It's RONNICKY!

[GenoSeligPrieb]

With all due props to whoever came up with RRR, I wish I would have thought of this, but so far today, on The Big Show, guest host LeRoy Butler keeps calling our milquetoast, Yost-Ian field leader, "Ronnicky"

 

Nice!

 

By the way, given his stubborn, unwavering support for an obvious failure in Axford, his refusal to try minor leaguers at the expense of more playing time for proven-bad veterans, Ronnicky is now up there in the pantheon of Brewer managers with Ol Scrap Iron & Ned

 

His wimpiness against St Louis in the 2011 playoffs started it for me. Last night confirmed it. We need a new pitching coach, first, then I'd be open to a new skipper next season...except he somehow was rewarded with a new-ish contract.

[Oxy]

Just remember that everybody's favorite by the numbers manager, Macha, underperformed more than any manager I can remember. Meanwhile, RRR and his crazy aggressive baserunning led the league in runs scored last year, despite all those outs on the bases. I'm sure he was just lucky, though.

[dlk9s]

Geno seems perturbed.

[TooLiveBrew]

Geno seems perturbed.

All is right in the Brewersverse

[GenoSeligPrieb]

He wasn't just lucky. I'll freely admit that the offense was wonderful last year. And yes, Ronnicky deserves credit for that aspect of our team's performance. But with all that production, we could have been a playoff team, right?

 

It's just that this season, he's mismanaging the team by leaving himself short on bench options with the 13-man staff. Kyle Lohse as a pinch hitter with the game on the line? Continuing to send Axford out there in game-defining situations? Leaving Jesus H Khrys Davis & Schafer to rot on the bench with AGon & Maldonado hitting < .200 out there?

 

Ronnicky may not be awful yet, but you can't be satisfied with his handling of Axford, can you?

[bjkrautk]

If you assume that RRR wanted Figaro to close last night's game, then Axford was as good an option as the remaining alternatives:

- Narveson moved to the DL

- Kintzler got cuffed around the day before

- Henderson and Gorzellany had pitched in consecutive games, and were unavailable (presumably but-for extra innings)

- Gonzalez was already used as a LOOGY in prior to Axford finishing off the 7th inning (...and gave up a hit)

 

 

...that leaves Axford and Badenhop (who had also given up runs in his last two appearances, and is carrying an ERA over 8).

 

In that circumstance, is the right answer to pitch Figaro 2 innings and hope for the best, or go with the guy who just left a runner stranded to end the previous inning? I have a hard time second-guessing a decision when I don't see a "good" alternative being bypassed.

[torts]

unreal radio show today

[GenoSeligPrieb]

Ben, I'll readily spot you Narvy, for obvious injury reasons. But I don't see Mike Gonzalez as a LOOGY just yet. He's not THAT old. And Badenhop would have been a better choice too. Could Fiers have been used, now that his next turn or 2 will be skipped? I also thought Tom Gorgonzola was a starter recently. Maybe he should be a long man.

 

ANYONE but our fragile little butterfly Axford, is a better option right now. I'd like to see us call up a minor leaguer, even. At this point, Double-A guys might be less scared

 

When Ronnicky sent him out there again for that 2nd inning, after his confidence was raised a fraction by that scoreless 1/3rd of an inning, I started to skip through it on DirecTV out of fear of what was next. Sadly, I was proven right

 

He'll, I'm not even recording tonight's game. It comes down to who I'd rather watch - John Axford or Sarah Hyland from Modern Family

 

That's an easy call....

[Outlander]

I'll agree with you that he is not a LOOGY as Gonzalez can't get any lefty out either.

[danzig6767]

If you assume that RRR wanted Figaro to close last night's game, then Axford was as good an option as the remaining alternatives:

- Narveson moved to the DL

- Kintzler got cuffed around the day before

- Henderson and Gorzellany had pitched in consecutive games, and were unavailable (presumably but-for extra innings)

- Gonzalez was already used as a LOOGY in prior to Axford finishing off the 7th inning (...and gave up a hit)

 

 

...that leaves Axford and Badenhop (who had also given up runs in his last two appearances, and is carrying an ERA over 8).

 

In that circumstance, is the right answer to pitch Figaro 2 innings and hope for the best, or go with the guy who just left a runner stranded to end the previous inning? I have a hard time second-guessing a decision when I don't see a "good" alternative being bypassed.

 

I would have preferred Badenhop simply because he can be counted on more to not walk guys, but your point is grounded in some truth.

 

The whole bullpen has been bad and with Henderson/Gorzellany unavailable, Ronny was choosing between only a couple of unappealing options. It's to the point at least right now that non-roster invitee Figaro is becoming one of the best options in a close game and he's mostly just a one pitch pitcher. We finally get a loogy and now Gonzalez forgot how to get lefties out. Badenhop has been terrible. The only pitches Axford can get over the plate end up splitting the center of the plate.

 

Granted, the sample sizes are small this early in the year, but man, between the injuries and nearly everyone in the bullpen struggling, the chances if digging a big hole early in the season is a real bummer.

[Baldkin]

Just remember that everybody's favorite by the numbers manager, Macha, underperformed more than any manager I can remember. Meanwhile, RRR and his crazy aggressive baserunning led the league in runs scored last year, despite all those outs on the bases. I'm sure he was just lucky, though.

 

What? Underperformed? Please to explain how they underperformed. They finished 3rd and 4th in the NL in runs scored in 2009/2010. The fault was clearly not his for assembling the horrid pitching staff. Funny, how when they went from Jeff Suppan and Dave Bush to Zack Greinke and Shaun Marcum, that somehow made RRR into a genius.

[logan82]

I am sticking with Dread Pirate Roenicke.

[brewmann04]

Wow your telling me we have a pitching coach.

[Thurston Fluff]

What? Underperformed? Please to explain how they underperformed. They finished 3rd and 4th in the NL in runs scored in 2009/2010. The fault was clearly not his for assembling the horrid pitching staff.

 

I would counter that the last two Brewer teams over performed. You seem to be defending Macha for not underperforming but giving no credit for RRR when his teams overperformed. As far as the pitching goes which group of pitchers helped get the Brewers over .500 last season? Hint it wasn't Narveson, Greinke, Marcum and Wolf. Nor was it their awesome bullpen.

[xisxisxis]

I would counter that the last two Brewer teams over performed.

 

In the golden age of brewerfan.net making an assertion without anything like data to back it up lead to someone challenging them quickly that they were, well, full of it. As someone who is getting old and misses the good old days maybe you could buck the new trend and actually provide some facts to back up your contention.

 

 

What? Underperformed? Please to explain how they underperformed.

 

Yes you should ignore the dramatic change in the pitching staff and just look at the final record. We won more games with RRR than Macha. Therefore, RRR is a better manager. I think my logic 100 teacher just had a slight stroke...

[Thurston Fluff]

In the golden age of brewerfan.net making an assertion without anything like data to back it up lead to someone challenging them quickly that they were, well, full of it.

I think I gave as much evidence as Baldkin did about Macha. Or is it only necessary when defending RRR? Frankly I don't ever remember anyone giving any study at all about what categorically makes someone a good or bad manager. No ranking in importance of strategy vs player management or anything like it. Usually it just ends up the same old he didn't play so and so here or there or why did he bunt there type of stuff. Which is all fine and dandy except it doesn't really mean much if that is as insignificant as I think it is. So perhaps the whole under perform or over perform thing isn't really evidence based anyway. Just excuses for someone if you like his style and blame for someone whom you don't.

In fairness I should have pointed out that they were not projected to win 96 games two seasons ago. I don't remember what they were projected to win last season but I seriously doubt anyone would have projected above .500 for a team that lost four of it's five starters by mid season. I could be wrong on that though. If you felt those replacement pitchers were enough to get the team to 90 wins or something please show me some reason why.

Yes you should ignore the dramatic change in the pitching staff and just look at the final record. We won more games with RRR than Macha. Therefore, RRR is a better manager. I think my logic 100 teacher just had a slight stroke...

 

If someone was making that argument your sarcasm might be better placed. As someone who remembers the good old days, straw man arguments tended to be challenged as well.

[H4P]

Meh with logic. Ronnicky is crappity. I have been drinking.

[Thurston Fluff]

I looked at where the team ranked in ERA last season compared to 2010. It was 13th for both teams. So much for Macha's crappy pitching staff excuse.

[Baldkin]

Last year, they gave up 4.52 runs per game.

2010 they gave up 4.96 runs per game.

2009 they gave up 5.05 runs per game.

 

Last year they scored 4.79 runs per game. (+.28 runs/game difference)

2010 they scored 4.63 runs per game. (-.33 runs/game difference)

2009 they scored 4.85 runs per game. (-.20 runs/game difference)

[thebruce44]

Just remember that everybody's favorite by the numbers manager, Macha, underperformed more than any manager I can remember. Meanwhile, RRR and his crazy aggressive baserunning led the league in runs scored last year, despite all those outs on the bases. I'm sure he was just lucky, though.

 

I'll give you a manager Macha outperformed since you can't seem to remember one. I'll give you a hint, he's our current manager.

 

Don't confuse success with managerial performance.

[Thurston Fluff]

Last year, they gave up 4.52 runs per game.

2010 they gave up 4.96 runs per game.

2009 they gave up 5.05 runs per game.

 

Last year they scored 4.79 runs per game. (+.28 runs/game difference)

2010 they scored 4.63 runs per game. (-.33 runs/game difference)

2009 they scored 4.85 runs per game. (-.20 runs/game difference)

 

 

I don't know how useful it is to treat the value of raw numbers in different season's as the same. Runs throughout the league were down last season. 683 runs per team compared to 701 in 2010 and 718 in 2009. That is why I compared each team to how it did vs other teams in the same season. I think that gives us more of an apples to apples comparison when looking at relative effectiveness. I think RRR's staff of 2011 somehow gets counted for the success of 2012. That simply isn't the case. The 2012 staff was terrible overall. As bad relative to other teams as Macha's staff. So why does Macha get a pass and RRR doesn't?

[Baldkin]

Last year, they gave up 4.52 runs per game.

2010 they gave up 4.96 runs per game.

2009 they gave up 5.05 runs per game.

 

Last year they scored 4.79 runs per game. (+.28 runs/game difference)

2010 they scored 4.63 runs per game. (-.33 runs/game difference)

2009 they scored 4.85 runs per game. (-.20 runs/game difference)

 

 

I don't know how useful it is to treat the value of raw numbers in different season's as the same. Runs throughout the league were down last season. 683 runs per team compared to 701 in 2010 and 718 in 2009. That is why I compared each team to how it did vs other teams in the same season. I think that gives us more of an apples to apples comparison when looking at relative effectiveness. I think RRR's staff of 2011 somehow gets counted for the success of 2012. That simply isn't the case. The 2012 staff was terrible overall. As bad relative to other teams as Macha's staff. So why does Macha get a pass and RRR doesn't?

 

How about this ERA+:

2009 ERA+: 85

2010: 88

2012: 98

 

So, they weren't nearly as bad as Macha's staffs. Not even close.

My entire point is, Macha get's a horrible rap. Sure, RRR is fine, I don't really think managers are worth anything unless you get a really good one. I just hate the idea that he is some genius. For example: his Loogy, through 7 whole games, already has 2x as many PA's vs RHB as LHB.

[Thurston Fluff]

Good point on the ERA+. I think a lot of people like this style of play but I really don't see a lot of comparisons to Tony LaRussa or anything close to genius status here. For myself I think communication is the main factor in managerial success over the long haul. How one uses a loogy is way down the list of importance for me. That is why I like RRR more than I liked Macha. That doesn't mean I hated Macha just that I like the traits of RRR better.

[TooLiveBrew]

Roenicke seems, to me, to basically be your standard big-league-lifer manager. Makes the same types of decisions most managers do, plays essentially the same strategy, doesn't really innovate. I agree that he's a good communicator, and the players definitely seem to like him a lot. And beyond keeping channels of communication open in the clubhouse, he also handles the press pretty well; I think both of those aspects have value.

 

There were reports & implications that the players didn't like Macha, and he always came across as quite aloof. I thought Macha handled the bullpen pretty well, and I liked his lack of interest in small ball. So even though he was the tactically superior manager for me, if you lose the players you probably aren't right for the job anymore.

 

I agree with Baldkin that Roenicke is your standard MLB manager. So in that context, he's not really hurting (or helping) the club. But I do hope the Brewers are eventually able to find someone with the tactical ability of Macha with even just an average amount of charisma.

[adambr2]

Just remember that everybody's favorite by the numbers manager, Macha, underperformed more than any manager I can remember. Meanwhile, RRR and his crazy aggressive baserunning led the league in runs scored last year, despite all those outs on the bases. I'm sure he was just lucky, though.

 

His opening day starter in 2010 was Jeff Suppan. Not sure how anyone could have expected that team to top 80 wins.