Renter's Rights Question

[GoudaBrew]

We signed a year lease on one side of a duplex. The lease started May 1st of this year. The duplex was for sale at the time we signed the lease. The duplex has since sold and the new owner plans on moving into our side. Except he's not planning on moving in May 1st, 2013. He sent us a letter stating:

 

"I am aware you have recently signed a rental agreement with the previous owners.....Due to the terms of my purchase though, it is lawfully necessary for me to owner-occupy the property and so I must ask that you begin searching for new living arrangements."

 

He goes on to give us a relocation date of 09/19/2012. We have absolutely no interest in moving out before the end of April.

 

When I first read the letter, I chuckled. The cahoonas on this guy, I thought. But since, this letter has made me really angry. We just moved 400 miles (a costly move at that) and now we are supposed to pack up 4 months into our lease? I don't think so. The lease says that if the property is sold, the new owner is responsible for the obligations under that contract. I find it laughable that he is even asking us to do this. Before I meet with him I want to make sure there is nothing he can do to force this early move on us. Any legal experts out there? Common sense tells me he doesn't have any right to do this, but I'd like to make sure and I really don't want to pay a lawyer to make this guy come to his senses.

[RockCoCougars]

Do you have any legal service benefits through your work or school? Often, you can get services for little to no cost.

 

In this case, all that it would take to stop this would be for an attorney to review your lease and draft a letter to the new owner. However, you should be prepared for possible retribution from the property owner though, so it may not even be worth your while to stay. Maybe the guy would be willing to pay relocation expenses in the form of a month or two of free rent to get you out of there.

[GoudaBrew]

I thought about asking him to pay for a moving company to move us, but my wife isn't thrilled with moving right after we got settled.

 

Well, retribution is illegal too and I'm not sure what he could do other than try to screw us out of our security deposit.

 

Any clue what he means by saying: "It is lawfully necessary for me to owner-occupy"? Is that just [expletive deleted]? I feel like he's trying to bully his way in, but really has no case.

[NeedMoreFans]

Where do you live? If you live in Wisconsin, you can contact the Tenant Resource Center in Madison. They provide free counseling on tenant/landlord issues.

[RockCoCougars]

Well, retribution is illegal too and I'm not sure what he could do other than try to screw us out of our security deposit.

 

Not all forms of retribution are illegal.... I'm sure if he was petty enough, you could expect lots of 'visits' for 'maintenance', etc.. These sorts of things would not only be annoying, but he could use them to spy on you to make sure that you are following the lease to the letter. If it were me, I'd feel the guy out a bit to see what direction he may take things. Maybe he's a perfectly reasonable guy who is unaware of the fact that leases are legally binding... maybe he's an unreasonable fool that isn't worth the stress and trouble. Since the lease is on your side, it probably wouldn't hurt to give him a call to let him know your side of things.

[Menace II Sobriety]

If he has a HUD or a WHEDA loan than he must live on the property for the entire first year that he owns it before he sells it or rents it out. Do you have the better half of the duplex? He might just want to move into the better half right away instead of waiting until your lease is up.

 

This does not seem to be the case though as he is not moving in until next May, so he is probably looking to renovate. If you have a locked in lease I wouldn't move unless I was greatly compensated. As far as I know those two loans are the only ones in WI that require the owner to take immediate occupancy so if he kicks you out and doesn't move in than he is committing fraud. The same thing is true with a standard owner occupied mortgage.

[TracyThom]

It's a long read, but this is what I refer to when I have to deal with landlord/tenant disputes.

 

The Wisconsin Way. A Guide for Landlords and Tenants.

http://datcp.wi.gov/uploads/consumer/pdf/wisconsinwayweb.pdf

[1992casey]

This does not seem to be the case though as he is not moving in until next May…

 

The way I read this topic, the new owner is looking to move in soon after GoudaBrew would hopefully leave in September. Gouda states, "Except he's not planning on moving in May 1st, 2013."

[thebruce44]

His loan probably requires him to live in the unit as opposed to renting it out. I would have thought this would have been covered though when he applied for the loan, those guys dig pretty deep into everything these days.

[GoudaBrew]

NMF - Thanks! I'll be contacting the Tenant Resource Center first thing Monday.

 

Nope, he needs/wants to move in by mid-September is what is sounds like.

 

The other side of the duplex is a little nicer from what I've heard, but the lady there has lived there 9 years and is basically a perfect tenant from a landlord's perspective. After talking to some people about this, his loan probably requires that he live there right away. He either lied to the bank, telling them he would be doing that (or assuming he'd be able to) or his bank didn't do it's due diligence.

 

Either way it's not my problem and I feel as though we have all the power here. If he forces the issue, I'll probably ask for free rent in August and for him to pay for our move. Anything short of that is just not fair to us. He should have taken all of this into account before buying a house - like I said, this isn't (err, shouldn't be) my problem.

[1992casey]

Heck, I'd ask him for moving expenses, whatever rent you'd be paying through May, and the assurance that you'd be getting your security deposit back. Unless the Tenant Resource Center tells you something completely unforeseen, I'd think that you're in the driver's seat.

[bjkrautk]

It's a long read, but this is what I refer to when I have to deal with landlord/tenant disputes.

 

The Wisconsin Way. A Guide for Landlords and Tenants.

http://datcp.wi.gov/uploads/consumer/pdf/wisconsinwayweb.pdf

 

 

Without providing legal advice myself, that is one of the first places I would look.

 

Re: Tenant Resources Center, just be warned that Dane County has a variety of pro-tenant ordinances that would not apply in other counties. If you do live there, it's a great resource.

 

Necessary disclaimer: unless you have a written fee agreement with my name on it, I'm not your lawyer.

[Outlander]

The buyer seemed to screw up but tough luck for him. It sure seems like he wasn't telling the truth to somebody with his "Due to the terms of my purchase" language. I certainly wouldn't want to be renting from a person like that but try to get as much out of it as you can.

[thebruce44]

I can't believe he got his loan so smoothly, must have really committed some "mortgage fraud." If he isn't willing to work with you at all, I would find out what his mortgage terms are and bring up those two words casually. My guess is that he would become a little more cooperative.

[theavrock]

Gouda, how did it go with the tenant resource center? While it sounds like and certainly seems you're in the right I would want to make sure that legally I was in control before demanding anything from the guy.

 

Landlord tenant law can be a pretty tricky thing and when you throw in the mortgage/finance stuff as well this seems like a situation that is calling for an attorney.

 

Either way I'll be curious to hear what happens with this.

[GoudaBrew]

The Tenant Resource Center seems like a busy place. They don't answer their phones, but have you leave a message and return calls once they can. Hopefully I hear today. I left my landlord a voicemail and hope to hear from today as well. I plan on meeting him somewhere to discuss what is going on (I'm nicer in person than on the phone and I don't want to get hostile!).

[hawing]

Just as an FYI, the Tenant Resource Center lost a chunk of its funding last year and had to reduce service hours. So you might not hear back as promptly as you'd like:

 

http://www.forwardlookout.com/2011/11/tenant-resource-center-further-reduces-services/13396

 

(Sorry for the left-ish link. The other link I found describing the reductions was from madison.com and I didn't want you to get stuck registering/paying to see that.)

[1992casey]

I don't know that I'd meet with the landlord until you've gotten legal advice. I'd just tell him that you'd like to get together and talk after you've been able to discuss the situation with your legal advisers.

[GoudaBrew]

I called an attorney's office, but have yet to speak to an actual attorney. They must not be too interested in anything non-injury suit related.

 

I have heard back from the Tenant Resource Center. They told me what I expected to hear - that our landlord has no grounds here and that we have every right to stay in the house until the end of the lease. They advised me to contact a lawyer so I'll be calling a few other offices next week. Most offer a free consultation so maybe they can advise me on what might be proper compensation for moving out early if it comes to that.

 

I met our landlord on Friday. Assuming he's telling the truth , it sounds like he was just too passive or naive in the whole process. He claims when he saw the house, our side was either vacant or not under contract. Which can not be true. It could have been vacant, but the house wasn't listed for sale until we had signed the lease. It's possible he saw it before we moved in and he assumed it was un-rented. He says his realtor showed him a copy of the lease for the other side of the duplex, but not ours and that his realtor assured him that he'd be able to move into our side immediately. I'm guessing the realtor hadn't been given our lease because we had just signed. Anyway, he eventually did get a copy of our lease before they closed (when? I'm not exactly sure) and instead of addressing the issue then, he just assumed everything would work itself out.

 

Well, now he's aware that he could be committing mortgage fraud and he' s pretty scared of the penalties. I told him we won't be moving without him paying moving expenses on top of further compensation for the inconvenience of this all. I suggested he cover our rent for the duration of the lease, but he said he couldn't afford that. He's fine with us living here until the lease ends, but he needs to get approval from his bank which I'm sure won't happen.

 

So, what is proper compensation? Are we being greedy? Moving right now would be a huge pain in the butt, so I feel like we need something other than moving expenses to motivate us to help him out.

[thebruce44]

I called an attorney's office, but have yet to speak to an actual attorney. They must not be too interested in anything non-injury suit related.

 

I have heard back from the Tenant Resource Center. They told me what I expected to hear - that our landlord has no grounds here and that we have every right to stay in the house until the end of the lease. They advised me to contact a lawyer so I'll be calling a few other offices next week. Most offer a free consultation so maybe they can advise me on what might be proper compensation for moving out early if it comes to that.

 

I met our landlord on Friday. Assuming he's telling the truth , it sounds like he was just too passive or naive in the whole process. He claims when he saw the house, our side was either vacant or not under contract. Which can not be true. It could have been vacant, but the house wasn't listed for sale until we had signed the lease. It's possible he saw it before we moved in and he assumed it was un-rented. He says his realtor showed him a copy of the lease for the other side of the duplex, but not ours and that his realtor assured him that he'd be able to move into our side immediately. I'm guessing the realtor hadn't been given our lease because we had just signed. Anyway, he eventually did get a copy of our lease before they closed (when? I'm not exactly sure) and instead of addressing the issue then, he just assumed everything would work itself out.

 

Well, now he's aware that he could be committing mortgage fraud and he' s pretty scared of the penalties. I told him we won't be moving without him paying moving expenses on top of further compensation for the inconvenience of this all. I suggested he cover our rent for the duration of the lease, but he said he couldn't afford that. He's fine with us living here until the lease ends, but he needs to get approval from his bank which I'm sure won't happen.

 

So, what is proper compensation? Are we being greedy? Moving right now would be a huge pain in the butt, so I feel like we need something other than moving expenses to motivate us to help him out.

 

Either he is lying or someone he paid to help him during his closing didn't do their job or lied to him. I can't imagine its possible that he was able to close on the place without being aware of the signed leases...unless your previous landlord was a slum lord and didn't file proper paperwork.

 

I can understand how you might feel bad for the guy, but I don't see how any of this is your fault or that you need to do anything other than live in your unit until the lease is up. If he wants to make it worth your wile to move, so be it, but I don't see how this is greedy of you at all.