Greinke traded to Angels for three prospects; Rangers nearly won the bidding (Latest: revisiting this trade in December 2015; post 481)

[adambr2]

I know I'm going to be in the minority, but I think I'm almost relieved in a way to not be re-signing Greinke.

 

I feel like the market for Greinke has gotten out of control. In spring training, Doug was quoted as saying about 5 years/$85M was the rough market for Greinke at the time. And I think many of us agreed with that, at the time.

 

Since then, Greinke's stock has gone through the roof -- but not because of exceptional performance above career norms, but because of large inflated contracts to Cain and Hamels.

 

Do people really want us to be the team to give Greinke 6 years/$150M in the offseason? I don't want to be that team. $25M a year for Greinke? He's a great pitcher, but do people honestly feel he is worth that? I don't. The market fluctuates, and I don't think in this case we can let the market dictate what we offer, when there are other ways and it's probably best to just bow out of this one. We have an influx of young pitching talent coming soon -- so I personally think patience is the key until we see what we have there. I think there are other, better ways to do this and get back to being winners, than a huge market overpayment to Greinke.

[derflotr]

I know I'm going to be in the minority, but I think I'm almost relieved in a way to not be re-signing Greinke.

 

I feel like the market for Greinke has gotten out of control. In spring training, Doug was quoted as saying about 5 years/$85M was the rough market for Greinke at the time. And I think many of us agreed with that, at the time.

 

Since then, Greinke's stock has gone through the roof -- but not because of exceptional performance above career norms, but because of large inflated contracts to Cain and Hamels.

 

Do people really want us to be the team to give Greinke 6 years/$150M in the offseason? I don't want to be that team. $25M a year for Greinke? He's a great pitcher, but do people honestly feel he is worth that? I don't. The market fluctuates, and I don't think in this case we can let the market dictate what we offer, when there are other ways and it's probably best to just bow out of this one. We have an influx of young pitching talent coming soon -- I think there are other, better ways to do this and get back to being winners, than a huge market overpayment to Greinke.

I completely agree, but I think an important component of the re-sign Greinke fantasy is that he takes a significant discount to play here. It's the same fantasy we teased ourselves last offseason with Fielder. We know it won't happen, but it's nice to dream, isn't it?

[3and2Fastball]

I'll join you in the minority adambr2, I'm glad we didn't overpay for Zack, and I say that as a Greinke fan... now if we can get out from under that ridiculous Aramis Ramirez contract I'll feel even better

 

(edited to spell Zack correctly!)

[3and2Fastball]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

[logan82]

I would love to get Greinke back in the offseason but for no more than 5/$100 and even then I am more than a little uncomfortable.

 

Melvin has said all the right things about needing to use young players. Now we have to see what his actions are.

[lcbj68c]

For the love of god people...he was here for nearly two years and people still can't get it.... ZACK!

 

Zack Greinke...not Zach. If you are going to use just his first name to reference him, try and spell it correctly. You'd think his name was some Russian or something. :rant over:

[trwi7]

<------ Big fan of Vladislav Greinke.

[Bombers]

I am very happy to be a Brewers fan. Sure, going into this year I had playoff expectations, and going forward I am really unsure of what 2013 will look like. But with what our minor league system looks like after taking it to the bottom of the barrel last year, I applaud Doug for getting this deal done and for getting our system back to a respectable level.

[patrickgpe]

i am late to the conversation since i was at the game. i looked at my prospect handbook right as i got home. Hellweg had the best fastball and curveball in the organization and Pena best slider FWIW.

[TooLiveBrew]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

What a sad yet happy picture. Thank you for linking that!

[Bombers]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

Nice pic! Good luck in Disneyland Zach!

[Eye Black]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

Two thoughts from this picture:

 

1) It does seem like he genuinely liked the guys in the Milwaukee clubhouse. He said something when he met with the press to the effect that the guys got along very well even when things weren't going well on the field.

 

2) Wolf and Kottaras really might be inseparable?!

[trwi7]

George Kottaras in the picture.

[danzig6767]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

Two thoughts from this picture:

 

1) It does seem like he genuinely liked the guys in the Milwaukee clubhouse. He said something when he met with the press to the effect that the guys got along very well even when things weren't going well on the field.

 

2) Wolf and Kottaras really might be inseparable?!

 

My thought was that whatever anxiety issues he had in the past which may have affected his pitching at times, he seems pretty much over them. There was also all that talk about how would Zack fit in with his teammates after we traded for him and that never seemed to be any problem at all. Instead, he seemed to fit in fabulously and was well liked by everyone.

[adambr2]

Not that it really matters, but was it said whether the Brewers or Angels are picking up the tab for Greinke's salary the rest of the year? We're talking about roughly $5M of payroll for the season, so I'm just curious.

[trwi7]

There have been no reports and they're usually pretty on this so I would guess the Angels are paying his salary.

[Bombers]

Not that it really matters, but was it said whether the Brewers or Angels are picking up the tab for Greinke's salary the rest of the year? We're talking about roughly $5M of payroll for the season, so I'm just curious.

I don't have a link but I did read somewhere that the Angels are paying at

[Ennder]

JJ Hardy had very poor range, too.

 

Probably the most ignorant statement I've seen posted on this forum in a long time. His defense is more based on positioning and arm strength but his range has always been at least average. His range is miles ahead of guys like say Betancourt.

[endaround]

It is easy to overlook the human side of the game sometimes... these guys are gonna miss their buddy:

 

http://instagram.com/p/Nm_h0ovjzJ/

Two thoughts from this picture:

 

1) It does seem like he genuinely liked the guys in the Milwaukee clubhouse. He said something when he met with the press to the effect that the guys got along very well even when things weren't going well on the field.

 

2) Wolf and Kottaras really might be inseparable?!

Wolf and Kottaras are good friends. Schroeder has talked about how their families vacation together.

[Bombers]

In this article they say the Angels owe him the remainder ... But it may be inaccurate

http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?storyId=8207299

[adambr2]

JJ Hardy had very poor range, too.

 

Probably the most ignorant statement I've seen posted on this forum in a long time. His defense is more based on positioning and arm strength but his range has always been at least average. His range is miles ahead of guys like say Betancourt.

 

His first year in the league, he was last in range factor in the league, so to say his range has "always" been at least average is wrong -- maybe you should research more than the last year or two before you make spewing your garbage about the "most ignorant statement".

 

http://www.twinkietown.com/2009/11/8/1121907/how-good-is-j-j-hardys-defense

 

This is from just after he was traded.

 

He's come a long ways there, I was pretty obviously referring to his tenure as a Brewer, not 2012, and his "range" is based on his defensive positioning, which is NOT range.

[Kelbysdaddy]

It would be funny if we traded a-ram to Oakland and he helped them send the rangers to 3rd place in the west. Since they wouldn't give up olt or Perez ,Texas misses the playoffs because of the brewers trades.

[gregmag]

I'm really going to miss Zack. I keep reminding myself that there's no point in investing much personal affection in baseball players; I have very little in common with most of these guys, and I probably wouldn't get along with a lot of them. But Greinke seems like a smart, funny, odd character -- my kind of person. I'm glad he's liked Milwaukee so much. He'll be a very easy guy to root for, even on one of the pennant-buying coastal teams.

 

But yeah, if he's going to get six years at $20 million plus, I just can't see that being smart for anybody, let alone us.

 

On the totally different matter of Segura as a shortstop . . . they moved him there last year, and he got hurt; this has been his first full year at the position. I say he's a shortstop until he proves he isn't. The reports I'm reading on his defense are all over the place: good range / poor range; good arm / poor arm. Some of it is probably just my reading too sloppily. He's 22, fast, and still settling in at the position. Even if he's average . . . man, can you imagine how much better we'd have been last year or this year with an average shortstop?

 

Marc Hulet at Fangraphs really dislikes Pena (as a prospect; I'm sure they're great friends off the field), pegs him as a setup man:

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/zack-greinkes-strange-brew-ingredients-include-jean-segura-john-hellweg-and-ariel-pena/

 

Hulet's writeup acknowledges but doesn't say much about Pena's improved control this year. If the increased command is legit, Pena seems to me like a good bet to stick in the rotation.

 

Comparing this deal to our Greinke trade with KC is fun. I'm perfectly happy to have Segura instead of Escobar, in part because Escobar's BA looks like a BABIP mirage, in part because Segura looks like he could develop in a lot of different directions. I'd much rather have Pena than Jeffress. Hellweg looks like maybe half the prospect Odorizzi is -- I'm just pulling that out of my ear, it's late -- and I still really like Cain. (I'm forgetting Betancourt ever existed, and if you remind me, I'll pretend I didn't hear you.) So by my rough math, we gave up, net, at worst a prospect and a half in exchange for a year and a half of Zack Greinke, without whom we probably wouldn't have won our division title. That seems to me like a very good sequence of transactions for the Brewers.

[TooLiveBrew]

George Kottaras in the picture.

Don't miss Ryan Braun, creepin' in the back

 

 

[Hardy's] "range" is based on his defensive positioning, which is NOT range.

Where Hardy makes hay with range beyond his slow foot speed is that he's always read the ball really well off the bat. Like exceptionally well.

 

Also, (EDIT: unless it's been revised...) range factor as a stat sucks, & ironically tells you very little about a player's range. It's a stat that's heavily influenced by total # of chances, which obviously depends a lot on how many balls are hit your way in a given season.

[Eye Black]

George Kottaras in the picture.

Don't miss Ryan Braun, creepin' in the back

Somebody had to photo-bomb.