Speaking of Josh Hamilton (somebody had to) [Latest… Melvin: We have the connection with Narron but not with US Bank… post 230]

[jackailius]

First of all Monty, paying down debt? Really? That just isn't the American way. j/k Do you have a veteran SP in mind? I just don't see one out there that fits the bill as a upgrade to our rotation and only take a one year deal? yes, 2014 will be a bit of an issue if you are going to look to get anyone else but I am not seeing any holes at that point so out budget would still be approximately the same. I will agree that 2015 will start getting interesting with needs at several spots with Weeks 11.5M, Braun 12M, Gallardo 13M and Hamilton $20M. The hope is that with having two years without having to make too many trades (hopefully) you will start fielding a team that has a younger (prearb and arb) guys around your few key veterans. I guess I'm more of an all or nothing kind of guy. Why get a 1yr guy who is going to be a back of the rotation guy and have a mediocre season. At that point I would rather either go all in on either a top of the order guy or Hamilton or start building for a couple years from now. Either way I would entertain offers for folks like Gomez, Hart, and if we are going to consider it a rebuilding season or two I would add Weeks (although I think if he were traded it would be a mid season as his value is low right now), ARAM etc.

[nate82]

http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?w=1cbb7&storyId=8610003&disableShare=true&adBlock=block&i=SC&hidePageFooter=true&hidePageHeader=true

 

Rangers only offering 3 years max to Hamilton? I am officially scared now!

[brwrsfan]

Seeing how the Rangers were his first choice, I'd say that eliminates them. He'll have many teams offering longer terms I'm sure. Still doesn't mean he'd come here but if his top choice is gone...who knows?

[Bnowell4evr]

http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?w=1cbb7&storyId=8610003&disableShare=true&adBlock=block&i=SC&hidePageFooter=true&hidePageHeader=true

 

Rangers only offering 3 years max to Hamilton? I am officially scared now!

 

That's the reason why I've always thought we were a legitimate contender. I can't see anyone else crazy enough to give him 5-100 much less 7-175.

[monty57]

First of all Monty, paying down debt? Really? That just isn't the American way. j/k Do you have a veteran SP in mind? I just don't see one out there that fits the bill as a upgrade to our rotation and only take a one year deal? yes, 2014 will be a bit of an issue if you are going to look to get anyone else but I am not seeing any holes at that point so out budget would still be approximately the same. I will agree that 2015 will start getting interesting with needs at several spots with Weeks 11.5M, Braun 12M, Gallardo 13M and Hamilton $20M. The hope is that with having two years without having to make too many trades (hopefully) you will start fielding a team that has a younger (prearb and arb) guys around your few key veterans. I guess I'm more of an all or nothing kind of guy. Why get a 1yr guy who is going to be a back of the rotation guy and have a mediocre season. At that point I would rather either go all in on either a top of the order guy or Hamilton or start building for a couple years from now. Either way I would entertain offers for folks like Gomez, Hart, and if we are going to consider it a rebuilding season or two I would add Weeks (although I think if he were traded it would be a mid season as his value is low right now), ARAM etc.

 

Haren is a possibility. The Angels paid him $3.5MM not to pitch there, and couldn't get anyone else to trade for him. He could very well be had for a one-year, incentive-laden deal so he could build his value up. His bad back seems to be the reason for his down first half, and his numbers in the second half were similar to his excellent 2010 and 2011 seasons. Marcum is another, but his ship seems to have sailed from Milwaukee.

 

I don't look at the biggest need to be someone who is better than our young guys, as we have talented young guys. Rather, I think the need is for someone who can relieve innings from the young guys' arms. We would probably be okay going into the season with the guys we have, but around August, right in the middle of (hopefully) a pennant race, we'd have to shelve guys as they reached their innings limit. If we could get a #3/4 starter who could pitch every five days, we could put Rogers at #5, skipping him when the schedule allows, and put Peralta in AAA on an innings/pitch count to keep both of their innings down. If we could find a Haren-type who ends up pitching like a #1/2, then that's great, but I'd be happy with someone who posts a 4.00-ish ERA over 200 IP.

 

Sure there's risk to doing that, but there's risk to everything. If we have money "in the bank," we could always pick up a salary dump player mid-season if we needed an upgrade. I think we have some bright spots shining in the future, just needing to sneak by the 2014 financial hump when we'll have Ramirez making a boatload of money. With the way things are lining up, I'd rather the risk we take this offseason not tie our hands long-term... let's see how the young guys shake out before signing another big money, multi-year deal.

[Mass Haas]

So ESPN's Christina Kahrl is just the latest who can't help but picture a Brewers - Josh Hamilton marriage

[jerichoholicninja]

Weren't a lot of pundits saying that Jose Reyes would sign with the Brewers last year?

[logan82]

Weren't a lot of pundits saying that Jose Reyes would sign with the Brewers last year?

Yes they were. Honestly I think Reyes last year made way more sense than Hamilton does this year. At this point I think they are just trolling.

[endaround]

Weren't a lot of pundits saying that Jose Reyes would sign with the Brewers last year?

 

At least the Brewers actually needed a shortstop.

[nate82]

Weren't a lot of pundits saying that Jose Reyes would sign with the Brewers last year?

 

I believe the Brewers were in on Reyes last year but wouldn't give him that extra year that the Marlins would give him and then the Brewers went with Gonzalez and Ramirez over just Reyes.

 

I can see why the Brewers are linked to Hamilton I just don't see it as a reality. Reyes rumors last year were real and I just don't believe the Hamilton ones are this year.

[MNBrew]

Weren't a lot of pundits saying that Jose Reyes would sign with the Brewers last year?

 

At least the Brewers actually needed a shortstop.

 

Yes, theoretically the Brewers don't need another starting OF. However...

 

Going into last winter, the Brewers still ended up signing Aramis Ramirez in spite of having McGehee (down year), Green (hugely promising AAA year & made post-season roster), & Gamel (huge bat & also a 3B but likely headed to 1B).

 

I do love how the Ramirez signing worked out in hindsight, though I think Green kinda got hosed (by Ishikawa being kept) even after a great spring training & ended up w/ a very blah year in AAA. And McGehee netted us a should've-been-better-but-sometimes-alright power BP arm.

 

I'd still guess that Hamilton's more likely playing for a team other than MIL next year. But Kahrl's logic is solid and I could see other dominoes falling after a Hamilton signing that end up addressing other team needs.

 

...All I'm saying is that just because things look a certain way now doesn't mean they'll necessarily remain that way. (...which could also lead to Melvin making moves to address other team needs from a position of reasonable strength.)

[JohnBriggs12]

Great in theory MN Brew, but when has Melvin ever really embraced the idea of a series of moves to fit one guy in? You cite last year with Ramirez, but dumping McGehee after a poor year was easy. Creativity like you suggest isn't in Melvin's DNA. The only way they fit in Hamilton is if Melvin has a decent offer from somebody on the table for Gomez. I think if the price dropped enough for Hamilton, I think they'd have to consider sacrificing speed and defense to replace Gomez' bat with Hamilton's. But Melvin isn't the type to want to make multiple deals.

[Warning Track Power]

I actually Melvin thinks the Hamilton move makes sense from the standpoint of a long term contract. Let's say Gomez does exactly the same thing in 2013 as he did in 2012, 20 HR 40 SB & a .260/.300 slash with the same gold glove D. Do you give Gomez a 5 year $50 million contract he would likely get in the open market or do you give Josh Hamilton 5 years $100 million? I think that is the view Melvin is taking and why we are mentioned in the Hamilton discussion.

 

I will be curious to see what BJ Upton gets in free agency this offseason because I think you will be looking at a similar deal for Gomez if he repeats his 2012 season.

[brwrsfan]

I have a hard time believing Gomez will be back after this season unless he takes a team friendly deal. Unless something has changed, I believe he is a Boras client, and team friendly deals with him are about 1 in 1000.

 

So your point about the future of Gomez and his contract vs Hamilton actually makes a lot of sense. You can keep them both this year still - there will be starts to go around as Hamilton has missed games, days off for guys and the PH/PR spots for Gomez. Then just let him leave after the season....

[Kelbysdaddy]

i'm glad hamilton/ brewers rumors have slowed down

[TooLiveBrew]

I actually Melvin thinks the Hamilton move makes sense from the standpoint of a long term contract. Let's say Gomez does exactly the same thing in 2013 as he did in 2012, 20 HR 40 SB & a .260/.300 slash with the same gold glove D. Do you give Gomez a 5 year $50 million contract he would likely get in the open market or do you give Josh Hamilton 5 years $100 million? I think that is the view Melvin is taking and why we are mentioned in the Hamilton discussion.

 

I will be curious to see what BJ Upton gets in free agency this offseason because I think you will be looking at a similar deal for Gomez if he repeats his 2012 season.

Melvin has gone on record basically saying that he thinks huge FA contracts are way too big a risk. I think the offer tendered to Greinke represents 100% of how far he'd go to sign a player.

 

I think the only reason non-local sportswriters keep pointing at the Brewers is simple: Narron.

[MNBrew]

Sure, but don't discount the layers of "GM speak". On one hand, he's often proven very true to his word when he makes "forecasting" comments like that. But he's also made a bevy of "we're not motivated to trade him" remarks about guys over the years when he's also had total willingness if not even potential hopefulness to make a deal if it's the right deal.

[RockCoCougars]

I have a hard time believing Gomez will be back after this season unless he takes a team friendly deal. Unless something has changed, I believe he is a Boras client, and team friendly deals with him are about 1 in 1000.

 

So your point about the future of Gomez and his contract vs Hamilton actually makes a lot of sense. You can keep them both this year still - there will be starts to go around as Hamilton has missed games, days off for guys and the PH/PR spots for Gomez. Then just let him leave after the season....

 

Not to veer this completely off topic, but if I'm Gomez, I'm chomping at the bit to get an extension signed this off season. He's basically been on a career trajectory of a rich man's Alex Ochoa. He could build on what he did last season, or things could go south fast. I think that he'd be well served to take the financial security of a multi year extension, Scott Boras be danged.

[endaround]

Or he's a 3 years younger Micheal Bourn about to get $15 million per year.

[SRB]

They should just extend Gomez now while it would still be quite cheap. I think he's severely underrated given his impressive tools and the step forward he took last season (and age-wise he's just now entering his prime). The problem with him was never skills it was just maturity as a player, and now he is starting to mature.

[TooLiveBrew]

For anyone in favor of extending Gomez (I am, but not at what I think it'll cost), watch what Bourn & Upton get as FAs this offseason. If you're willing to beat the contracts they get, maybe then I could see a Boras client not hitting free agency. Otherwise there's no realistic chance.

[SRB]

For anyone in favor of extending Gomez (I am, but not at what I think it'll cost), watch what Bourn & Upton get as FAs this offseason. If you're willing to beat the contracts they get, maybe then I could see a Boras client not hitting free agency. Otherwise there's no realistic chance.

I don't think any executive is putting Gomez in the same class as Bourn/Upton, not even close. Unless I am seriously underestimating how much the consensus opinion of him has changed over the course of last season.

[TooLiveBrew]

If he puts in a replica of '12 in '13, he'll probably be looking at pretty similar FA deals. Or at least that's what Boras will be telling him, wrt a hypothetical Brewers extension offer.

[brwrsfan]

At the moment, no, he's not Upton or Bourn, but if he goes out there again this year and hit's .260 with 20+ HR, 40+ steals and great defense, his value is going to increase an awful lot. He may still not get the contract Bourn or Upton get but I don't think it's unreasonable for him to get pretty close to it. And if he's in the range and Hamilton is say 5-7 million a year more...it's not that crazy of a thought.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Toolivebrew,

 

Doug Melvin I believe in one of Tom H jsonline articles a couple years back said that big contracts to pitchers are more risky than position players. Does that mean he'd offer more to a position player?