Perfect trading partner - Nationals?

[LouisEly]

Looking at the Nationals roster, they might make a great trading partner for the Brewers.

 

Nationals needs:

2B - Espinosa and Lombardozzi have made Weeks look like an All-Star this year

LHRP - have nothing in the bullpen for LH relievers except Zach Duke, and he has been terrible

OF - Werth is hurt but expected back (if people think Lohse, Weeks, and A-Ram have bad contracts, look at Werth), but Span is nothing special and their bench has been awful

 

Obviously this hinges on two things - the Nats getting some of their injured players back and making a run the next six weeks, and Weeks finding his stroke. While Weeks may be unlikely, they may be very interested in Gonzalez/Gorzelanny or Aoki as both will address needs without adding much salary.

 

What the Brewers can get:

Gonzalez/Gorzelanny or Aoki could get Robbie Ray, Matt Purke, or Sammy Solis giving the Brewers some LHP prospects.

Weeks could be a "change of scenery" trade with WAS for Haren - he hasn't been good and his contract is up at the end of the year, freeing up the salary.

 

Discuss...

[homer]

Nats can bring up Rendon to play 2nd.

[ReverendBrewmeister]

Nats are bringing up Rendon today. They're going to play him some at 2B. But it's a bit of an experiment. Espinosa has been put on DL. (See links.)

 

http://www.baseballnation.com/2013/6/4/4396296/anthony-rendon-nationals-promoted-majors-second-base

 

http://www.federalbaseball.com/2013/6/4/4396306/washington-nationals-reinstate-jayson-werth-recall-anthony-rendon

 

I got to see him this season here in Harrisburg begin to hit AA pitching. Quality looking prospect.

[sheetskout]

Rendon is a budding gold-glove 3rd baseman. A truly-gifted fielder. I don't think the Nationals are very worried about his transition to 2nd base.

[brewcrewdue80]

Looks like forget that idea. Rendon has already performed well with his bat, and he's rating a Positive Defender for 2b thus far.

Pretty amazing how Washington has hit there early round draft picks as far as picking the right seasons to be bad and luck in to having the choices of Harper/Strasburg/Rendon. I guess looking at their draft choices They've hit at least one pick since 2007 in 1st/2nd round choices all ML contributors or soon to be.

Hard to find a reason Washington needs to trade with us anymore. Aside from getting back the LH RPs they lost.

[3and2Fastball]

Rendon is a budding gold-glove 3rd baseman. A truly-gifted fielder. I don't think the Nationals are very worried about his transition to 2nd base.

 

We'll see if they still feel that way after a few MLB'ers try to take out his legs on double play balls

[ebmackenzie]

Yo Gallardo and RWeeks revitalized a bit gets Rendon, Purke, and RRay. Lower guys not on the 40 man roster is key for Melvin and this offers some outs for the Nats to justify the deal (Rendon is always going to have the possibility of being out/injured often, RRay is a back of the rotation lefty, and Purke is far off). Got to give the Nats a reason to do the deal and if I am Washington, I cannot justify moving Rendon without dangling some real trade bait--this is the base deal as some will say it is too much(Brewer fans)/others not enough (Nat fans). Pair it with the deal on the Dodgers trading partner board and you have Yo, RWeeks, ARam, KRod and 10mil for CSeager, Rendon, RRay, Purke, Angel Sanchez, Yimi Garcia, payroll flexibility, and places where farm guys can come up and fill in without completely losing our branding or core (Braun, Segura, CGomez, Lucroy, Aoki (Rendon steps in for ARam)) batters.

[brewcrewdue80]

EB, Rendon is a #6 draft pick. Shown enough in less than 79 games to make the Nationals roster. It shows how highly they are on him. Trading Rendon would be equivalent to us trading Ryan Braun his first month on the roster.

What I'm getting at, is at this point, Gallardo plus Weeks more than likely is hung up on for Rendon alone. I think Rendon is at that Core Franchise level player for the Nationals as we see Segura for us long term. So I would likely begin my trade thoughts to acquire Rendon with what you would be okay with trading away Segura.

 

I do feel Yo could be sent over for some prospects. Nats are and have been willing to deal for Pitchers in the past. But then again, they are healthy in SPs having Strasburg,Gio,Zimmerman,Haren, and one of Detwiler or Karns. Haren does leave after this season though so maybe the team throws Karns and Robbie Ray away for Gallardo. Maybe the team even tabs Matt Skole as a 3b/1b prospect.

It's just amazing the team the Nationals have put together between signings and all those draft picks they've collected and hit on. And then to see them at .500...Man, you wonder, if in 30 games they become sellers themselves. Haren/Laroche a guy like Clippard or Storen as trade aways. Injuries clearly have derailed them and once again the NL is so strong at the top(the whole Lohse argument and not trading Hart away offseason) that realistically mounting a comeback from 7games or more behind the Playoff picture is way more daunting then if prior seasons.

Pittsburgh's collapse is less likely this season with Cole's career starting tonight, Cincy having a true leadoff this season, and the West has top talent players on all of them except SD. Such a Competitive League this season.

[ebmackenzie]

bcd80...On the Rendon/Segura thing--I can agree with that. I have a feeling that someone in that front office is wary of Boras, the injuries, the MLB contract, and might see that Robbie Ray and Purke, with his MLB contract, aren't going to get it done alone. Maybe just Weeks (and a reliever like Badenhop or MGonzlz) for RRay, Purke, and a ptbnl.

 

Furthermore if/when ARamirez and his 16mil next year and 4mil buyout are moved then they will need a 3B and that was the justification for that. Yo, KRod, Weeks all have replacements ready to go, but JFrancisco, Yuni, and Bianchi are not going to work there. Can Gamel come back to 3B after DM has shied away from putting him there? That is why Rendon was on my mind...got to give talent to get it...maybe not that much. Yo then to BAL as MLBTR says the Os are fishing for pitching...

[brewcrewdue80]

My guessing to 3b prospects currently the club could target whether Trade Deadline or OffSeason:

Wilmer Flores Mets,Cheslor Cuthbert Royals,Garin Cecchini Red Sox.

 

Flores would maybe be apart of a deal giving away Gomez to Mets.

I've already stated the Cuthbert in KC trade partner.

and Cecchini from the Red Sox. Probably a deal done with Gallardo.

 

Yeah Gallardo is going to be our main trade piece. Mets won't deal for Gomez until the OffSeason no reason to sell Gomez pre-deadline. As for Os their prospects are Gausman,Bundy,Shoop and then if falls off to long term hopefuls. Which may be why they are shopping around for a pitcher. One of those hey we'll give you our 3rd,4th,5th,and 7th prospect for so and so when that according to Scouting book ranks at 115,191,205, and 220 as prospects.

[LouisEly]

The question isn't if Rendon can play 2B, the question is if Zimmerman can stay at 3B. Lately he has been getting Steve Sax Syndrome messing up relatively easy throws to 1B. Zimmerman is last among qualified 3B in fielding % (Reynolds and Ransom, while not qualified, have a slightly lower fielding %) and tied for first in errors among all positions with Alvarez.

 

I could easily see a Ryan Braun move to LF (Werth likely moves to 1B in 2015 when the Nats can buy out LaRoche for $2M, making room for Goodwin/Perez in the OF).

[monty57]

EB, Rendon is a #6 draft pick. Shown enough in less than 79 games to make the Nationals roster. It shows how highly they are on him. Trading Rendon would be equivalent to us trading Ryan Braun his first month on the roster.

What I'm getting at, is at this point, Gallardo plus Weeks more than likely is hung up on for Rendon alone. I think Rendon is at that Core Franchise level player for the Nationals as we see Segura for us long term. So I would likely begin my trade thoughts to acquire Rendon with what you would be okay with trading away Segura.

 

I do feel Yo could be sent over for some prospects. Nats are and have been willing to deal for Pitchers in the past. But then again, they are healthy in SPs having Strasburg,Gio,Zimmerman,Haren, and one of Detwiler or Karns. Haren does leave after this season though so maybe the team throws Karns and Robbie Ray away for Gallardo. Maybe the team even tabs Matt Skole as a 3b/1b prospect.

It's just amazing the team the Nationals have put together between signings and all those draft picks they've collected and hit on. And then to see them at .500...Man, you wonder, if in 30 games they become sellers themselves. Haren/Laroche a guy like Clippard or Storen as trade aways. Injuries clearly have derailed them and once again the NL is so strong at the top(the whole Lohse argument and not trading Hart away offseason) that realistically mounting a comeback from 7games or more behind the Playoff picture is way more daunting then if prior seasons.

Pittsburgh's collapse is less likely this season with Cole's career starting tonight, Cincy having a true leadoff this season, and the West has top talent players on all of them except SD. Such a Competitive League this season.

 

You're right that the Nats don't have a glaring need for starting pitching, so I don't think this would add up, but I'd be intrigued by a deal centered around Gallardo-for-Rendon. If we could get Rendon and were able to trade Ramirez for a decent SP prospect (Z Lee?). We'd have shed a lot of future financial obligations, while shoring up a couple of positions with cheap, young, high-upside players for the next six years.

 

Maybe some type of three-team deal where the Dodgers get Ramirez and Detwiler/Karns, the Nats get Gallardo and something from the Dodgers, and the Brewers get Rendon and Lee. The fact that all three of these teams are under-performing this year makes this seem far-fetched, but who knows.

[brewcrewdue80]

Tell you what, based on Rendon's start to his career above .300 and near .400 OB showing he has the eye to take a walk. He has to be untouchable at this point. 7BBs in 59PA. While still batting over .300. No HRs yet but he's being patient at the plate, would assume once he attacks more, taking less BBs the HRs will come. Would be like Gyorko's start in San Diego.

 

No reason Washington should trade Rendon away at this point. It'd have to be for another Franchise Bat in return imo.

My solution for our threads. Washington trades Rendon to LaDodgers for Yasiel Puig.

[Raw Biz]

I agree the Rendon will take a lot to get. I'm a huge fan and I think the Nats would hang up if we offered Yo straight up and I think that might even have happened prior to his horrible season so far this season.

[monty57]

Pre-season, Wil Myers (#7 BP, #4 BA) was a much more highly-touted prospect than Rendon (#35, #30), and I don't think Rendon's 52 MLB ABs make that much difference.

 

This off-season, the Shields trade netted Myers and Odorizzi (#83, #92), and I think that a 27-year-old Gallardo is close to 31-year-old Shields' value. Therefore, I think that prior to Gallardo losing his velocity, a deal centered on Gallardo-for-Rendon would be a starting point, and the Nats would probably have to throw in more value to even things up. I don't know how much trade value Gallardo has lost with his diminished velocity... it probably depends on whether "baseball people" think the loss is permanent or not. I hope for the Brewers' sake that it's not permanent, because he could be a franchise-changing trade chip if he's 100%, or he could be a very expensive back-of-the-rotation starter if he doesn't find his velocity.

 

That said, I don't think this trade is likely, as the Nationals aren't in dire need of pitching. Plus they may not even be "buyers" this season, or at least they may not be serious enough "buyers" to want to ship off their top prospect(s) in a mega-trade.

[sheetskout]

Semi-random opinion: I like Anthony Rendon's bat better than Wil Myers and it's not even close for me.

 

One strikes out at around a 4/1 rate and the other walks more than he strikes out. (And this doesn't even mention that Rendon is a high-level fielder who could push a gold-glover to 1B in two years at a premium position).

[brewcrewdue80]

Pre-season, Wil Myers (#7 BP, #4 BA) was a much more highly-touted prospect than Rendon (#35, #30), and I don't think Rendon's 52 MLB ABs make that much difference.

 

This off-season, the Shields trade netted Myers and Odorizzi (#83, #92), and I think that a 27-year-old Gallardo is close to 31-year-old Shields' value. Therefore, I think that prior to Gallardo losing his velocity, a deal centered on Gallardo-for-Rendon would be a starting point, and the Nats would probably have to throw in more value to even things up. I don't know how much trade value Gallardo has lost with his diminished velocity... it probably depends on whether "baseball people" think the loss is permanent or not. I hope for the Brewers' sake that it's not permanent, because he could be a franchise-changing trade chip if he's 100%, or he could be a very expensive back-of-the-rotation starter if he doesn't find his velocity.

 

That said, I don't think this trade is likely, as the Nationals aren't in dire need of pitching. Plus they may not even be "buyers" this season, or at least they may not be serious enough "buyers" to want to ship off their top prospect(s) in a mega-trade.

 

Myers had 4 years to earn his #3 ranking. He was a 3 rd. draft selection. Rendon drafted #6 overall in 2011 had all of 43 games across 4 levels to remain a #30 prospect. You take what he's did this year in the minors and allowed him a fullseason's of minor league games, there's probably no doubt he would be a top 10 prospect and possibly even ranked ahead of Myers.

 

The trade scenario of Sheilds and Davis for Myers/Odorizzi/Montgomery is a valid one if Gallardo was in the same class as Shields. Shields has been a shut down Starter while Gallardo never has been. Shut down meaning pitching CGs and eating some serious innings. 200ip by Gallardo is nice. But it's not Shields 221 avg IP the prior 6 seasons.

Plus TB threw in Davis who isn't a slouch either when used out of the BP.

 

Sure KC hit with the Myers selection but to date the vast majority of their Top Prospects wound up flaming out in recent years. They needed an Ace on their staff. I think KC overpaid in the deal but at this rate, KC not only got Shields/Davis but they will also get compensation end of 1st rd selection if/when he leaves to FA after next season.

I'm not of the belief that Gallardo currently possesses QO stuff end of 2015. So trading for him comes strictly with 2.5seasons of pitching at the cost of your top prospects. Also, if Gallardo isn't an Ace quality pitcher like Shields, then expecting a team to overpay for him as Shields was overpayed for isn't realistic.

Gallardo will net a good-great player or two. But a player that's top 10-20 in prospect rankings present/future isn't going to happen without added pieces in that trade.

 

If the Brewers got Archie Bradley from the DBacks being the #24/#25 pre-season rankings would that be a worse haul than Myers/Odorizzi? That #24/25 doesn't mean much halfway through the season. I'm sure Bradley is a top 5-10prospect in the Minors if the rankings were redone today. And Rendon would also be in that ranking. The only thing that kept Rendon from being ranked higher was health concerns, not ability.

 

I guess I'm just nitpicking to stir up a debate. The truth is Gallardo isn't in the class of Shields. It's a hope that with Gallardo's age, he becomes the 221IP a season pitcher the next 3-5 seasons but realistically Gallardo will continue to be 200IP type pitcher. If Gallardo had show some improvement to start this season rather than decline then I could see his value being near Shields in approach. I hope the Brewers can nab a top 40 prospect as well as another top 100(but rising) prospect for Gallardo.