Johan Santana

[HiAndTight]

Long shot, but we're talking about Josh Beckett, we're talking about these other pitchers, but I think one that's flying way under the radar is Johan Santana.

He was the best pitcher in baseball for a long period of time up until he got hurt.

 

His numbers thus far this year are;

I'm sorry, my mistake. He put up those numbers in 2009.

 

So far this year, he's putting up BETTER numbers.

 

2.92 ERA FIP2.42 xFIP3.29

 

He looks to be back to where he was. He's averaging 90 MPH on his fastball, and with a guy with such a filthy change and such a great pitcher all around, it seems like the Mets may be willing to part with a pitcher who has just a couple years left of elite level pitching(hopefully since the Mets are not a winning team(or aren't a realistic contender this year) it seems as though if the Brewers could POSSIBLY get him if they're willing to pony up a large portion of the money owed to him.

 

If Santana makes roughly 24 million per year, and the Mets were willing to eat half of that for say...Jungmang and a lesser prospect, a Khris Davis or even a Scooter Gennett, would anyone on here be willing to take that chance?

 

3 1/2 years left, so by the time a trade would be ironed out, we'd be looking at just roughly 42 million dollars over that period of time while giving up a very good prospect, and another B- type prospect.

 

Thoughts? If Santana continues to pitch like he has this year...and his entire big league career, you could almost make Gallardo your #3 pitcher. Injury risks are obviously significant because he's coming of one.

 

Or hell, if we're really in an all out rebuilding mode, Thornburg, Peralta+Gennett+Fiers+K-Rod(to even out the money a LITTLE bit) for Wright and Santana?

 

 

How off the mark is that? Aram moves to first, pitching, defense and offense fixed. Santana isn't that expensive moving forward, so a Greinke extension still would NOT be off the table(you'd just have to move Hart).

 

Wright costs just under 10 million a year unless I read costs wrong.

 

Hart, Wolf, K-Rod, Marcum, Morgan, Gonzalez should be at a minimium 2 million cheaper next year and will likely have to settle for a one year deal at about 1.5 million.

That's about 45 million coming off the books.

20 million in new TV revenue, ADDITIONAL TV revenue.

Radio money...totally unsure how much that adds.

Ticket prices up 2+ dollars a ticket and we're well ahead of our pace last year when we ended up drawing roughly 3.4 million. That's over 7 million.

 

The money IS there..even to re-sign Greinke. Of course you'd be looking at a roster full of minimum wage players like Gindl, Schafer, Thornburg, Fiers, Estrada(not quite min, but close), Narveson who'd be cheap, Gamel, Green, Lucroy would be cheap, etc..etc...

 

You'd have 65 pct at least of your paryoll tied up into Braun, Gallardo, Wright, Santana, Greinke and likely Weeks and another 10 with Lucroy, Gomez, Narveson, Veras, Parra and Gonzalez. Could we squeeze a contender out of 25 pct of our roster being minimum wage guys?

 

Greinke

Gallardo

Santana

Thornburg

Narveson/Estrada

 

Pen

Axford

Manzanillo-hopefully he'll go Ax on us.

Veras

Parra

Fiers

Estrada

Kintzler

Henderson

McClendon

Rogers

Rivas

Wooten

Williams(throws gas, in HiA now and dominating with a big fastball).

Dillard, and several I'm forgetting, including a couple of guys who could be had for cheap on minor league deals. The BP is the biggest enigma in all of sports.

 

Lineup

Aoki/Gomez

Wright

Braun

Aram

Weeks

Gamel

Lucroy

Gonzalez

 

With

Aoki

Kottars

Green

Jamey Carroll(traded for this year)

And Ishikawa.

 

 

That's about a 115 million dollar payroll. I said in 2008-2009 that we'd be at 110 by the time next year came around, but I've been a few million short the whole time, and assuming we're in the red, that is without a shred of a doubt that we can afford such a figure....NEXT YEAR. And probably then next 2-3.

 

It's how that team performs and how our farm system develops that dictates if we becomes the Indians from the 90's to the Indians from the 100 loss days in the 2000's.

 

 

And....end ridiculous fantasy and lets talk about the reality of ACTUALLY getting Johan Santana, not Wright, Santana and re-signing Grienke.

[jerichoholicninja]

I believe Wright can opt out of his contract if traded this year and I think it's safe to say he will if he is traded so the mega deal you propose wouldn't be smart for the Brewers. Even if I am wrong about that, trading basically the entire next class of pitchers for a guy who's coming off major surgery and a player in Wright (who I feel is greatly over rated) seems incredibly stupid on the Brewers end.

[Raw Biz]

No, just no. The answer is not to trade away good, young, cheap pitching for old, expensive, coming-off-an-injury pitching. If a team is in rebuilding mode, they usually trade away expensive players for good, young, cheap players. They don't trade a bunch of those players for expensive stars.

[Dollarbill13]

I'm not sure the Mets would go for that 2nd trade anyway. FWIW I think you meant we'd trade Jungman in the 2nd trade rather than Thornberg because you have Thornberg in the rotation. That team would likely compete in 2013 but it'd leave us even more bare in the minors than we already are and we'd lose Santana and Wright after next year.

 

I wouldn't totally be against acquiring Santana but I don't think it's the direction we should be moving our team at the moment.

[monty57]

I really don't want to see us trade away any of our good prospects, especially for a guy we'll only have for a short time. So, since the Mets are probably better than we are anyway, and they're looking for a SP since Pelfrey went down, how about we turn this around and trade them Greinke or Marcum for Zack Wheeler or Matt Harvey and Jordany Valdespin? We'd get a top pitching prospect and a much needed SS prospect, they improve their playoff chances this year.

[3and2Fastball]

Johan Santana has the potential to be considered one of the Top 20 pitchers of All-Time when he retires, depending of course on the rest of his career and what type of decline he has. As of right now he has a career 3.10 ERA and a career 141 ERA+ (which has him tied with Trevor Hoffman for 13th All-Time). Considering that part of his career happened during the tail-end of the Steroid Era, his career stats are awe-inspiring.

 

And it does appear that he is back completely.

 

I'm not sure that adding Wright & Santana would make us the favorites to win the World Series unfortunately. We are still way too far from having the pieces to make a run even with adding those 2 great players.

 

And I seriously doubt the Mets would trade Wright this year. It ain't happening. Not unless we traded the Mets Gallardo or Braun.

[TURBO]

Gallardo would not get us Wright...

[Dollarbill13]

I bet Gallardo would get us Wright. Gallardo is under team control through 2015 while Wright is under team control through 2013. The whole point is moot though since Wright can opt out of his contract after this year if he's traded.

[HiAndTight]

I'm not sure the Mets would go for that 2nd trade anyway. FWIW I think you meant we'd trade Jungman in the 2nd trade rather than Thornberg because you have Thornberg in the rotation. That team would likely compete in 2013 but it'd leave us even more bare in the minors than we already are and we'd lose Santana and Wright after next year.

 

I wouldn't totally be against acquiring Santana but I don't think it's the direction we should be moving our team at the moment.

 

Yes, I meant Jungman.

 

I'd just eliminate Bradley, Thornburg and Hall from trade talks(I'm higher on Hall and he's low enough ranked it wouldn't matter).

 

 

And for those who think the Mets are better than the Brewers, all I can do is laugh and try to remind you of a think called sample sizes. They're NOT better.

 

For the comment about a team rebuilding, what exactly have the Brewers done to suggest they're rebuilding? Record payroll that's nearing 105 million? What? The Brewers are not and will not rebuild.

 

I'd have had them rebuild the year they traded for Greinke and Marcum, but I'm so in love with Greinke, I'd was somewhat alright with giving away a Ryan Braun like player who can play 3rd base to get him as long as we held onto him.

 

If we don't hold onto Greinke, that goes down as one of our worst off-seasons of all time.

[HiAndTight]

I believe Wright can opt out of his contract if traded this year and I think it's safe to say he will if he is traded so the mega deal you propose wouldn't be smart for the Brewers. Even if I am wrong about that, trading basically the entire next class of pitchers for a guy who's coming off major surgery and a player in Wright (who I feel is greatly over rated) seems incredibly stupid on the Brewers end.

 

 

Ok, scratch Wright and focus on Santana then.

 

I think he's on his way to establishing himself as a elite pitcher again.

 

Trade Hart for a top prospect. Gindl/Aoki man RF. We lose power, but again that third legit arm that will be around next year.

And then throw in a guy like Jungman for Santana.

 

Then just hope you can get enough offensively with Weeks bouncing back, Aram's normal summer resurgence, Braun, Lucroy, Gomez hitting well and a good CF platoon, a good RF platoon, though with less power and a 1-4 of Greinke/Gallard/Santana/Marcum.

 

 

The Mets are not a contender, and they're in financial disarray...(though they're coming out of it, Santana has to be on the block).

[HiAndTight]

Gallardo would not get us Wright...

 

 

Please explain why a young pitcher who's thrown 200 innings or there abouts and struck out 200 the last couple years and is 26 years old, locked up for the next 3 years wouldn't get you a guy who's likely to opt out after this year for a team that's rebuilding?

 

 

It's a pet peeve of mine, but these absolute, matter of fact statements....I think the Mets would jump at Gallardo for Wright and I think the Brewers would turn that down.

[monty57]

It's a pet peeve of mine, but these absolute, matter of fact statements

 

Mine too, that's why statements like...

 

They're NOT better.

 

The Brewers are not and will not rebuild.

 

...just seem too "matter of fact" to me.

 

 

To the Brewers' chances, the Brewers will need to go 73-48 the rest of the way to get to 90 wins, which is usually a bogey for the Wild Card. That's a .603 clip the rest of the season. With the extra Wild Card, it may not take 90 to get the Wild Card, but it's looking fairly unrealistic that the 2012 Brewers will be a Wild Card team. Therefore, their playoff hopes rest on their hopes of winning the division. One of St Louis and Cincinnati should go at least .500 the rest of the way. If that's all they do, we'd still need around 84 wins to take the division, which would mean we'd have to go 67-54 the rest of the way (a .554 clip).

 

Therefore, our playoff hopes are pretty much down to our playing at a .600 clip the rest of the way or on our hoping that none of the four teams ahead of us in the standings will play much better than .500 ball the rest of the way. With the injuries we've sustained, either of these scenarios, while possible are beginning to seem unrealistic.

 

So I'd ask if it make sense to start trading away some of the few good prospects we have in order to increase our odds this year? I think we still need to wait until July to get a clearer picture, but our chances are looking slim right now. Even adding a healthy Santana at trade deadline (where we'd get around 15 starts from him) wouldn't increase our chances that much if we're still down in the standings at the deadline, so I'd argue that giving up last year's first rounder wouldn't be a good move to help the 2012 Brewers. Plus, the extra $12MM we'd have to add to the payroll wouldn't be easy to swallow.

 

Then you look at next year, when Santana will make $25.5MM. You've ridiculed me and others about our take on "the economics of baseball," but how on earth do you imagine that the Brewers will be able to pay Santana $25.5MM and pay Grienke over $20MM while still paying Weeks $11MM, Braun $9.5MM, Yo $8MM, Ramirez $10MM, Wolf a $1.5MM buyout, Aoki $1.25MM and Lucroy $0.85MM? Even if you're able to trade away Hart's $10.333MM deal, you're still looking at around $90MM for nine players with Morgan, Loe, Veras, Gomez, Parra, Kottaras, Axford, Narveson and Estrada all in their arbitration years. Trading for Santana would put a stake in the heart of the probably-already-dead idea of re-signing Grienke.

 

You say the Mets are in a financial mess and I'd say the Brewers are not far from one. They'll get there much faster if they do things like trading away our few good prospects for $25.5MM veterans or "breaking the bank" to sign one pitcher on the mistaken belief that with him the Brewers are a World Series team, but without him they are a mess which should be blown up and scrapped. No player is worth risking the franchise over.

[Dollarbill13]

Then you look at next year, when Santana will make $25.5MM. You've ridiculed me and others about our take on "the economics of baseball," but how on earth do you imagine that the Brewers will be able to pay Santana $25.5MM and pay Grienke over $20MM while still paying Weeks $11MM, Braun $9.5MM, Yo $8MM, Ramirez $10MM, Wolf a $1.5MM buyout, Aoki $1.25MM and Lucroy $0.85MM? Even if you're able to trade away Hart's $10.333MM deal, you're still looking at around $90MM for nine players with Morgan, Loe, Veras, Gomez, Parra, Kottaras, Axford, Narveson and Estrada all in their arbitration years. Trading for Santana would put a stake in the heart of the probably-already-dead idea of re-signing Grienke.

 

I think his suggestion was that the Mets would eat about half of Santana's contract, which could be true. You are right, though, that we'd have a large portion of our payroll dedicated to a few players.

 

You say the Mets are in a financial mess and I'd say the Brewers are not far from one. They'll get there much faster if they do things like trading away our few good prospects for $25.5MM veterans or "breaking the bank" to sign one pitcher on the mistaken belief that with him the Brewers are a World Series team, but without him they are a mess which should be blown up and scrapped. No player is worth risking the franchise over.

 

I think he's referring to their heavy losses in the Madoff scandal, not the fact that they have a high payroll. I would argue that the Brewers are far from a financial mess. Our attendance has been consistently strong over the past few years with increasing ticket prices, we've got a new TV and radio deal to add additional revenue, and we have an investment banker as our owner. I trust Mark to not put the organization in financial jeopardy.

[monty57]

I think he's referring to their heavy losses in the Madoff scandal, not the fact that they have a high payroll. I would argue that the Brewers are far from a financial mess. Our attendance has been consistently strong over the past few years with increasing ticket prices, we've got a new TV and radio deal to add additional revenue, and we have an investment banker as our owner. I trust Mark to not put the organization in financial jeopardy.

 

Yeah, I know the Mets' distress is partially due to the owners' dealings with Madoff, but it's also because they decided to go big into free agency and "break the bank" to sign players "they couldn't win without" which "was what they needed to do to make them World Series contenders" because "fans will stop coming if they didn't sign the big name players," and because "they had big revenue and were making money so they could afford it." These players included guys like Jason Bay, Johan Santana, Carlos Beltran, Carlos Delgado, K-Rod and so on. Now they're finally purging some of these contracts and getting through the mess caused by committing themselves to bad long-term deals to big-named players they "couldn't win without."

 

The Brewers will easily get into a very similar mess if they continue to forego cheap, young talent from the farm in favor of expensive, aging talent from trade, free agency or extending current players when they're almost at free agency. Much of our revenue comes from having 3+ million fans attending games. That can change quickly whether we sign the big contracts or don't. However, if we don't have everything tied up in big, long-term contracts and revenues drop, we will be okay. If we do have everything tied up in big, long-term, guaranteed contracts and revenues drop, we will not be okay and we'll have to "fire sale" just to dump salary. We'll get nothing in return and without a strong farm system will take a long time before we're once again thinking about being good.

 

By the way, I agree with you that Attanasio's finacial acumen is the only thing keeping me believing they know what they're doing financially, but he's not an investment banker. He is partial owner of TCW Investments, and "cut his teeth" valuating distressed debt (junk bonds). Unfortunately, most everyone who's ever owned a baseball team was successful in some business and that's how they were able to afford a team. That hasn't kept many owners from making boneheaded moves because they really want to win.

[HiAndTight]

It's a pet peeve of mine, but these absolute, matter of fact statements

 

Mine too, that's why statements like...

 

They're NOT better.

 

The Brewers are not and will not rebuild.

 

...just seem too "matter of fact" to me.

 

 

To the Brewers' chances, the Brewers will need to go 73-48 the rest of the way to get to 90 wins, which is usually a bogey for the Wild Card. That's a .603 clip the rest of the season. With the extra Wild Card, it may not take 90 to get the Wild Card, but it's looking fairly unrealistic that the 2012 Brewers will be a Wild Card team. Therefore, their playoff hopes rest on their hopes of winning the division. One of St Louis and Cincinnati should go at least .500 the rest of the way. If that's all they do, we'd still need around 84 wins to take the division, which would mean we'd have to go 67-54 the rest of the way (a .554 clip).

 

Therefore, our playoff hopes are pretty much down to our playing at a .600 clip the rest of the way or on our hoping that none of the four teams ahead of us in the standings will play much better than .500 ball the rest of the way. With the injuries we've sustained, either of these scenarios, while possible are beginning to seem unrealistic.

 

So I'd ask if it make sense to start trading away some of the few good prospects we have in order to increase our odds this year? I think we still need to wait until July to get a clearer picture, but our chances are looking slim right now. Even adding a healthy Santana at trade deadline (where we'd get around 15 starts from him) wouldn't increase our chances that much if we're still down in the standings at the deadline, so I'd argue that giving up last year's first rounder wouldn't be a good move to help the 2012 Brewers. Plus, the extra $12MM we'd have to add to the payroll wouldn't be easy to swallow.

 

Then you look at next year, when Santana will make $25.5MM. You've ridiculed me and others about our take on "the economics of baseball," but how on earth do you imagine that the Brewers will be able to pay Santana $25.5MM and pay Grienke over $20MM while still paying Weeks $11MM, Braun $9.5MM, Yo $8MM, Ramirez $10MM, Wolf a $1.5MM buyout, Aoki $1.25MM and Lucroy $0.85MM? Even if you're able to trade away Hart's $10.333MM deal, you're still looking at around $90MM for nine players with Morgan, Loe, Veras, Gomez, Parra, Kottaras, Axford, Narveson and Estrada all in their arbitration years. Trading for Santana would put a stake in the heart of the probably-already-dead idea of re-signing Grienke.

 

You say the Mets are in a financial mess and I'd say the Brewers are not far from one. They'll get there much faster if they do things like trading away our few good prospects for $25.5MM veterans or "breaking the bank" to sign one pitcher on the mistaken belief that with him the Brewers are a World Series team, but without him they are a mess which should be blown up and scrapped. No player is worth risking the franchise over.

 

 

 

 

First of all, you're right about the first part. A bit hypocritical. I should be clearer. I don't believe we're going to be rebuilding anytime soon because that, IMO would take all the momentum that the Brewers have built up, similar to the Indians of the 90's(though we've never been that good) with their attendance figures and ours would drop a great deal.

 

And I don't think Mark A wants to or is willing to sit through 3-4 rebuilding seasons. I think the time to rebuild was when we had two years left with Prince, and that's when I was calling for us to rebuild and that's when it made the most sense. You had some very good prospects in the 5 we traded away, Lawrie would have made a great 3-4 with Braun, you'd have even more pitching than you have now....

 

So as much sense as it makes to rebuild, it doesn't seem like the Brewers have any interest in doing so.

 

 

As for your salary commitments, I obviously expect the Mets to pay a significant amount of Santana's contract, I wouldn't bring back several of the players you cited, not that they'd be that expensive, and I think we'd have about 35-40 million more to fill out the roster.

 

I think the Brewers payroll is going to be around 110 next season even if they don't bring back Greinke. My biggest fear is they spend their money on keeping wolf and giving Marcum a 5 year 70 million dollar deal or something equally ridiculous, or overpay for another pitcher who's clearly not worth the contract he's given. If we're going to max out, I'd rather do it for guys who are clearly worth the money they're given and then give the several guys capable of supplementing the roster a chance. Fiers, Maldonado, Schafer, Gindl, Gamel, Green, Thornburg(who if anyone caught the game last night Melvin said was capable of pitching in the big leagues right now, and you can "easily," go from AA to the Big Leagues..while then going on to talk about how he would prefer a stop at each level. In any event, he has plenty of time to make a stop in AAA before next season starts) as well as a number of other potential candidates.

 

I also don't think you'd have any trouble moving Hart's contract. It's a one year 10 million dollar contract. Your wording there suggests it's a bad contract which I couldn't disagree with more.

[Dollarbill13]

By the way, I agree with you that Attanasio's finacial acumen is the only thing keeping me believing they know what they're doing financially, but he's not an investment banker.

 

Not that it really matters but if you google "Mark Attanasio Investment Banker" there are numerous references to him working in investment banking at Drexel Burnham Lambert.

[monty57]

I don't believe we're going to be rebuilding anytime soon because that, IMO would take all the momentum that the Brewers have built up, similar to the Indians of the 90's(though we've never been that good) with their attendance figures and ours would drop a great deal.

 

I think that barring a big turnaround this season, attendance is going to drop next year regardless of who the Brewers extend/sign. Attanasio and Melvin are understandably worried about the attendance dropping, but I hope they don't think they have a magic wand to manipulate attendance, because it is for a large part out of their control. Milwaukee/Wisconsin fans are pretty rabid and will show up for a lot of things, but we're getting pretty maxed out on attendance, so the only ways it could go are flat or down.

 

And I don't think Mark A wants to or is willing to sit through 3-4 rebuilding seasons.

 

I agree, but that could be one of those things that the longer you try to ward it off the worse it will be when it inevitably happens. Even though I think selling could be the right road to take, it may not be something Attanasio/Melvin are willing to do. I think the worst case scenario is to be "buyers" and then miss the playoffs, and I fear that this is the scenario we'll see.

 

I think the time to rebuild was when we had two years left with Prince, and that's when I was calling for us to rebuild and that's when it made the most sense.

 

I believe that Melvin tried to trade Fielder (and Hart) mid-way through that season and in the next offseason, but when he wasn't getting as much in return as he wanted, he extended Hart and then traded for Grienke and Marcum in a two-year "go for it all" gambit. Now that we're in year 2 of that gambit, we'll have to see if Melvin is willing to sell or if he will still be in "go for it all" mode.

 

As for your salary commitments, I obviously expect the Mets to pay a significant amount of Santana's contract, I wouldn't bring back several of the players you cited, not that they'd be that expensive, and I think we'd have about 35-40 million more to fill out the roster.

 

Obviously the Santana/Mets part is hypothetical, so having them pay a good part of the contract would certainly make it more palatable. However, that's an arguement against signing Grienke to a long-term deal... they rarely turn out well, and often the team ends up paying for a good portion of the player's contract after they've been traded away for little to nothing just to save some money.

 

As to the other players cited, the ones with $ figures attached to them are guaranteed contracts, so we have to either pay them or trade them. The other names are just the guys who will be in arby. I agree we won't have all of them back, but we will need to fill those roles, so if they're not filled by the guys named, they will have to be filled by someone.

 

If in this scenario Santana's contract were fully paid by the Mets, then I'd say you're probably right on the $35MM or so we'd have to fill out the roster. That may be a big "if," since he's owed $25.5MM next year.

 

I think the Brewers payroll is going to be around 110 next season even if they don't bring back Greinke. My biggest fear is they spend their money on keeping wolf and giving Marcum a 5 year 70 million dollar deal or something equally ridiculous, or overpay for another pitcher who's clearly not worth the contract he's given. If we're going to max out, I'd rather do it for guys who are clearly worth the money they're given and then give the several guys capable of supplementing the roster a chance. Fiers, Maldonado, Schafer, Gindl, Gamel, Green, Thornburg(who if anyone caught the game last night Melvin said was capable of pitching in the big leagues right now, and you can "easily," go from AA to the Big Leagues..while then going on to talk about how he would prefer a stop at each level. In any event, he has plenty of time to make a stop in AAA before next season starts) as well as a number of other potential candidates.

 

The payroll will probably be determined by projected attendance, and if we stay in the dumps this season, we'll probably have to move the figure down. I just worry about the amount of payroll which is committed long-term, as that is the money that can really bite you if revenue/attendance is less than expected. Taking a bath one year hurts, but getting stuck with long-term guaranteed contracts when revenue drops is what can lead to the Brewers having to salary dump their players. The thought of our giving Braun to another team for a couple of bad A-ballers in order to save a few million dollars makes me sad.

 

I agree that we shouldn't overpay for someone like Marcum. If he'll sign a 2- or 3-year deal with an option, then go for it, but I wouldn't touch a five-year deal with him. I also agree that Thornburg will probably pitch in the majors next season. In addition to the Melvin interview you cited, Gord Ash mentioned last week that they were "fast-tracking" him.

 

I also don't think you'd have any trouble moving Hart's contract. It's a one year 10 million dollar contract. Your wording there suggests it's a bad contract which I couldn't disagree with more.

 

Sorry if my wording was bad. I was trying to say that even without Hart's $10MM we would be around $90MM in guaranteed contracts if we paid Santana and Grienke in addition to the other contracts on the books.

 

I agree that Hart (with his contract) is very tradeable, and I think he is one of the guys we should really "shop" this year if we indeed decide to sell.

 

Not that it really matters but if you google "Mark Attanasio Investment Banker" there are numerous references to him working in investment banking at Drexel Burnham Lambert.

 

My bad. I didn't realize that he used to be an investment banker. Good catch.

[RockCoCougars]

I wouldn't touch Santana's contract w/ a ten foot pole. He's looked good thus far this season, but I don't want to be on the hook $30 million+ for one season to a guy who will be 34 next year, is off a major injury and hasn't logged 200 innings the past 3 seasons. I'd rather kick that money to the Overpay Greinke Fund. If I'm going with an old free agent pitcher for next season, I'd go with Tim Hudson, who could probably be had for a fraction of what Santana is due.