1st and 3rd, 1 out. The only thing that can hurt you now is a double play. Who does Cooper PH with? None other than a backup catcher, Eric Munson, who runs like Johnny Estrada. He promptly grounds into a (predictable) double play. Game over.

 

It can always be worse.

[TooLiveBrew]

bsg, I watched that game, and really don't get your gripe. He played the lefty-righty matchup by batting Munson - is it his fault that Scott (who usually turns in great ABs) chased a first pitch - or that Lamb didn't go to the plate on an insanely slow roller off the end of the bat - or that Munson grounded into a DP? I just don't see how the manager playing his best matchups, and then the players not executing, is Coop's fault.

 

EDIT: Munson was Cooper's last LH batter left on the bench

[DougJones43]

To anybody who thinks Yost mishandles his pitching, I hope you saw Cecil Cooper blow a chance for the Astros to at least tie the game in their (offensive) half of the 9th tonight...It can always be worse.

 

I don't know if that's worse. More like equal. And it's easier to give a guy a break when he's been managing in the majors for 5 weeks. When it's 5 years, this kind of crap becomes much more intolerable.

 

Anyway, I've got a solution. How about no former Brewer players manage the team next year.

[jason21nl]

i didn't watch any of the Astros game. I'll say one thing though, I'm not letting Jenkins face a left handed pitcher, I would have PH with Estrada who is the slowest man on earth before I let Jenkins hit vs a lefty match up. From what you said, he played the match up and it didn't work. He still seemed to have given his team the best chance to win. Yost still hasn't learned how to do that

[brewmann04]

this is going to be settled on how the brewers play on the road down the stretch

[iluvlamp]

I think it will be settled down the stretch next year. Yost is obviously over his head. He says one thing and does another. Then he goes opposite. I will blame the players more than Yost but he just does not put his players in the best position to win...and he did it again tonight. Where was Aquino? Ned loves to use him with runners in scoring position.

[adambr2]

Ned is George W in this respect: willing whipping boy.

 

I would say they are both equal in brain capacity as well. And they look alike. And they are both terrible at what they do. Wait... Ned Yost = George W. It all makes sense now.

I'm no moderator but I know political arguments aren't allowed. Not yelling at you, just saying let's keep the topic specific on baseball. Separation of baseball and state is necessary. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif