At what point are we allowed to start calling Jonathan Lucroy a star?

[The stache]

We all know that last year Jonathan Lucroy was headed to the All Star game had he not seen his season interrupted by the freak accident involving his wife and his suitcase.

 

Well, here we are in the second half of 2013, and Jonathan Lucroy, after a slow start (some have blamed the WBC where he was a backup catcher), is on fire once again. The Brewers sent two representatives to the All Star Game in 2013, shortstop Jean Segura, and center fielder Carlos Gomez. Well, I think it's a safe bet that Jonathan Lucroy warrants some serious consideration for the same honor next year.

 

Let's look at what Jonathan has done over the last 162 games:

 

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/6034/wapm.png

 

A .302 average. 25 home runs. 102 RBI. An .860 OPS. 284 total bases.

 

Buster Posey won the 2012 National League MVP hitting .336 with 24 home runs and 103 RBI. .960 OPS. 291 total bases.

 

Let's face it, guys, Jonathan Lucroy is one of the best catchers the Milwaukee Brewers have ever had. He's got plenty of seasons ahead of him, and I hope that the media outlets start to realize what we in Milwaukee already know. Luc is a star in the making.

[PrinceEatMeat]

Lucroy is definitely turning into a great player. I think he's a future all-star. Definitely an argument that he could be Top 3 in the NL along with Posey and Molina. It's definitely exciting to have a great catcher for once. I would agree that he's looking like one of the best catchers the Brewers have ever had. It's definitely exciting.

[Invader3K]

I thought this would be his breakout year (ie. maybe make the All-Star Game or at least be in serious discussion for it), but his slow start curtailed that.

 

I think we're definitely lucky to have him around, especially on a team friendly contract.

[torts]

he's no kendell, but i'll take him!

[JohnBriggs12]

The old saying goes, you build a team with strength up the middle. Gomez, Segura, Lucroy and ???? Oh well, 3 out of 4.

[torts]

The old saying goes, you build a team with strength up the middle. Gomez, Segura, Lucroy and ???? Oh well, 3 out of 4.

 

Yuni!

[SRB]

He's also by far the best catcher in MLB at pitching framing, according to some advanced metrics. His best skill doesn't even show up in the stat-lines!

[JimH5]

Let's face it, guys, Jonathan Lucroy is one of the best catchers the Milwaukee Brewers have ever had.

 

It's true, but that is pretty faint praise.

 

He's currently 6th on the Brewers career list in WAR for guys whose primary position was catcher:

 

BJ Surhoff leads with 15.4 WAR in 4304 PA.

Darrell Porter is 2nd with 11.1 WAR in 2009 PA.

Charlie Moore is 3rd with 10.6 WAR in 4358 PA.

Dave Nilsson is 4th with 10.5 WAR in 3153 PA.

Ellie Rodriguez is 5th with 8.0 WAR in 1152 PA.

Lucroy has 7.1 WAR in 1449 PA.

 

With a couple more really good years, he could eclipse them all.

[splitterpfj]

Ted Simmons would easily top this list, but he got here late in his career, and wound up moving to DH. Darrell Porter would easily top this list, but he got involved with drugs, fell flat on his face, (literally once, at a game I attended), and wound up being traded to Kansas City.

 

It's true, Lucroy is doing a great job, and he has a chance to become the best catcher the team has ever had.

[homer]

Thanks for compiling the stats. People need to refer to this thread when they want to use Lucroy as trade bait.

[BrewCrewForever]

He should have made the All-Star team two years in a row. The only catchers better than him in MLB are probably Posey, Molina and Mauer. That is it. I think he is very close to star status, a few more years like this and he will be there. I have been a big fan since he got the call in 2010. Got his jersey for Christmas this past offseason. Remember when some thought Angel Salome was going to be the catcher of the future over Lucroy?

 

I also think he has turned into a leader on the club and I noticed that he plays with a bit of swagger. Something about his mannerisms.

[vegasbrewcrew1993]

Lucroy is awesome. He doesn't get any attention because the media loves to ignore Brewers players not named Fielder or Braun. Lucroy can hit with the best and he's very good at framing. Sometimes though I question his defensive skills. He's not terrible but he's not great. I think his blocking ability could use some work. Still though this guy is top 5 at his position in baseball. I'm very happy that the Brewers have him signed for a while.

[torts]

Lucroy is awesome. He doesn't get any attention because the media loves to ignore Brewers players not named Fielder or Braun. Lucroy can hit with the best and he's very good at framing. Sometimes though I question his defensive skills. He's not terrible but he's not great. I think his blocking ability could use some work. Still though this guy is top 5 at his position in baseball. I'm very happy that the Brewers have him signed for a while.

 

I wasnt aware there was a Fielder on the Brewers anymore

[The stache]

Ted Simmons would easily top this list, but he got here late in his career, and wound up moving to DH. Darrell Porter would easily top this list, but he got involved with drugs, fell flat on his face, (literally once, at a game I attended), and wound up being traded to Kansas City.

 

It's true, Lucroy is doing a great job, and he has a chance to become the best catcher the team has ever had.

 

It's too bad Porter was able to stand up for a week in the fall of 1982.

[chickinbrickin]

Lucroy is the man. I have followed him since he entered the system. Always had a feeling he would turn into a great catcher. I love being right.

[chickinbrickin]

Lucroy is awesome. He doesn't get any attention because the media loves to ignore Brewers players not named Fielder or Braun. Lucroy can hit with the best and he's very good at framing. Sometimes though I question his defensive skills. He's not terrible but he's not great. I think his blocking ability could use some work. Still though this guy is top 5 at his position in baseball. I'm very happy that the Brewers have him signed for a while.

 

Lucroy is actually a really solid defender. He is no Molina, but I would say he is well above average.

[Baldkin]

I still want to know why he is completely unable to work with certain pitchers. What part of his catching style rubs guys the wrong way?

[RightFieldCoder]

Personal theory I've not heard elsewhere: I don't think he calls a good game. That throws some pitchers off. I think Wolf knew what he wanted to pitch. His rhythm would be thrown off waiting to get in sync with Lucroy and that was why he didn't want to pitch to him.

[TooLiveBrew]

When are we allowed to start calling Lucroy a star? Probably after he's able to sustain star-caliber performance for more than one (or a partial) season. Don't get me wrong, he clearly has talent. But a star? No, not yet.

[brewcrewdue80]

I still want to know why he is completely unable to work with certain pitchers. What part of his catching style rubs guys the wrong way?

 

You're probably referring to Wolf who strictly wanted Kottaras. And now Peralta? Peralta to Maldonado is strictly language. He just exclaimed it recently that he cannot work with Peralta like Maldy can in communication. He wished he could be out there everyday and not have that 5th day off, but it's better for Peralta to work with a Catcher he can communicate with for his development.

 

I'm not upset by this at all really because it leaves Maldonado with a game to catch every 5 games while giving Lucroy a day off which, I think honestly helps him. And let's think long term here. 4 more seasons likely with Lucroy, I'd like to keep those knees as fresh for as long as possible.

 

It's a good thread, because I said in the preferred lineup thread when Weeks/Lucroy both were struggling with the bat, I wasn't worried about Lucroy, hitters will hit. He's a line drive machine and LDs as we know provide the most success in stats. Lucroy was super consistent last season when on the field too like Braun/Aoki in a typical BA. No .220s one month here and .333 the following month it was .278 or higher every month. And that's exactly what Lucroy has done since that first month.

.235-.273-.296-and .352 now for July. I would expect him to bat above .270 every month here on out and really for the remainder of his contract with Milwaukee when healthy.

[sbrylski]

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=c&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=500&type=8&season=2013&month=0&season1=2012&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0

 

That's catcher WAR ranking since the start of 2012. Lucroy is fourth, but a relatively distant fourth. Definitely leads the "tier of the very good."

[lynchmobster]

Dare I say WOAH SOLVDD?

[gregmag]

This is a great thread, partially because I agree that Lucroy has been underrated and partially because of some great comments. On the first part, if his framing is really as good as Fangraphs has argued, then he's even more valuable than his strong bat and solid glove make him. I also agree with the point about his leadership: I think I first pointed that out back in the 2011 pennant run, when Lucroy got up in LaRussa's grill in the media more boldly than anyone else on the team was willing to. I just love the guy.

 

As for the comments: I had no idea Ellie Rodriguez was that good; I love the line about Darrell Porter and 1982; and any occasion to remember WOAH SOLVDD is a good occasion.

[Funketown]

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=c&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=500&type=8&season=2013&month=0&season1=2012&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0

 

That's catcher WAR ranking since the start of 2012. Lucroy is fourth, but a relatively distant fourth. Definitely leads the "tier of the very good."

 

Lucroy also has about 300 fewer PAs than Molina, Posey, and Mauer over that time, so while he's definitely behind those guys, he might be closer than that chart indicates.

 

It's incredible that this team has a C, SS, and CF who all project to put up around a 115-120 wRC+ signed to team friendly deals, but the rest of the club has so many holes...

[reillymcshane]

Luc is a very good player. I don't know if 'star' is there - at least not yet. He doesn't have an elite skill(s) either as a hitter or receiver that makes him great.

 

That said, he's a heck of a player, and I'm thrilled we have him. Above average catchers aren't easy to come by. The scouting department nailed this one right when they picked him.