Possible SS Replacements

[logan82]

People wanted Barmes for his defense, not his bat.

[reillymcshane]

Is Renteria at all an option? I am done watching Izturis. We need to do something at this position. It seems like the outfielders play at about 250 feet from him when he bats. (Next time he comes to the plate take a look at how far they move up. It's ridiculous.)

 

While I agree with you assessment but be careful what you wish for. Remember when everyone wanted Clint Barmes instead of Yuni last year and in this offseason? His offense so far this year is Weeks without the walks or the power. Speaking of Weeks, if he were hitting, the lack of offense at SS wouldn't be so damaging.

 

Honestly, what have they got to lose bringing up Bianchi and giving him the job for 2 months? They can always go back to Izturis.

 

Renteria really looked done as a fielder last year. I doubt he'd be much of an upgrade.

 

I agree with Briggs - what have we got to lose with Bianchi. Maysonet isn't much. Izturis is a .500 OPSing SS with solid (but not great) glove. Bianchi had a decent bat a few years back - before missing 2010 with Tommy John surgery. The guy was their 2008 defensive player of the year in the minors. I honestly don't know how it is now - the arm surgery might have sapped some of his skill. 2011 wasn't anything great for him, but he had missed a full year of ball before that. It takes time to recover. Maybe he's just now getting up to full strength.

 

As for Barmes, I wanted him over Gonzalez. But man, he's been awful at the plate.

[RockCoCougars]

I'd rather have Tejada than Renteria, so I googled to check his status. Wouldn't you know that the Orioles have snapped him up as well? I was on the Barmes train as well. Seems like a bullet was dodged there....not sure that I'd take on that contract at this point. Not trading for Furcal seems like a real miss in hindsight, but I wonder if the Brewers would have given him the contract to retain him. The bottom line is that Melvin and Co. are going to have to work something at SS if they want to contend this year. Izturis/Maysonet likely isn't going to get the job done down the stretch.

[Bombers]

I am all aboard the Bianchi train - they need to try something

[nate82]

I'd rather have Tejada than Renteria, so I googled to check his status.

Tejada was worse than Betancourt defensively at SS last year when he played at SS for the Giants that is.

[RockCoCougars]

I'd rather have Tejada than Renteria, so I googled to check his status.

Tejada was worse than Betancourt defensively at SS last year when he played at SS for the Giants that is.

 

Right, but I'd rather have him at this point than Renteria. I'd rather have Yuni back than either of them.

[logan82]

I'd rather have Tejada than Renteria, so I googled to check his status.

Tejada was worse than Betancourt defensively at SS last year when he played at SS for the Giants that is.

 

Right, but I'd rather have him at this point than Renteria. I'd rather have Yuni back than either of them.

You shouldn't curse like that.

[Outlander]

I am all aboard the Bianchi train - they need to try something

 

What has happened to him, he hasn't played the last few games at AAA? I was hoping they were bringing him up but that didn't happen.

[reillymcshane]

I'd rather have Tejada than Renteria, so I googled to check his status. Wouldn't you know that the Orioles have snapped him up as well? I was on the Barmes train as well. Seems like a bullet was dodged there....not sure that I'd take on that contract at this point. Not trading for Furcal seems like a real miss in hindsight, but I wonder if the Brewers would have given him the contract to retain him. The bottom line is that Melvin and Co. are going to have to work something at SS if they want to contend this year. Izturis/Maysonet likely isn't going to get the job done down the stretch.

 

Tejada is almost sloth-like in the field. I think he'd be a big downgrade in the field. I'd rather go Renteria than Tejada.

[reillymcshane]

Improving SS is the one key area that the Brewers can make a move to improve if they want to win in 2012. Maysonet and Izzy are nothing more than back ups (at best).

 

Now, in addition to getting a better SS, we need a majority of the following to occur:

 

- Weeks to return to form

- A-Ram to return to form

- Morgan to return to form

- K-Rod to return to form

- Axford to return to form

- Veras to return to form

- Wolf to return to form

 

If 5 or 6 of the above items need to occur, and then we'll be back into things. But we have too many guys playing way below their capabilities.

 

We can't ask Izzy or Maysonet to 'return to form' - because they are playing to form - poorly. The above guys we can hold out hope they'll get it together (some of them are showing signs of it already). But guys who aren't good - like Izzy - we can't expect to suddenly get 'good' - or even average. Therefore, that's the one roster spot at this time that we can really scrounge for an upgrade.

 

The rest of the guys - we just have to hope they get it together.

[Baldkin]

I will say since May the 8th, Nyjer has raised his OPS 120 points, and is OBPing .400. He's looked much better.

[monty57]

Improving SS is the one key area that the Brewers can make a move to improve if they want to win in 2012. Maysonet and Izzy are nothing more than back ups (at best).

 

Now, in addition to getting a better SS, we need a majority of the following to occur:

 

- Weeks to return to form

- A-Ram to return to form

- Morgan to return to form

- K-Rod to return to form

- Axford to return to form

- Veras to return to form

- Wolf to return to form

 

If 5 or 6 of the above items need to occur, and then we'll be back into things. But we have too many guys playing way below their capabilities.

 

We can't ask Izzy or Maysonet to 'return to form' - because they are playing to form - poorly. The above guys we can hold out hope they'll get it together (some of them are showing signs of it already). But guys who aren't good - like Izzy - we can't expect to suddenly get 'good' - or even average. Therefore, that's the one roster spot at this time that we can really scrounge for an upgrade.

 

The rest of the guys - we just have to hope they get it together.

 

I'd add that we also need Grienke and Braun to continue producing at ridiculously good levels (even better than their "normal" great), Ishikawa, Loe, Gomez and Parra to continue to play better than their "norms" and Aoki to really be a .750+ OPS player.

 

Overall, we've been pretty poor this season, which happens when you have three bad injuries and several key players hitting like third graders, but we have had some players doing really well. I'm sure guys like Weeks, Ramirez, etc will be better than they've shown so far this season, but I doubt Braun will end the season .050 OPS points higher than last year's MVP season, Greinke will only give up 1 run every three games, Ishikawa will be an .850 OPS guy, and so on.

 

If Weeks, Ramirez and Gallardo heat up we will look a lot better. I just hope that happens sooner rather than later, and that their heating up won't coincide with Braun and Grienke cooling down. And, we need to play injury-free the rest of the season.

[Bombers]

MLBTR says "Hudson turned down an opportunity to play regularly elsewhere in order to join the White Sox in this role." ... wonder if that elsewhere was here in Milwaukee.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/05/orlando-hudson-to-sign-with-white-sox.html

[Crew2323]

MLBTR says "Hudson turned down an opportunity to play regularly elsewhere in order to join the White Sox in this role." ... wonder if that elsewhere was here in Milwaukee.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/05/orlando-hudson-to-sign-with-white-sox.html

 

I have difficulty believing it was Milwaukee. From what I can see he's never played an inning at SS in his career.

[RockCoCougars]

I know SS defense is very important, but the way this team looks right now, I'd take a stronger offensive guy in a heartbeat. Izturis seems solid defensively, but he is almost an automatic out at the plate. On a team that is full of automatic outs at this point, I'd probably sacrifice some defense at short considering how many strikeouts this staff gets. I guess that the challenge here is finding a SS who can hit.

[MNBrew]

Heck, I'd just take a good athlete at SS as long as he can hit. Heck, I'd play Carlos Gomez there on days he's not starting in the OF. Ridiculous? Yes. But that's how utterly worthless Izturis is.

 

Defense be, um, well, "darned" (not sure if the normal term passes through the cursing filter), Izturis is flat-out BEYOND terrible at the plate. We have 2 automatic outs in the lineup anytime he plays -- 3, really, as long as Weeks is this far gone, too -- and this team's hitting so badly that we can't afford to have 3 automatic outs. We have plenty of reason to expect Weeks to improve, but not Izturis. Heck, we have pitchers who are better hitters than Izturis.

 

Yuni had plenty of flaws -- usually quite obvious to the naked eye on a regular basis. But he also had ample good points. As a baseball player, Izturis doesn't really have any good points. I'd take Yuni and his bat along w/ his suspect/questionable/periodically painful D over Izturis every day of the year. Yes, I'm that serious.

[brettac1]

On the bright side, they didn't sign Jimmy Rollins. Turrible!

[Bombers]

On the bright side, they didn't sign Jimmy Rollins. Turrible!

Ya, but it was either Rollins or Ramirez. And they have done about the same this year. So in the end, both were bad ideas (so far)

[Warning Track Power]

I brought this up in the Kottaras thread as well but it might be worth investigating Danny Espinosa of the Nationals. While he plays 2B in Washington, he came up as an SS in the minors. No clue about his D there though.

 

Washington has needs in CF, C and closer which are all areas of semi-relative strength in either depth or talent. I'd be willing to part with any combination of Gomez, Kottaras and K-Rod to land Espinosa.

[brewerfan82]

On the bright side, they didn't sign Jimmy Rollins. Turrible!

Ya, but it was either Rollins or Ramirez. And they have done about the same this year. So in the end, both were bad ideas (so far)

 

I think you're exaggerating how bad Ramirez' year has been...

 

Ramirez - 27 R, 3 HR, 25 RBI, 2 SB, .231/.302/.400/.702

Rollins - 22 R. 1 HR, 7 RBI, 9 SB, .229/.295/.283/.578

 

Unless you're only looking at average or you REALLY value stolen bases, I think it's clear we've gotten more production from A-Ram. You could argue we'd be better off not signing either of them and just going with Green at third, but I think the real bullet dodged was letting McGehee go:

 

McGehee - 6 R, 0 HR, 5 RBI. 1 SB. .186/.279/.247/.527

 

Wooof...

[HiAndTight]

I brought this up in the Kottaras thread as well but it might be worth investigating Danny Espinosa of the Nationals. While he plays 2B in Washington, he came up as an SS in the minors. No clue about his D there though.

 

Washington has needs in CF, C and closer which are all areas of semi-relative strength in either depth or talent. I'd be willing to part with any combination of Gomez, Kottaras and K-Rod to land Espinosa.

 

 

I'm not willing to deal with Gomez just yet.

 

It's a long-long shot, but he's still young, and while the last couple years I'd have just as soon waived him as done anything else(not literally, he's provided value obviously defensively). But this year he looks different at the plate.

 

Like a pitcher who adds a couple MPH to his fastball(Estrada as poor example as the upsides aren't even close) Gomez has actually had a MUCH improved approach at the plate.

 

Could it be short lived? Of course. Is it likely? Absolutely. Does it annoy me when people ask questions and then answer them themselves? Certainly.

 

But I'd rather just hold onto Gomez as his value is minimal and his upside IF that 1 in a 100 type player turns out to be Gomez. That superstar potential who just simply came up too early and took a while to "get it."

 

I was debating this in another thread and people were calling it a "hot streak." I'm not even bothering to look at his numbers. It's his at bats. It's him taking a get me over slider on the 1st pitch because he can't do anything with it, taking off the plate and then getting a pitch to hit and going up the middle with it and hitting it hard.

 

I really doubt he'll end up keeping this up, but he looks like a completely different player than in the past, even when he had hot streaks, he was still up there with the same approach. It JUST might be possible that he's changed his approach and now he's actually capable of becoming a .280 hitter and even just at .320 his value absolutely skyrockets as I think with his frame and his bat speed it would result in more HR's, the added OBP would lead to a lot more stolen bases at a very high clip, AND he'd still be a great defender in CF.

 

And what do we have to lose? It's not like he would be much of a deal breaker in Washington as his value can't be that much higher than Ankiel's.

 

 

 

 

But that's just me. I've gone from wondering why Gomez has still been on our roster, to valuing his defense and the other aspects he brings, to seeing a glimpse of him approaching the game differently this year and actually giving me the hope he can become a extremely valuable #7 type hitter and GG defender in CF and not just a platoon player who's value lies entirely on his D.

[HiAndTight]

Heck, I'd just take a good athlete at SS as long as he can hit. Heck, I'd play Carlos Gomez there on days he's not starting in the OF. Ridiculous? Yes. But that's how utterly worthless Izturis is.

 

Defense be, um, well, "darned" (not sure if the normal term passes through the cursing filter), Izturis is flat-out BEYOND terrible at the plate. We have 2 automatic outs in the lineup anytime he plays -- 3, really, as long as Weeks is this far gone, too -- and this team's hitting so badly that we can't afford to have 3 automatic outs. We have plenty of reason to expect Weeks to improve, but not Izturis. Heck, we have pitchers who are better hitters than Izturis.

 

Yuni had plenty of flaws -- usually quite obvious to the naked eye on a regular basis. But he also had ample good points. As a baseball player, Izturis doesn't really have any good points. I'd take Yuni and his bat along w/ his suspect/questionable/periodically painful D over Izturis every day of the year. Yes, I'm that serious.

 

 

Good god...two things I never thought I'd be saying/agreeing with last year.

 

Gomez playing everyday and actually having the chance to be a very solid player, and actually....missing Yuni B? Seriously, when you MISS Yuni Beancourt what in the hell is going on with your team?

 

I even miss Craig Counsell.

[Hitman_Hart]

[sarcasm]Bill Hall just became available.[/sarcasm]

[cvollbrecht]

Pastornicky just got sent down by the Braves to make room for Adrelton Simmons. He has some questions about his arm sticking at SS, but he has great instincts (think Hardy w/o the arm). Maybe we could pick him up for Green+? They need somebody to pick up for Chipper always being injured/old.

 

Green & C prospect

for

Pastornicky

[jerichoholicninja]

They need somebody to pick up for Chipper always being injured/old.

 

Don't we need someone to pick up for Aramis being injured/old? I don't think Pastornicky is worth trading anything for.