40-man roster discussion

[TooLiveBrew]

Prince is still in the organization, if they really need him next year they just put him on the 40 man then. It was a smart idea to remove him from the 40 man because it frees a spot for somebody else and there is little to no chance somebody is going to pick up Prince in the rule 5 draft.

I'd actually think that a player as versatile as Prince is precisely the kind of guy that could get nabbed in the Rule 5 Draft. Not that he's going to catch any eyes with his bat, but he's fast & can play multiple (premium) positions. If you know you have to keep the guy on the 25-man all season after taking him in the Rule 5, might as well be someone who covers multiple positions & can be a pinch-runner.

[djoctagone]

I'd actually think that a player as versatile as Prince is precisely the kind of guy that could get nabbed in the Rule 5 Draft.

prince could've been claimed and optioned in 2014. because he wasn't, i can't see a team claiming him via rule 5.

[jerichoholicninja]

You get a player in the Rule V draft because you think he might become something someday. Prince will never be anything more than a 4A super sub. Not worth guaranteeing a season-long roster spot.

[TooLiveBrew]

You get a player in the Rule V draft because you think he might become something someday. Prince will never be anything more than a 4A super sub. Not worth guaranteeing a season-long roster spot.

I hear you (& djoctagone). And ultimately, I don't think Prince will get picked. But I can certainly see a rebuilding or rebuilding-ish club taking the chance, after anyone with future upside is gone, of getting a utilityman on the cheap for the next 3-6 seasons.

[xisxisxis]

The Dodgers are probably now looking to replace Punto ...

[Roderick]

You get a player in the Rule V draft because you think he might become something someday. Prince will never be anything more than a 4A super sub. Not worth guaranteeing a season-long roster spot.

I hear you (& djoctagone). And ultimately, I don't think Prince will get picked. But I can certainly see a rebuilding or rebuilding-ish club taking the chance, after anyone with future upside is gone, of getting a utilityman on the cheap for the next 3-6 seasons.

 

Actually I would think that a playoff contending team would maybe want a superutility player more than a rebuilding team. The playoff team may have a couple of single-role (PH, PR) guys on the bench and a Prince could cover more positions. Whereas a rebuilding team is looking to find the needle in the haystack high-upside type of guys that may be good player a year or two down the road - which I don't believe anyone is saying that Prince is that.

[MNBrew]

You get a player in the Rule V draft because you think he might become something someday. Prince will never be anything more than a 4A super sub. Not worth guaranteeing a season-long roster spot.

I hear you (& djoctagone). And ultimately, I don't think Prince will get picked. But I can certainly see a rebuilding or rebuilding-ish club taking the chance, after anyone with future upside is gone, of getting a utilityman on the cheap for the next 3-6 seasons.

 

Actually I would think that a playoff contending team would maybe want a superutility player more than a rebuilding team. The playoff team may have a couple of single-role (PH, PR) guys on the bench and a Prince could cover more positions. Whereas a rebuilding team is looking to find the needle in the haystack high-upside type of guys that may be good player a year or two down the road - which I don't believe anyone is saying that Prince is that.

From everything we've seen, Josh Prince is an AAA utility player at best, worse with the bat than Alex Gonzalez or Yuni B. Based on his AAA numbers in '13 reverting to career-norm-type levels -- which aren't anything remotely resembling respectable -- his AFL production last year would seem to be nothing more than a well-timed hot streak.

 

Whether a playoff-contending team or a non-contender could better want or use a super-utility player, based on his career to date, Josh Prince isn't remotely near the caliber of player that MLB teams would seek for that role regardless of how true a super-UT guy he is. There's a world of difference from a Ben Zobrist or even a Nick Punto down to a .235-ish-hitting AAA player like Josh Prince.

[djoctagone]

santo manzanillo, jesus sanchez and josh ravin all outrighted today. the current roster is at 35.

[djoctagone]

for now, it appears that michael olmsted gets to keep his spot on the 40-man roster . . .

[JohnBriggs12]

Now Sanchez is just the type of guy a team will take a flyer on in the Rule 5 draft. He put up decent enough numbers at AAA to likely be at least serviceable at the major league level and he's a converted catcher, so there is some perceived upside.

[Mass Haas]

The three players outrighted by the Brewers today (RHP's Santo Manzanillo, Josh Ravin, and Jesus Sanchez) all have over seven years of professional experience. Each will become a minor league free agent five days after the World Series unless they agree to a new minor league deal with the Brewers. Even if Sanchez did not have the service time (he's an eight-year pro), because this is the second time he's been outrighted (late in 2010 by the Phillies), he could have elected free agency.

 

Their names have been added to the top post within our "Brewer Minor League Free Agents After the 2013 Season" thread.

 

Guessing we'll learn about at least one re-signing this week, but nothing from the Brewers yet.

[Outlander]

Sanchez would be silly to resign with Milwaukee, he keeps on performing and he gets passed over time after time. Didn't even get a cup of coffee with Milwaukee even though he was on the 40 man and others called up were not.

[Roderick]

I don't understand not keeping Sanchez. You would think he would have had a decent chance at making the team, assuming they don't sign a free agent bullpen guy. So I guess Melvin is going to spend some money on a veteran to replace Gonzalez.

[bork]

Sanchez would be silly to resign with Milwaukee, he keeps on performing and he gets passed over time after time. Didn't even get a cup of coffee with Milwaukee even though he was on the 40 man and others called up were not.

 

Yeah, I never understood why he never got called up.

[brewmann04]

I am shocked that Sanchez never got a call up especially with the Brewers state.

[reillymcshane]

I am shocked that Sanchez never got a call up especially with the Brewers state.

I'm surprised by this too. But I'm only going by stats. Perhaps the team just doesn't see him making the transition from AAA to the big leagues.

 

That said, he's only been pitching for four years (he was a catcher prior to being moved to the mound), and really seemed to blossom when moved to relieving two years ago. He had the 16th best ERA in the PCL last year (47 minimum innings pitched). And his splits are dramatic. A .692 OPS .vs lefties and a .648 OPS vs. righties. His 2012 splits are even better - lefties had a .554 OPS while righties had a .571 OPS.

 

I guess I'd rather take a risk on a guy like Sanchez rather than invest $2 million in Badenhop. But again, maybe the Brewers know something about Sanchez that we don't.

[torts]

I am shocked that Sanchez never got a call up especially with the Brewers state.

I'm surprised by this too. But I'm only going by stats. Perhaps the team just doesn't see him making the transition from AAA to the big leagues.

 

That said, he's only been pitching for four years (he was a catcher prior to being moved to the mound), and really seemed to blossom when moved to relieving two years ago. He had the 16th best ERA in the PCL last year (47 minimum innings pitched). And his splits are dramatic. A .692 OPS .vs lefties and a .648 OPS vs. righties. His 2012 splits are even better - lefties had a .554 OPS while righties had a .571 OPS.

 

I guess I'd rather take a risk on a guy like Sanchez rather than invest $2 million in Badenhop. But again, maybe the Brewers know something about Sanchez that we don't.

 

I figured that brewers mgmt know something we dont. also, just because he was removed from the 40-man doesnt mean he WILL get claimed in the rule 5 draft, so he could still be in the system come January, and could earn a spot on the 40-man in March.

 

if im not mistaken they need to clear people off the 40 for when players come back off the 60-day DL or get resigned (Weeks, Hart, Braun, Fiers, etc), right?

[djoctagone]

if im not mistaken they need to clear people off the 40 for when players come back off the 60-day DL or get resigned (Weeks, Hart, Braun, Fiers, etc), right?

yes . . . except fiers was never transferred to the 60-day disabled list (even though he could have been). weeks and hart have to be activated, but hart is expected to declare free agency. braun and de los santos will have to be removed from the restricted list and placed back on the 40-man.

[torts]

if im not mistaken they need to clear people off the 40 for when players come back off the 60-day DL or get resigned (Weeks, Hart, Braun, Fiers, etc), right?

yes . . . except fiers was never transferred to the 60-day disabled list (even though he could have been). weeks and hart have to be activated, but hart is expected to declare free agency. braun and de los santos will have to be removed from the restricted list and placed back on the 40-man.

 

oh wow, so they went all season with Fiers on the 40-man? or was he DFA'd when he was sent down to the Minors in May?

[bork]

Fiers was optioned and then got hurt while in the minors. I don't think I've ever seen a minor league guy placed on the 60 day DL. You'd have to pay him a big league salary and he'd be earning service time.

[TheCrew07]

Well apparently my high regard of Sanchez wasn't warranted, I was always intrigued by him.

 

Hopefully he doesn't land in the division someplace, I'd like him to do well if he gets a chance.

[djoctagone]

Fiers was optioned and then got hurt while in the minors. I don't think I've ever seen a minor league guy placed on the 60 day DL. You'd have to pay him a big league salary and he'd be earning service time.

correct. they would have had to recall him (not to report) and then place him on the 60-day.

[Mass Haas]

I figured that brewers mgmt know something we dont. also, just because he was removed from the 40-man doesnt mean he WILL get claimed in the rule 5 draft, so he could still be in the system come January, and could earn a spot on the 40-man in March.

 

You may have missed my post earlier in this thread. If Sanchez doesn't re-sign a minor league deal for 2014 shortly with Milwaukee, he's a minor league free agent five days after the World Series. The ball is in Sanchez' court, with quite a bit of leverage, too. He'll find a nice AAA deal elsewhere unless the Brewers can entice him.

[torts]

I figured that brewers mgmt know something we dont. also, just because he was removed from the 40-man doesnt mean he WILL get claimed in the rule 5 draft, so he could still be in the system come January, and could earn a spot on the 40-man in March.

 

You may have missed my post earlier in this thread. If Sanchez doesn't re-sign a minor league deal for 2014 shortly with Milwaukee, he's a minor league free agent five days after the World Series. The ball is in Sanchez' court, with quite a bit of leverage, too. He'll find a nice AAA deal elsewhere unless the Brewers can entice him.

 

i did miss that, thanks for reposting that info

[JohnBriggs12]

I don't understand not keeping Sanchez. You would think he would have had a decent chance at making the team, assuming they don't sign a free agent bullpen guy. So I guess Melvin is going to spend some money on a veteran to replace Gonzalez.

 

Its been a given that Melvin would be shopping for a veteran lefty in the bullpen hasn't it? Lets hope whoever he signs performs better than the erratic Gonzalez. As for Sanchez, they must just figure that his value isn't all that high and that he can be replaced by someone else's minor league FA.