Newest PED scandal: Braun named in Biogenesis clinic records (Reply #365: Additional mention found)

[dlk9s]

Umm...yeah...The New Times article made it clear that Boesch's business isn't the kind that provides consulting. But you have to commend his lawyers for the effort, it's clearly working on some of you.

 

I don't know what to believe at this point, but to take the opposite stance, even if a business doesn't normally do consulting, it (or the owner individually) might certainly make an exception for $20,000-$30,000, particularly if it doesn't take much of their time.

[dlk9s]

yes and we all trust the NY times.

 

It's the Miami New Times.

[burnzy24]

Umm...yeah...The New Times article made it clear that Boesch's business isn't the kind that provides consulting. But you have to commend his lawyers for the effort, it's clearly working on some of you.

 

Well as long as the new times said it then it probably is fact then. Believe it or not, criminals, dirt-bags and other generally shady people are used as consultants, witnesses and experts all the time in a variety of circumstances. If you were fighting a PED use related suspension, wouldn't it make some sense to talk to someone who is familiar with the use of PED's? Regardless, this can all be easily backed up by Braun with client engagement letters, memos, receipts, etc. If all Braun offers is this statement and nothing else then there might be something to this.

 

If this really was about PED use, then there is no reason for his attorney to be anywhere near this transaction unless his attorney is completely clueless.

[brewmann04]

Sorry that how upset this hod thing got to me . I am sure people do private Consul work for the right price.

[brewmann04]

The thing if it comes out that he gulity i am done with him and have no use for him. But i will defend him until proven otherwise ,

[Ennder]

The thing if it comes out that he gulity i am done with him and have no use for him. But i will defend him until proven otherwise ,

 

I don't know what to think, but I think this opinion is completely silly given the state of the game. 50% or more of the players in the NFL use steroids of some type. In MLB it is almost certainly at least 33%. If Braun is guilty it doesn't really change anything except for the fact that I'm more worried about the intercostal injuries costing him time. Linking your 'heroes' to PED just isn't a big deal at this point since half of the players in the HOF cheated in some way. Sure you might try to claim that using a spitball or amphetamines isn't the same as steroids but the truth is they used whatever was available at the time. There is no difference.

[The stache]

I don't buy it. Ryan's explanation sounds completely plausible. His name doesn't appear anywhere else, and the fact that his attorney's name appears, too, sounds like it was a consulting fee, or a retainer + consulting fee that hasn't been paid in full.

 

$20,000 to $30,000 would be a hell of a lot of performance enhancers. For a guy that's been tested numerous times in the last year (and I'd assume more times than normal in light of his overturned suspension), and had no further issue, it just doesn't make sense that this would be a drug of any kind. Remember, Ryan Braun was basically in the fight of his life. He's a millionaire many times over, and he and his legal team are going to talk to anybody that could help discredit the test, or shoot holes in how the sample was handled. Until a couple of weeks ago, this guy and his clinic were apparently considered legit. Do we really think that Braun's team would approach somebody if there were any questions about their credentials?

 

Braun's team needs to release something to show that this guy was hired as a consultant, and it will all go away.

[SRB]

Still don't care even if he did take something illegal (I won't say "guilty" because that makes it sound like this is something that anybody should care about).

 

People's irrational hatred of steroids is bizarre. Outside of a few minor stories did anyone care that Ray Lewis just won the Super Bowl after being linked to a banned substance? Not a bit. If it had been baseball they would have (perhaps literally) crucified him. Not quite sure why there is the difference other than the fact that the media has created an angry storm in the baseball world but not in other sports, and people just react to what the media drills into them. (And before anyone responds that they personally hate Ray Lewis too - fine, I believe you, but don't act like it's treated the same as if he had been a baseball player).

 

*Edit* Also this entire "steroid clinic" scandal is incredibly suspicious. Players have tens of millions of dollars if not more on the line but they go to a guy who apparently is not remotely secretive, who writes detailed records of people he deals with (he's dealing directly with the players??? since when does that ever happen???), and according to earlier stories everybody who worked there knew what was going on? And then almost all of the names written down were conveniently players who had already been in the media for steroid allegations? Yeah right. If players of Braun's caliber and fame are taking illegal substances, they are going to be doing it a heck of a lot more carefully than this.

[Ennder]

Baseball made an effort to stop steroids, football chose to ignore it. For some odd reason that means steroids in baseball is the end of the world and in football it is no big deal. It makes no rational sense but then again some people watch soccer and that makes no sense either.

[danzig6767]

Baseball made an effort to stop steroids, football chose to ignore it. For some odd reason that means steroids in baseball is the end of the world and in football it is no big deal. It makes no rational sense but then again some people watch soccer and that makes no sense either.

 

What? Football has been testing for roids longer than baseball has.

 

Obviously players in both sports still will look for ways to beat the tests.

[Ennder]

Baseball made an effort to stop steroids, football chose to ignore it. For some odd reason that means steroids in baseball is the end of the world and in football it is no big deal. It makes no rational sense but then again some people watch soccer and that makes no sense either.

 

What? Football has been testing for roids longer than baseball has.

 

Obviously players in both sports still will look for ways to beat the tests.

 

The testing policy in the NFL is a complete and utter joke. It is the minimum they can get away with and claim to test for it. The NFL is completely rampant with steroid use.

[Bombers]

Baseball made an effort to stop steroids, football chose to ignore it. For some odd reason that means steroids in baseball is the end of the world and in football it is no big deal. It makes no rational sense but then again some people watch soccer and that makes no sense either.

 

What? Football has been testing for roids longer than baseball has.

 

Obviously players in both sports still will look for ways to beat the tests.

Football doesn't test for HGH so they can do PEDs - just not roids

[brettac1]

The reason football gets away with it is that they are far better at PR than MLB. Always have been. People seem to believe that it's coincidence that there are all of these 6' 5" 300 lb guys that can run 40 yards in under 5.00.

[pogokat]

Two things that stand out here:

 

1. Could this be a link to the positive test that braun had in 2011? The clinic's ridiculous book keeping doesn't have any dates, as far as I know. Most people thing Braun got away with one. Perhaps this is validation of that. If so, he looks like a gigantic tool for generating this consultant story. I don't believe this one, but i'd say this is obviously the pathway the media will take

 

2. If the lawyer consultation thing is legit, then it seems like they would have had to submit the "evidence" received from the clinic in the appeal, which would mean Braun is easily exonerated. I think this will happen, but like last time, probably not until everyone has decided he's a cheat.

 

Either way, the negative PR sucks---I really love watching Braun play---he's having the best peak of any Brewer in history, I just hate that he's treated like Kim Jong Saddaam Bin Hitler by the media.

 

especially while obvious users like Ray Lewis (who should be noted, probably murdered two people or at least watched two people get murdered by his friends) get tear filled goodbyes when they retire..

 

whatever---I just don't want a suspension---If Braun is out for 50 or more games, the Brewers are much more screwed than last year. Umm, Gomez, Aoki, and Schafer would be an incredibly weak outfield...combined with Gamel at 1st Base, and we might be dueling with the Cubs for last.

[bball123h]

Two things that stand out here:

 

1. Could this be a link to the positive test that braun had in 2011? The clinic's ridiculous book keeping doesn't have any dates, as far as I know. Most people thing Braun got away with one. Perhaps this is validation of that. If so, he looks like a gigantic tool for generating this consultant story. I don't believe this one, but i'd say this is obviously the pathway the media will take

 

This is another place my brain went last night. If there's no drugs listed by his name, perhaps it just wasn't a recent order... just carrying the balance forward from 2011 (when he was caught).

 

This story sucks, but I really can't believe Braun. Why would you go to the guy you know is supplying pro athletes with PEDs for "consulting"? You had to know doing so would create a paper trail tying you to the dealer, and with the strong U of M ties, there's no way he didn't know that he was a dealer.

[brettac1]

That's my hang-up here, as well. Why would you consult a steroid dealer? I guess because he knows how to help guys pass tests?

[Patrick425]

The reason football gets away with it is that they are far better at PR than MLB. Always have been.

 

Sorry, gotta disagree with you. The reason they get away with it and are "better at PR" is because the evidence on the field is not nearly as clear as it is in baseball. When you have two guys in one season battling to beat a season HR record that has stood for 37 years that's pretty clear evidence. Then when another player comes along 3 years later and obliterates the record again that's pretty clear evidence. When you have a guy like Brady Anderson, who had never hit more than 21 HRs in a season, then all of a sudden hits 50, that's pretty clear evidence.

 

Baseball is very much a numbers game, much more than football is. Yes you may have big guys putting up incredible 40 speeds in football, but the general public does not notice this as much as they noticed all the HRs suddenly being hit in baseball.

[Invader3K]

Well, I personally believe Ryan Braun's story and take his word over some random idiots' speculation.

[Mass Haas]

At least his brother was clean -- no way he put up these Brewer stat lines tainted.

[Patrick425]

That's my hang-up here, as well. Why would you consult a steroid dealer? I guess because he knows how to help guys pass tests?

 

 

Was it commonly known a year ago that this guy was a steroid dealer?

 

Edit: Nevermind...went back and read the ESPN story that was in post #1 on this thread. Didn't know that Bosch had ties to Manny Ramirez back in 2009. So, yeah, gotta agree, why would you go anywhere near this guy if you were clean?

[Fear The Chorizo]

This story is going to end up turning into more of a witch hunt than anything else, IMO. The initial names mentioned by the story that were linked to PEDs in their records are the story. Now various other news outlets are hunting for other names and leads to show they can be investigative journalists, too. Doesn't exactly surprise me that players with university of Miami ties are being linked to this clinic since it's in their backyard. This clinic and many others provide other services than PEDs to athletes. Yahoo sports, MLB network, ESPN, etc are proceeding to muddy up the waters on a well researched piece of investigative journalism, and it's going to end up discrediting the entire story to a point that the players more directly linked to PED use won't be punished by MLB.

 

The initial story was extremely detailed and documented. Had Braun been more directly linked to PEDs by clinic records/similar evidence his name would have been right next to Arod's and Cabrera's. The fact that he wasn't indicates to me that Braun's story is believable. Unfortunately for him he's guilty until proven innocent, and he'll need to show the paper trail proving his work with Bosch and the clinic was strictly for consulting fees during his appeal. Or the paper who broke the story may indicate they have more of the clinic's records that they didn't provide to Yahoo Sports which provide a more detailed paper trail of Braun's statement than a notebook kept by Bosch.

 

I'm no legal expert, but would some of these records/documents fall under HIPPA confidentiality laws? Some of these news outlets running with stories based on notebook pads with lists of names may want to lawyer up if that is the case - seems like now they are throwing every athlete's name they see on anything out there in print.

[owbc]

Lets review:

 

Ryan Braun's name is on a list from a known PED provider with known PED users on either side of him, one of which has been known to associate with Braun in the offseason. He spent $30-40,000 on something. Out of all the possible experts on PEDs, when Braun was in trouble, his lawyers chose to spend at least 30 grand on this shady Miami Boesch guy who everybody knew was providing PEDs to athletes--particularly those connected to the University of Miami, where Braun went to school.

 

The good news for Braun (as others mentioned) is that for 30K, he should have no shortage of documents to back up his story. I'm sure we'll be seeing them any day now.

[Invader3K]

Lets review:

...

The good news for Braun (as others mentioned) is that for 30K, he should have no shortage of documents to back up his story. I'm sure we'll be seeing them any day now.

 

Well, it would be nice if MLB would release their side of last year's Braun issue, but of course they never will.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Braun's other lawyer issued a statement indicating Bosch's contributions were "negligible" during the appeal - Assuming Braun is telling the truth, the part of Braun's statement indicating that there was a dispute with what was owed Bosch leading to the 22-30K amount next to his name would lead me to believe that:

 

Braun's team would have paid a lump sum retainer for a consult fee to Bosch (and probably to several other people/organizations as they were gathering information). After determining Bosch wasn't going to be useful, they didn't need his services for the full fee. 22-30K is a pretty big gap in money owed for PED's, but a realistic amount for legal/consulting fees.

[JohnBriggs12]

If Braun's explanation is valid, there has to be a paper trail. His attorneys should be able to produce correspondence and emails from Bosch requesting payment for their services and detailing what those services were. By his comment "fullly cooperating with MLB" that would likely mean they have documents that back his story.

 

Conversely, anyone realistically believe that this lab would provide PED's on credit or if they did that a player would risk being outed by not paying?