Braun, Biogenesis and the Whole Crazy Thing

[JohnBriggs12]

Some of the talking heads (Heyman, Buster, etc.) talk about the joint agreement not requiring a failed drug test to suspend a player if there is other evidence. I don't really have a problem with MLB pursuing Braun or A-Rod or anyone, really.

 

If the evidence is there, they'll get suspended. If not, they won't. And I think it would hammer the point home to players of all skill level that MLB is serious. If they're willing to go after two greats, they'll go after anyone. Nobody gets a free pass because they're an All Star.

 

The only evidence someone took something is a drug test. MLB pursuing "other evidence" is an admission that their testing is inadequate. Since this firm also apparently sold approved products, proving that someone engaged in commerce with it, doesn't prove anything either and it's unlikely that they'd keep detailed records of the illegal stuff. Names written on a piece of paper evidence? Really?? Some minor leaguer who knows Braun throwing him under the bus to save his career? Dubious at best.

[DocLuna7]

Some of the talking heads (Heyman, Buster, etc.) talk about the joint agreement not requiring a failed drug test to suspend a player if there is other evidence. I don't really have a problem with MLB pursuing Braun or A-Rod or anyone, really.

 

If the evidence is there, they'll get suspended. If not, they won't. And I think it would hammer the point home to players of all skill level that MLB is serious. If they're willing to go after two greats, they'll go after anyone. Nobody gets a free pass because they're an All Star.

 

The only evidence someone took something is a drug test. MLB pursuing "other evidence" is an admission that their testing is inadequate. Since this firm also apparently sold approved products, proving that someone engaged in commerce with it, doesn't prove anything either and it's unlikely that they'd keep detailed records of the illegal stuff. Names written on a piece of paper evidence? Really?? Some minor leaguer who knows Braun throwing him under the bus to save his career? Dubious at best.

 

There is not even evidence that the minor leaguer who knows Braun even threw him under the bus. Since MLB arbitrarily suspended him for an additional 50 games for being uncooperative, perhaps he was in fact suspended for not making up or confirming a story about his "best friend" Ryan Braun even using at all.

[Dragonbait]

At some point does it become Defamation? I only ask because I'm not sure...

[young guns]

Nobody gets a free pass because they're an All Star.

 

But you can have a free pass if you help us nab that all-star. That is the problem with what they are doing. Their goal should be to catch all cheaters, but when they choose to offer immunity like that, it shows they have a vendetta. To me, their integrity is shot.

[splitterpfj]

MLB is saying they're investigating all of the players in the Biogenesis files equally, which is as it should be. If Braun did it, and they can PROVE it, I have no problem with a suspension.

 

I think this thing has been badly mishandled, I don't think MLB should have fired the arbitrator, and I don't think they should have released the harsh statement when Braun won his appeal. They were within their right in both cases, etc, I just disagree with both decisions.

 

I don't see a hero in this story, the only question is, who looks bad, and who looks worse?

[lcbj68c]

As for Bud's statue, I'm not advocating vandalism, but a few placards attached to it might get the point across.

 

Fluff that....I'm all for heading down to Gillies...hanging out for a few hours until the right time presents itself for their favorite customer to get a piece of my mind. Messing with his statue only sends a message to the Brewers...I'm all for going to the horses mouth.

[xisxisxis]

I'm all for going to the horses mouth.

 

Then walk to the other end if you want to get a word with Bud.....

[lcbj68c]

I'm all for going to the horses mouth.

 

Then walk to the other end if you want to get a word with Bud.....

 

:Zing:

[splitterpfj]

"Sources", (my, but they've been busy) believe Bosch destroyed all remaining PED-related documents from his clinic.

[splitterpfj]

This Tweet from T.J. Quinn of ESPN...

 

MLB to file suit v Tony Bosch & Biogenesis for interference. Know they can't recover $, but want to subpoena docs. NYT posted first. Salut.

[splitterpfj]

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/eye-on-baseball/21926724/report-mlb-plans-to-sue-bosch-and-others-connected-to-biogenesis

[Ennder]

This reeks of desperation.

[Schlitz001]

What sort of player would come forward for immunity anyway? We all know that MLB can't keep anything private. If someone comes forward, and that info is leaked, that player is going to look like a snitch and also look guilty for seeking immunity. This is not going to work. This whole thing is just sour grapes by MLB after Braunie beat the system.

[JimH5]

This Tweet from T.J. Quinn of ESPN...

 

MLB to file suit v Tony Bosch & Biogenesis for interference. Know they can't recover $, but want to subpoena docs. NYT posted first. Salut.

 

One man's overreach is another man's due diligence.

 

I really like that they're going to all measures instead of just throwing their hands in the air.

[Ennder]

This Tweet from T.J. Quinn of ESPN...

 

MLB to file suit v Tony Bosch & Biogenesis for interference. Know they can't recover $, but want to subpoena docs. NYT posted first. Salut.

 

One man's overreach is another man's due diligence.

 

I really like that they're going to all measures instead of just throwing their hands in the air.

 

Considering they stand almost no chance of succeeding it just seems like throwing money away more than anything. I guess it is good PR to placate fans.

[Patrick425]

Is there a precedent for this? Could a company be successful in a lawsuit going after a drug dealer that was targeting employees of their company?

 

I agree with JimH that MLB needs to do everything in it's power to weed out every cheater. I wonder how many on this board would feel about this whole situation if was Yadiar Molina instead of Ryan Braun that was involved in all the issues of the past year and a half?

[JohnBriggs12]

There's a reason private entities don't have subpoena power. Private entities aren't accountable to the public.

[joepepsi]

I'm all for investigating. If Braun cheated he should be hammered. I am not for the way MLB is going about it. They have suspended a minor leaguer because they didn't believe what he told them. At some point is it belief or not hearing what you want? AT this point it is hard to determine if MLB's motives are sincere investigation or a witch hunt. That means now other minor league players on the list have a dilemma. They have to choose between telling MLB what it wants to hear or be honest and face a possible career threatening suspension. I fail to see how that helps at all. If all they are interested in is getting Braun and A-Rod then I think they have crossed the line from legitimate investigating to harassment.

 

I would be upset if I was that minor leaguer. His options apparently were admit guilt and get 50 games or deny it and get 100 games. Whether he was actually guilty or not didn't seem to matter.

so if he's a witch he floats and is hanged. If he's not a witch he sinks and drowns.

[JohnBriggs12]

What does this tell us about MLB's drug testing that they will go to these lengths so they can suspend guys who've passed their tests or in the case of Braun, passed them before and since the one positive test that he beat on chain of custody question. If MLB is so convinced they are still taking PED's, and their tests aren't catching them, why spend all that money on testing?

 

I thought MLB had the most up to date testing available?

[brewmann04]

Wow they are going after Braun hope this fails.

[fondybrewfan]

Aren't they opening themselves up to some liability in the future by openly disregarding the rules of the drug program? Offering immunity seems to be opening up a monster can of worms. Some lawyer in the future could challenge the program and the players union sure as hell can't be OK with this.

 

If there really is evidence that Braun used PED's then I want to see it and if he gets suspended then so be it. But if MLB comes out of this with nothing but hearsay and still tries to suspend Braun than I hope Braun and his lawyers sue the pants off of MLB.

[brewmann04]

Totally agree Fondybrewfan.

[James Zumstein]

For the first time in my life, I'm glad that the players union is as strong as it is. Asking members of a union to snitch on their "brothers"? C'mon, Bud, you know better.

[JohnBriggs12]

For the first time in my life, I'm glad that the players union is as strong as it is. Asking members of a union to snitch on their "brothers"? C'mon, Bud, you know better.

 

They are going after minor leaguers who are not in the union.

[xisxisxis]

There's a reason private entities don't have subpoena power. Private entities aren't accountable to the public.

 

Unfortunately our legal system has few disincentives from stopping a huge entity from ruining a tiny entity by burying them in legal fees. MLB has absolutely no case, but they have a lot more money compared to Bosch and they can extort his cooperation by spitting out his carcass just before the last bit of meat is gone. If we had a loser pays legal system lawsuits like this would never see the light of day.