Rick Kranitz

[adambr2]

ERA's:

 

Axford - 24.30

Badenhop - 7.36

Gonzalez - 11.57

Gallardo - 6.61

Fiers - 10.80

 

2012 Bullpen ranking: 26th

2013 Bullpen ranking 30th

 

2008 total pitching (with Baltimore) : 29th

2009 total pitching (with Baltimore) : 30th

 

Can somebody tell me how this guy still has a job? Outside of a couple good months last year by some new young pitchers that the rest of the league had never seen?

 

And please don't say he hasn't been given any talent to work with. Part of the team promotion last year included multiple ads of our bullpen basically saying that we had the best back two in the bullpen in baseball and leads after the 7th inning were almost a foregone conclusion.

[umphrey]

What's the team ERA? I'm sure it's bad, but it would be more accurate compared to gaudy reliever ERAs weighted by low IP.

[BrewersSuperCollector]

Its Stan Kyles fault.

[DHonks]

What about his other years as pitching coach? 2011?

 

Just my usual response in that the season's really long and there's no need to panic. It's frustrating that this is longer than any bad streak we had last year, but this team is a shell of the team it will be for 2/3rds of the season.

[TooLiveBrew]

What about his other years as pitching coach? 2011?

It's almost like pitchers' performances come down to the pitchers & not the coach...

[JackNicholson1974]

This is on Melvin.

[JackNicholson1974]

This is on Melvin. The pitchers too.

[logan82]

I blame Bill Castro. He's still with the team right?

[Invader3K]

I blame Bill Castro. He's still with the team right?

 

FIRE WYNEGAR!!!

[brewmann04]

What Rick Petterson up too these days.

[Ennder]

There was no reason to think our bullpen would be good last year or this year.

[adambr2]

Based on what?

 

As I recall, most were very excited to have K-Rod and Axford for the 8th and 9th. I don't think anyone thought it would be a complete disaster, that's for sure.

[MNBrew]

The bullpen was totally overhauled other than Axford. Everyone who stunk last year is gone. Henderson & Kintzler were fine & Axford was great for 4 out of 6 months last year. The new guys were quite successful last year. . . . So by what logic were we surely doomed to a crap bullpen again?

 

On the original topic, I don't know that Kranitz truly has much to brag about on his resume, but I also don't think this is his fault. Was Mike Maddux suddenly inept when Gallardo struggled or Sheets kept breaking down on his watch? When Yo & others were great under Maddux & Suppan was putrid, was Maddux inconsistent?

 

In the middle of a half-decent season, a stretch like this only gets most folks this antsy about this deep into it. When it happens to open the season, everything's magnified & multiplied exponentially. Pitchers have to pitch a no-hitter for the team to have a chance based on how the badly slumping offense is going. Heck, Aoki & Braun & Segura have been hitting like crazy 'til we hit the St. Louis Buzzsaw, but that didn't much matter b/c no one else was at all, so the pitchers feel like they have to be perfect & the hitters are "gripping the bat too tightly" and . . . this is clearly no one person's fault (and not Melvin's either, thank you those of you who feel like he's the root of all evil for this team).

 

I still maintain that they're not nearly this bad of a team and I'd rather deal with a stretch like this now than later -- doesn't make is stink any less, but it's still how I feel about it.

[TooLiveBrew]

Henderson & Kintzler were fine & Axford was great for 4 out of 6 months last year.

Axford in 2012 --

 

April: 4.70 ERA

May: 2.31

June: 9.00

July: 4.70

August: 5.79

September: 2.93

 

He was good for 2 out of 6 months, and awful for the rest.

[TURBO]

There was no reason to think our bullpen would be good last year or this year.

 

 

Actually, according to 2011, we had K-Rod for the 8th and Axford for the 9th in 2012. What about 2011 led you to believe our bullpen was going to be as bad as it was in 2012?

 

Hindsight is 20/20 man, you can't possibly claim you saw the 2012 meltdown coming.

[TheCrew07]

Well there was plenty of evidence that K-Rod was pretty much washed up, he wasn't able to hit spots anymore and basically got by on good fortune at the end of 2011. When was the last time a catcher setup in a spot and K-Rod actually put the ball there?

 

Guys like him who torque so much their momentum pulls them off violently towards 1B as they finish their delivery to home plate scare me. There's way too much garbage when your body, elbow, and shoulder are all working in different planes. Some younger great athletes can make the muscle adjustments necessary to locate with that kind of delivery but must of those guys are just "effectively wild" and get by on pure stuff. K-Rod's breaking stuff is still plus, but his FB isn't, and I wouldn't take him back regardless of cost.

 

There were plenty of posters that didn't want him back at any price, myself being one.

[Ennder]

There was no reason to think our bullpen would be good last year or this year.

 

 

Actually, according to 2011, we had K-Rod for the 8th and Axford for the 9th in 2012. What about 2011 led you to believe our bullpen was going to be as bad as it was in 2012?

 

Hindsight is 20/20 man, you can't possibly claim you saw the 2012 meltdown coming.

 

We have been over this before and I dug up my thoughts on it then, I won't do it again. I did not think the bullpen would be good going into 2011, I thought one of Axford and KRod would be good and the rest of the bullpen looked like a bunch of crud. Going into 2012 I thought it would likely derail the team. I thought in 2011 we would have trouble getting into the 9th, I didn't expect the 9th would be the big issue. We had a weak bullpen last year, we have one of the worst in baseball this year. Everyone kept saying the bullpen was a strength going into 2011 and I was quite verbal that it wouldn't be.

[joepepsi]

we have one of the worst in baseball this year. /quote] Usually I appreciate your astute and reasoned observations. This seems like hyperbole. I don't like Gonzalez much, but the rest of the pen should be solid, if we have a manager that can manage it. If we don't have that, well, it wouldn't matter who's sitting out there in the 'pen.

[Ennder]

Usually I appreciate your astute and reasoned observations. This seems like hyperbole. I don't like Gonzalez much, but the rest of the pen should be solid, if we have a manager that can manage it. If we don't have that, well, it wouldn't matter who's sitting out there in the 'pen.

 

 

We just disagree then. Bandehop is basically Loe but with luck on ERA last year. I have no faith at all in Kintzler or Figaro. Gonzalez showed the same skills last year as he did in the previous two seasons where he had a 4+ ERA. I think Axford is going to be erratic all year. Gorzelanny and Henderson are my two hopes for something usable in the bullpen.

[adambr2]

So is it a Kranitz problem for not getting the most out of the talent he has, or a Melvin/scouting problem for not providing enough talent?

 

I'm very frustrated with the performance of our rotation -- I don't see the hype about Peralta so far, Gallardo and Estrada are clearly underachieving, and Fiers has been essentially forgotten.

 

We are, once again, dead last in the NL in pitching as far as runs allowed and ERA, batting average against, you name it. We have a major pitching problem. I don't know what the solution is. While I'm not going to claim this is our most talented pitching staff ever, it's very frustrating that the Cardinals can seemingly employ a revolving door of pitchers and not miss a beat, while we are at the opposite end of the spectrum. I can't help but feel that a more competent pitching coach would get more out of our pitchers.

[Warning Track Power]

So is it a Kranitz problem for not getting the most out of the talent he has, or a Melvin/scouting problem for not providing enough talent?

 

I'm very frustrated with the performance of our rotation -- I don't see the hype about Peralta so far, Gallardo and Estrada are clearly underachieving, and Fiers has been essentially forgotten.

 

We are, once again, dead last in the NL in pitching as far as runs allowed and ERA, batting average against, you name it. We have a major pitching problem. I don't know what the solution is. While I'm not going to claim this is our most talented pitching staff ever, it's very frustrating that the Cardinals can seemingly employ a revolving door of pitchers and not miss a beat, while we are at the opposite end of the spectrum. I can't help but feel that a more competent pitching coach would get more out of our pitchers.

Amen Adam. Amen. I would take it a step further as well to say if Rogers & Peralta hadn't pitched out of their minds over the final 1/4 of the season last season, we would already have a new pitching coach. Watching our pitchers just feels like a steady line of regression in the middle years of their careers. Guys like Gallardo & Axford are still in their prime and still have the same "stuff" they have always had. So what's the deal with the lost velocity and inability to get guys out all of a sudden? To me, this screams mechanics.

[Ennder]

We actually had completely average starting pitching last year and our peripherals were better than average, the park likely hurt us there.

 

This year we have played 7 games against bottom offenses and 17 games against top offenses, it is more of a competition issue than a pitching issue though the pitching is still pretty average. We have 3 more games against good offenses this month and then only 6 games against good offenses all of June. I imagine by the end of June our pitching will miraculously recovered and look pretty average again.

[adambr2]

I think going into last year with Greinke, Marcum, and Yo at the top of the rotation, expectations were certainly more than to have "average" starting pitching.

 

Even after Greinke was gone, it took unsustainable performances from Fiers, Rogers, and Peralta to end up at the average mark.

 

I expect the rotation to rise, but the multitude of question marks after Yo/Lohse (I expect Yo to improve) makes me doubt they'll be average again this year, which is what they'll need if we're going to be a playoff team.

 

Unfortunately, as the rotation rises, the bullpen is likely to fall a bit as they're unlikely to sustain what they've done so far this year.

[Ennder]

Unfortunately, as the rotation rises, the bullpen is likely to fall a bit as they're unlikely to sustain what they've done so far this year.

 

I don't disagree with this but it certainly is depressing considering how mediocre they have been so far.

 

Even after Greinke was gone, it took unsustainable performances from Fiers, Rogers, and Peralta to end up at the average mark.

 

Combine Rogers and Peralta with Wolf's stats and you probably get about what was expected from those slots. Fiers is likely sustainable to be honest. I'd expect him to sit in the high 3 low 4 if he gets back in the rotation.

[JohnBriggs12]

I'm a lone voice I realize, but I still think this rotation will end up being average, and that means there are going to be stretches where they are very good. Pitchers get in slumps and sometimes it becomes contagious. They may have to tweak things a bit and shuffle guys in and out of a spot a few times, but it's a long season. They've gotten nothing out of Narveson yet but before it's over I think he will contribute. Lohse is about where I expected. Gallardo needs to pick it up. Peralta is throwing the ball a lot better than his ERA suggests. Estrada seemed to figure some things out with a little break. Judging Burgos off a 10 day layoff isn't realistic. Fiers could re-emerge too.