Stan Kyles Fired

[FVBrewerFan]

I do think it begs the question "Why have a bullpen coach?" Seems nobody knows for sure what this person does. May or may not review scouting reports? Seems like that's wat the pitching coach, bench coach, even RR would be involved with that for the entire pitching staff. Not sure why the bullpen would be separated from the starters for those discussions.

 

If I remember right, there never was such a thing as a bullpen coach. Now we have one "just because?" Anyone can answer the phone, you don't need a "coach" to do that.

 

A bit OT, but I have also noticed a lot of fatballs down the midle on 0-2 counts. Sure, sometimes it may be a case of a pitcher missing a spot. But most of the time, it looks like they're trying. Maybe the old "sneal one by them" I don't know. Why even throw a fastball 0-2? And this isn't limited to relievers, Estrada has done it a lot as a starter.

[MLS1965]

Kyles is a class act

 

http://brewersbeat.mlblogs.com/2012/07/30/kyles-brewers-had-to-do-something/

Stan lived next door to me in my apartment complex during the 2008 Nashville Sounds season. As a season ticket holder we talked everyday, but it was not until about now in the season that we figured out he was also my neighbor. Often he would stop by after the Sounds game and we'd watch some of the west coast games. Every player speaks nothing but highly about Stan.

[DuWayne Steurer]

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/950892/scapegoat.jpg

[bigredrobbo]

Unless the Brewers reveal that SK was doing bar dice for shots in the bullpen, this is stupid. They might as well have fired the guy who drives the team bus to the airport for road games, for all the impact this will have.

[splitterpfj]

How do you explain Kyles last year when the Bullpen was lights out?

 

How do you explain anything that's happened with the bullpen from last year to this year? It's almost too much to believe.

 

Stan won't be the only one who pays for this, there's no way this group of relievers will return intact for next season, past performance, or not.

[Thurston Fluff]

It starts with KRod and basically includes everyone in the bullpen who has no future with this team.

 

I get the sentiment but how does paying people not to be here and pay their replacements do anything to actually help the situation. It's not like any of the relievers in the minors are going to stabilize the pen now. I don't buy into the "they can't be any worse," argument. Dillard already did do worse. I don't buy into seeing what we have in the some of young guys argument for the most part either.

Here are the AAA pitchers.

Burgos looks ok but has 14 games above A ball. Jesus Sanchez 9 games above AA. I don't see the need to bring them up now. It can hurt as much as help a young player to be pushed too fast. See Thornburg for example.

Then there are the older guys who are not very good at AAA like Baker and Butler.

There are some non-prospect types that may warrant a look like Hand, Perez, Rivas, and Wooten. Maybe they could be put in the majors and we can see something out of them but are any of them guys you would pencil in next season regardless of how well they did in a couple month trial? Less than a couple month trial really. They can all be called up in a month anyway. Is that month enough to pay more salary in an already too high of salary season? Chulk is on the DL but maybe when he comes back. Then there are the been there done that guys like Dillard, Vargas and Stetter. Is paying extra salary just to have them back up worth it? What will we see out of them that we don't already know? What can they do that would be better than what we already have? That leaves us with three possible candidates that make some sense. Peralta, Thornburg and De Los Santos

Peralta and Thornburg are starters and one has already failed in relief in the majors. De Los Santos is the only guy who makes a lot of sense now. We can do that without DFA'ing everyone and pay them for nothing.

[logan82]

Sweet. Good to see Kyles is gone. Now we will go 50-0 in the rest of the games we are leading by 3 or fewer runs the rest of the way and make the playoffs. World Series here we come.

[3and2Fastball]

Not a fan of this move. Did Kyles stock the bullpen with this level of talent? Nope. Can't fire the GM, so Kyles is the scapegoat

 

Did Kyles mismanage the bullpen like Roenicke did? Can't fire the Manager, so Kyles is the scapegoat.

 

I would hope, at the very least, that Melvin & Roenicke were given warnings to get their act together or they will be next, but I very seriously doubt it.

 

To be clear: I'm not saying that I think DM & RR should be fired, but I certainly believe that if anyone was going to get fired it should be them long before it is Kyles

 

bush league knee jerk pass the buck move

[gregmag]

I couldn't agree more. Yes, Kyles is a "class act". There have been lot's of "class acts" in baseball throughout the years that have been fired.

 

Those guys have a way of resurfacing somewhere in a different capacity. As often as not with the same team that fired them. If you fire a guy but rehire him doing essentially the same type of work elsewhere in the organization indicates to me teams understand the problem may not be with the guy being fired. I guess they hope that while he was not the problem his firing from that post can be part of the solution.

Long way of saying maybe we are looking at who caused the problems when the team may be looking at how to fix it. The two are not always one in the same.

I'm mainly responding to this because IMHO it deserves to be put out there again. This strikes me as a very, very smart assessment of the situation. The players play the games. I think the influence of managers and coaches on wins and losses must seem kind of amorphous even to people on the inside. Sometimes I think you just move guys in and out to give the players a different look at things. I hope it's that, rather than trying to impress fans by "holding someone accountable."

[markedman5]

RR breaks down what each guys job is in general terms....Mechanics are all on Kranitz

 

Roenicke said Kranitz mostly works with pitchers on their mechanics and said Kyles' responsibilities were to prepare the relievers for the hitters they will face, and helping them get mentally ready and confident, but also can see what a pitcher is doing on the mound and make any adjustments necessary.

[PKBadger]

Ultimately, baseball coach is a results-driven profession. Everyone knows that going in, and everyone gets fired/re-hired a handful of times.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, "meh."

[xisxisxis]

bush league knee jerk pass the buck move

 

Do I see the 2012 team slogan here?

 

 

I'm really glad the first round of rearranging the deck chairs has worked. Now what about that ice-berg to the starboard captain?!!!?

[logan82]

If this was the Titanic, we struck the iceburg at least a month ago. Now is the time to decide who gets a seat in the lifeboat and who drowns.

[pebadger]

A family friend has been a MLB bullpen coach for a long time. First and foremost, you need a member of the management team down in the pen, for a lot of reasons, not least of which is just babysitting. How the bullpen coach duties fit in with the rest of he staff depends on the organization and changes from spring training to the regular season. Setting a tone in the pen can be important. The coach doesn't necessarily impose a tone, but can help steer it and having eyes and ears down there can provide insight to the management in the dugout about much more than just how a guy looks while warming.

 

In a lot of ways it's the most people-oriented job on the staff, and good bullpen coaches are often among the most-liked and most-respected guys on the staff because they have a chance to pass on info and insight to the often youngish guys in the pen. A lot of bullpen coaches that were players are often guys that had journeyman-type careers of their own and they can sometimes connect with a lot of players, especially relievers, in that way, too.

[brewmann04]

I think this is still bush league and like to see the other moves that will be made.

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

Only one blown save tonight...progress! This move is already paying big dividends. Look out parking lot attendants and volunteer concessionaires...you're next!

[TooLiveBrew]

If this was the Titanic, we struck the iceburg at least a month ago. Now is the time to decide who gets a seat in the lifeboat and who drowns.

If history dictates... the most well-paid relievers get first priority, then the women, then everyone else!

 

Sorry, Mike McClendon. Maybe you can strike up a last-minute romance with Rose...

[Bigblast]

I think most of us thought firing Stan wouldn't make much of a difference. However since he was fired the pullben has been much better. Could he have been the problem?

[dlk9s]

No.

[torts]

No.

 

Lol

[fondybrewfan]

I doubt Kyles had anything to do with it. The talent was always there; sometimes players/teams go through bad stretches. It happens

[Invader3K]

I think mainly the bullpen has improved because Axford and K-Rod have gotten better, which makes sense since they were both probably bound to bounce back. I still don't have much confidence in Parra, Loe, etc.

[MJLiverock]

I had this thought myself last night, I wondered what the record has been since the firing of Stan Kyles. I don't think it made some huge difference and as others have said, it is probably just an evening out of truly historically bad performances. I don't agree that it was a bush move, it is common practice to fire some assistant, position coach when things aren't going well. These guys all know that they are hired to be fired at some point. Sure it is usually scapegoating but it is the reality of the job.

[PrinceEatMeat]

His firing made no difference at all. Ax and K-Rod rediscovered their command, and the bullpen goes as they go basically. Has nothing to do with the presence, or lack thereof, of Kyles.

[afeter]

His firing made no difference at all. Ax and K-Rod rediscovered their command, and the bullpen goes as they go basically. Has nothing to do with the presence, or lack thereof, of Kyles.

 

i understand the general consensus on bf is that coaches dont impact performance, but this is a really strong statement. I would argue that his firing must make at least a minimal difference one way or the other. MLB clubs are buisnesses, if coaches didn't make any difference there is no way smart and savvy owners woud dole out the cash to keep them around.