How much longer should Rickie be given at the 4th spot?

[The stache]

I understand it's a very small sample size, but the numbers for Rickie thus far in the #4 spot have not been encouraging. So not wanting to overreact, I am looking for the logic behind Ron Roenicke's leaving Rickie as Ryan Braun's protection.

 

Rickie has batted cleanup in 10 games thus far.

 

He's batting .100 (4 for 40) with 3 doubles. He's driven in 2 runs. His OBP is .182. His slugging is .175, giving him an OPS of .357. He has a 50% strikeout rate (20 k's in 40 at bats).

 

For the entire season (not just the time batting cleanup), Rickie is batting .053 with runners in scoring position (1 for 19, a .053 average. He has walked 3 times, and struck out 9 times.

 

With men on base, Rickie is batting .091 for the season.

In high leverage situations (highest pressure situations, like being at bat with 2 outs and the bases loaded), Rickie is hitting .063 (1 for 16) with a .292 OPS.

In low leverage situations (lowest pressure situations, like being up with nobody on, and no outs), Rickie is hitting .316 (6 for 19) with a 1.041 OPS.

 

I believe that players should work out of their slumps. I believe that Rickie will turn this around. And I like Rickie Weeks.

 

But is there justification for leaving him in the cleanup spot in the order? The three men hitting in front of him are getting on base:

 

Nori Aoki's OBP is .356.

Jean Segura's OBP is .417.

Ryan Braun's OBP is .411.

 

Are you guys for giving him more time batting cleanup, or do you think a change should be made now.

Additionally, do you feel that Ron Roenicke will give him more time, or will he make a move?

[The stache]

Rickie's splits for 2013 can be found here: http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.cgi?id=weeksri01&year=2013&t=b

[liveforoctober]

Weeks should be out of the cleanup spot immediately IMO. He isn't confident/seeing the ball well/enter your own way of saying sucking. I know the options are limited ... but I think Lucroy should man the spot for the next few weeks until ARam comes back. I don't think he could mentally handle it .. but I'd much rather have Gomez in there right now too.

[torts]

until Rammy is back

[Invader3K]

I would move him down in the order. Maybe he's just one of those weird players that don't hit well in certain situations or spots in the lineup. I'd probably try Lucroy 4th or even, as much as I hate to say it...ugh...Betancourt.

[brewtown82]

He should be gone from the 4-hole. Honestly, I would rather see Gennett getting some at-bats at this point, but if we're gonna stick with him, he's gotta be down in the order. We already have the over-the-hill black hole spot (gonzalez), we don't need one at the cleanup hole too.

[logan82]

I understand it's a very small sample size,

That is all you really need to say about Weeks.

[endaround]

Weeks shouldn't hit 4th mostly because he'll never hit for a high BA. The fact that Braun won't hit 4th like he should is what is driving all this. That said swapping Weeks and Lucroy won't do anything.

 

And can we realize that Gennett had a .293/.330/.385 line in AA last year?

[Gobias Industries]

I understand it's a very small sample size,

That is all you really need to say about Weeks.

He did the same thing for 3 months last year before turning it around so it's not exactly the same as the "slump" Braun went thru a week ago where you could just point to a small sample. And honestly, RW looks even worse now than at any point last year. How many balls has he hit hard in the past two weeks? 2 or 3? A lot of pitchers could have given us better at bats lately.

 

I'm fine with keeping him in the starting lineup given the alternatives, but there's no way in hell he should be batting anywhere but the bottom of the order right now. If he starts to have better at bats and starts to actually hit the ball hard and lay off junk sliders, then move him up.

[zzzmanwitz]

Its been 3 weeks of baseball. Our best two choices for clean up are both hurt. Lineup construction matters very little to number of runs scored.

 

Sure, you could rest him for a day or two, but whether he bats 4th or 8th, he needs to be in the lineup to work out his issues. We need Weeks to be contributing to the offense for this team to be successful.

[zzzmanwitz]

The fact that Braun won't hit 4th like he should is what is driving all this.

 

Can you explain why he should be? I think he should be batting 2nd if you want to go by the letter of the law of lineup construction.

[3and2Fastball]

Still too small of a sample to really say....

 

Sometimes I wonder if Weeks will ever learn to stop chasing the outside curve ball. He also seems susceptible to swinging and missing at the high fastball now, too

[lcbj68c]

I think WE, as fans, don't have confidence in Weeks. I haven't seen anything to suggest that Weeks himself has lost confidence. I think he's the same guy he's always been. It's a rough stretch sure, but I'd bat him 5th and put Maldo/Lucroy in the 4 hole.

[brewcrewdue80]

It was the first half of the season last year the Brewers had arguably the worst production from their 1,2 in order due to Weeks/Gomez/Morgan. Fast forward a year and looky who has the worst production from their 4 hitter and who resides there? Weeks.

 

So Yes, it's far past the time of removing Weeks at the 4th spot. He didn't deserve it in the first place. It should have been Lucroy's from the beginning.

 

I also don't get the benching of Lucroy while hot just because it's a day game. They don't play til 10pm our time Monday night vs a non-division foe. But hey, lets continue trying to give away games within our division...Cubs just so happen to be doing a better job!

[Raw Biz]

I also don't get the benching of Lucroy while hot just because it's a day game. They don't play til 10pm our time Monday night vs a non-division foe. But hey, lets continue trying to give away games within our division...Cubs just so happen to be doing a better job!

 

I'd rather have Lucroy sit once every 5 days. Catchers get worn out quicker than other positions. And past production doesn't necessarily equal future.

[PrinceEatMeat]

I also don't get the benching of Lucroy while hot just because it's a day game. They don't play til 10pm our time Monday night vs a non-division foe. But hey, lets continue trying to give away games within our division...Cubs just so happen to be doing a better job!

 

I'd rather have Lucroy sit once every 5 days. Catchers get worn out quicker than other positions. And past production doesn't necessarily equal future.

 

I agree that he should sit every 5 days. No problem with that. In this case though it was to try to get Peralta going. He works well with Maldonado. It clearly worked.

[Funketown]

Weeks is struggling pretty badly right now, but is there really a significantly better option?

 

Aoki, Segura, and Braun aren't going to move. That leaves Lucroy, Weeks, Yuni B, Gonzalez, and Gomez rounding out the lineup. I guess Lucroy could move to the four spot and Gomez to the five, but realistically I'd bet on Weeks to put up a better line going forward than Gomez and probably Lucroy too.

 

I'm comfortable with giving the management some leeway here. If they think Weeks would benefit from being moved down, it's fine by me. He's looked horrible, but I don't think that's a sufficient condition to say he'll continue to look horrible. Odds are he'll snap out of this and start doing what he's done for the past half-decade; it's just a matter of when.

[logan82]

He should stay in the 4th spot until he gets moved back up to the 2 hole or leadoff.

[HOF4canrake]

At this point, it doesn't matter if it's a "slump" or whatever. He's not hitting and they've been somewhat fortunate to win with Weeks hitting cleanup.

[James Zumstein]

He should stay in the 4th spot until he gets moved back up to the 2 hole or leadoff.

 

I personally think those days are behind him. We have better options in Aoki and Segura in those spots, and with them both being second year players, Rickie had better learn how to produce lower down in the order.

[Bombers]

I would put Rickie in the 8 spot.

 

Healthy Lineup of Aoki, segura, Braun, Ramirez, Lucroy, Hart, Gomez, Weeks, pitcher

 

I think he would be a good 8 hitter because sometimes the 8th spot gets pitched around and he has a good eye. Move him there now and get him comfortable. In 1 month it's where he will be anyhow. (And I agree with 6-4-3 : his 1-2 spot days are behind him

[The stache]

He should stay in the 4th spot until he gets moved back up to the 2 hole or leadoff.

 

I personally think those days are behind him. We have better options in Aoki and Segura in those spots, and with them both being second year players, Rickie had better learn how to produce lower down in the order.

 

Agreed. While Rickie's OBP will go up, as I expect he'll start taking some more walks (I think he's just trying to get his swing on track), Segura creates a nightmare scenario for opposing pitchers. Jean is really fast. I mean really, really fast. The chances that either Jean or Nori are going to be on (or both) when the Hebrew Hammer comes up are pretty damned good, and their speed adds something else that pitchers have to worry about. Ignore the runner on first, there's a good chance that they're going to be standing on second in a minute (with only a small chance that they'll be back at first again in a few minutes. Sorry, Jean, I had to . Pay too much attention to the guy at first, and you lay a nice fat breaking pitch a little high, or your fastball gets up, and #8 is trotting around the bases.

 

I think Ideally, when our horses get back, the lineup should now look like this:

 

1. Aoki in right

2. Segura short

3. Murder incorporated in left

4. A Ram at third

5. Luc behind the plate

6. Hart at first

7. Gomez in center

8. Weeks at second

9. the guy on the mound

 

If Rickie gets his game going, I really like him at #8. Why? Because he can be like another leadoff hitter, and he's actually started stealing some bases again. And he seems to perform much better in low pressure situations.

 

If Rickie can get on to start an inning, you get an out from the pitcher, then you have two .375 OBP guys with speed up next. That's a lot of guys up for Braun and Ramirez.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Agree 100%, stache.

[DHonks]

personally, as long as we continue winning, I don't want him to change. Yes I'm getting superstitious now, but considering a week ago this team was being left for dead, let's go with it

[Noche]

Making changes based off of 2-3 weeks of at bats are what fans are famous for.