Burgos Coming up?

[Ennder]

Leaving Fiers in the bullpen in the majors and not using him could 'ruin' him, sending him to AAA to get his control back in a less stressful environment won't ruin him. We will need at least 6 and probably at least 7 starters so you need to get him turned around for when he is definitely needed.

[MNBrew]

I do think they should give Fiers more than one start to see if he can turn things around, but it looks to me (assuming this rumor is true) that Fiers has been banished to AAAA purgatory.

Fiers hasn't done much good at all since the first time they put a ball in his hands in ST. If he's getting sent down, it's not with the intent to banish him, but for him to get on track -- to go "find his game" again -- because unlike Narveson at the moment and of course Rogers, he's at least healthy, which means they may well need to rely on him at another point this season, especially if Peralta & anyone who replaces Fiers in the MLB rotation struggle.

 

He did well enough in MIL for long enough last year that it would be hard to imagine the Brewers just figuring he's done and no longer a potentially valuable asset.

[Roderick]

I think the whole idea of blowing someone's confidence is way overblown.

 

I would suggest that you read up sports psychology if you really believe that to be true. The only difference between players of similar natural ability performing or not is whatever is going on in their head and baseball is tough to deal with, it's the only sport where everyone fails a constant rate. The difference between a great hitter offensive player and poor offensive player is only .1... 10%, think about how talented/good all professional baseball players in the majors or not really are.

 

Seems to me if the player isn't mentally tough enough to handle being sent to AAA to work on his stuff, then you trust him to react well with the pressure of the playoffs? If Fiers was really young, sure I manage his confidence. It is past that point. He can handle it or he can't, be nice to find out before he is put in a more pressure situation in the big leagues.

[homer]

I think by a the time a player goes through the minors the weak minded ones get weeded out.

 

 

Agreed.

[monty57]

I do think they should give Fiers more than one start to see if he can turn things around, but it looks to me (assuming this rumor is true) that Fiers has been banished to AAAA purgatory.

Fiers hasn't done much good at all since the first time they put a ball in his hands in ST. If he's getting sent down, it's not with the intent to banish him, but for him to get on track -- to go "find his game" again -- because unlike Narveson at the moment and of course Rogers, he's at least healthy, which means they may well need to rely on him at another point this season, especially if Peralta & anyone who replaces Fiers in the MLB rotation struggle.

 

He did well enough in MIL for long enough last year that it would be hard to imagine the Brewers just figuring he's done and no longer a potentially valuable asset.

 

I just slipped that last line in quick because I had to run. Basically, what I was saying is that the Brewers realize Fiers is a back-of-the-rotation guy. He's going to be bounced around a lot, always fighting for that last spot in the rotation. When he's the best option, he'll be in the rotation, but he'll get yanked when he's not performing or someone looks like a better option. At some point in the next couple of years, he will be out of options and the Brewers should have a number of guys who are more talented than he, so he will either be moved to the bullpen or he'll go to a team without as much pitching depth that is looking for a back-of-the-rotation starter.

 

That's what I meant by "AAAA purgatory." There are plenty of fringe players who find themselves in this situation. Some bounce back & forth, some never get the call, and some always seem to find a place on a MLB roster. Fiers did have some "lightning in the bottle" when he came up last year, so that can work to his advantage. If this were the Brewer farm system for most of its existence, he would probably be in the rotation for the next five years. However, we have more physically gifted players than him coming up through the minors that are probably going to push him out of the rotation before too long. He'll most likely get more opportunities to start for the Brewers, so I hope he's able to "prove himself" enough as a MLB starter over the short-term that the Brewers may be able to flip him for a useful piece when he's no longer one of the best options for the rotation.

[PrinceEatMeat]

Adam McCalvy ‏@AdamMcCalvy 2m

#Brewers will make a player move tomorrow or early Sat. to get a starter for middle game vs. Cubs. Thornburg, Burgos possibilities.

[torts]

didnt they sort of mess with thornburg last year by bringing him up to pitch out of the bullpen, then rtoation, then pen, back to minors and back into the rotation? really hope that they just stick to the rotation for him in AAA/MLB and dont mess up his rhythm

[PrinceEatMeat]

Roenicke also basically confirmed that they won't use the 5th starter again until the 30th after Saturday, so that may factor in. Whoever it is will need to be in the pen for a bit.

[jjgott]

Whoever it is will need to be in the pen for a bit.

 

Not necessarily. They could just send Burgos/Thornburg/whoever down after the game and bring up a more traditional RP like Olmsted or Hand.

[Outlander]

I hope that is the case as I really don't want Thornburg (or Burgos) to be misused like last year.

[PrinceEatMeat]

Whoever it is will need to be in the pen for a bit.

 

Not necessarily. They could just send Burgos/Thornburg/whoever down after the game and bring up a more traditional RP like Olmsted or Hand.

 

I doubt it since they couldn't then call them back up for the next start, because they'd have to be down 10 days which would be until May 1st. I suppose they could use Burgos for the first start and Thornburg for the next, or vice versa.

[folly412]

Whoever it is will need to be in the pen for a bit.

 

Not necessarily. They could just send Burgos/Thornburg/whoever down after the game and bring up a more traditional RP like Olmsted or Hand.

 

Yep, that's the best move. Probably won't be Hand yet since they'd have to make a 40-man move, but could be Sanchez.

[torts]

Whoever it is will need to be in the pen for a bit.

 

Not necessarily. They could just send Burgos/Thornburg/whoever down after the game and bring up a more traditional RP like Olmsted or Hand.

 

Yep, that's the best move. Probably won't be Hand yet since they'd have to make a 40-man move, but could be Sanchez.

 

or Olmstead

[djoctagone]

I doubt it since they couldn't then call them back up for the next start, because they'd have to be down 10 days which would be until May 1st. I suppose they could use Burgos for the first start and Thornburg for the next, or vice versa.

if fiers is sent down today, his 10th day in the minors would be 28 april.

[LouisEly]

The last thing you want to do with young players is get them looking over their shoulders putting extra pressure on themselves to perform... "a bad outing or 2 and back to the minors for you!" If the player is fixated on "not failing" they are really fixated on "failure" and that's exactly what they will get or do... that's just basic sports psychology and the primary reason I never tell anyone "not" to do something. Like the fielder running down a ball thinking "I'd better not drop this" and what happens? They drop the ball. It's the same for receivers in football or someone shooting a layup in basketball... if you think about not screwing up, you screw up.

 

That is basic life psychology. People Management 101. Those who manage people by fear of failure will be less successful.

[LouisEly]

I would suggest that you read up sports psychology if you really believe that to be true.

 

I coached for over 25 years all the way from kindergarten kids to college kids. I have gone to countless seminars and read plenty to keep up on things like motivation and teaching. While each level is different there in one common thread. Every level up you go increases the amount of personal accountability the athlete is expected to assume. By the time kids got to college they were expected to handle being told the truth about where they are and where they need to be. I don't see why adults making literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to produce results would somehow need to be treated more gently than a college sophomore.

 

The point isn't that players shouldn't be sent down to the minors. The point is that young players shouldn't be sent down because of the results of a small sample of starts/ABs/etc. Unless there is an obvious mechanical flaw or the player's confidence is shot, they should be given time to succeed - that is what builds their confidence. Three starts isn't a large enough sample to judge results.

[Patrick425]

Would like to see what Burgos can do. Thought he looked good in the WBC.

 

Hey Louis..check your messages. Sent you PM about the tix you are selling for Saturday's game.

[djoctagone]

mike fiers has been optioned.

[PrinceEatMeat]

I doubt it since they couldn't then call them back up for the next start, because they'd have to be down 10 days which would be until May 1st. I suppose they could use Burgos for the first start and Thornburg for the next, or vice versa.

if fiers is sent down today, his 10th day in the minors would be 28 april.

 

If 2 minor league starts are enough to get him right, then yes, he'd be an option as well.

[brewcrewdue80]

Well, the rain out yesterday puts Thornburg in the picture whereas Burgos on Saturday would be pitching on 4days rest. Pushing Thornburg and everyone back 1 day due to rain out puts Thornburg's turn on Saturday then Burgos on Sunday.

Either way I approve the move to send Fiers down and let 1 of these two get their chance to shine. Fiers hasn't been right for awhile now. And rather than continue getting shelled in the bigs, I'm hoping he overmatches the AAA hitters and finds his groove.

It's just better to see Fiers work through this down there vs. giving up 4-7Runs in under 4ip and less than 90pitch outing when removed from the carnage. Hoping he goes down gets 90pitch outings pitching in to the 7th innings.

Meanwhile Thornburg or Burgos can just continue with 5-6ip outings like they do at AAA and if they ever got in to the 7th inning that has to be a huge confidence builder on either.

I only see positives by doing this. Fiers will either work himself from his funk or not but it's not damaging the big club anymore. The club gives experience to Burgos/Thornburg and like in the basketball anology if they mess up you sit them down tell them what went wrong work on it, send then back up. They'll at least have more video to digest vs Big League competition and how to improve upon it. Fiers has that, Thornburg has some, it's time Burgos gets some.

[torts]

and if burgos and thornburg get hammered, its not like it'd be any different if Feirs had remained in that rotation spot

[PrinceEatMeat]

Tom ‏@Haudricourt 1m

#Brewers announce they have recalled RHP Hiram Burgos from Class AAA Nashville. He will start Saturday against the Cubs.

[PrinceEatMeat]

http://brewersbeat.mlblogs.com/2013/04/18/burgos-set-for-saturday-debut-fiers-sent-out/

 

This sheds some more light on the next time a 5th starter will be needed. Seems like it'll be between Burgos and Fiers.

 

"Fiers was told to prepare for at least two Triple-A starts, the first on Saturday if Mother Nature will stop meddling with the Sounds schedule. Then, the Brewers, who will not need Burgos again after Saturday until April 30, will re-evaluate their options."

[bork]

Burgos is the 4th member of the 2009 draft to make it to the Brewers. Not bad considering how poorly the top picks have done.

[torts]

Burgos is the 4th member of the 2009 draft to make it to the Brewers. Not bad considering how poorly the top picks have done.

 

who are the others so I dont have to look it up