What do you think we have in Aoki?

[Raw Biz]

We're now into May and Aoki has only started 3 games, 1 of which was in LF when Braun was hurt. Using his Japanese stats, spring training and what we've seen so far, he really should be getting more PT. Even when he makes an out, he sees a lot of pitches. He works the pitcher, which is a very underrated skill. I see no reason why he shouldn't be getting at least 1 start a week, if not 2. Gomez only starts against lefties (or at least he should) and I think Morgan and Aoki should split the other games. Even with a 60/40 split for Morgan, Aoki should be seeing 2 starts a week. And Hart should get a day off twice a month as well, with Aoki getting some starts there. Hopefully he gets a chance to start tonight.

[monty57]

We're now into May and Aoki has only started 3 games, 1 of which was in LF when Braun was hurt. Using his Japanese stats, spring training and what we've seen so far, he really should be getting more PT. Even when he makes an out, he sees a lot of pitches. He works the pitcher, which is a very underrated skill. I see no reason why he shouldn't be getting at least 1 start a week, if not 2. Gomez only starts against lefties (or at least he should) and I think Morgan and Aoki should split the other games. Even with a 60/40 split for Morgan, Aoki should be seeing 2 starts a week. And Hart should get a day off twice a month as well, with Aoki getting some starts there. Hopefully he gets a chance to start tonight.

 

...and when Gamel needs a day off, Hart should start at 1B with Aoki in RF.

 

Really, Morgan (coming off a near .800 OPS playoff season in which the fans loved him) should have just been traded for a RH bench bat and a prospect when Aoki was signed and Braun was exonerated. Now we're stuck with three CF, two of whom are very similar players, and because of last season we're probably going to play the less talented of the two the majority of the time while the more talented is losing PAs to the likes of Travis Ishikawa and Cesar Izturis.

[GormanHarvey]

Aoki is starting in CF tonight so it should at the very least give us a good look at his defense at Petco

[HiAndTight]

A bit quick for a lot of people to comment on here. Here's what we know:

-Morgan ranks as among the best defensive CF's, although struggles sometimes coming in on balls and has a weak arm

-Morgan should never face a lefty.

-Gomez should rarely face a righty (don't be fooled by small samples so far. a few good at bats don't chance the 2,000 or so of his career)

-Gomez ranks among the top 2 or 3 defensive CF's, although struggles with some routes going back on balls, but has a very strong arm

-Gomez has power, but allergic to working count and drawing walks

-Aoki has good at bats and slaps the ball all over the field.

-Aoki historically bats better off lefties than righties.

-Aoki has adequate range for CF, but we also have 2 of the top 5 CF's in baseball ahead of him

 

As of now, I like the idea of letting Gomez face lefties, Morgan face 2/3rd of righties, and Aoki face 1/3, while also trying to get Hart a few days off a month (and perhaps Braun given intercoastal injuries in past).

 

 

 

-Gomez is still just 26 years old.

-Gomez is the most talented of the bunch at 6'4 220 and possibly the fastest guy in all of baseball.

-Nobody here is ignorant of his issues thus far in his career, however plenty of players have improved their game.

-We all follow baseball. We don't need to be told to not buy into Gomez and his small sample size as though this is a class. But the fact remains, the guy was brought up way too early and is the best pure athlete on this team. Those types of players sometimes struggle early on.

 

 

Chances are he finishes the year with a .275 OBP, but right now he's taking some pitches, taking good swings and laying off the slider more than I've seen him do up until now. So....when you consider the fact that he's got incredible defense and value without hitting .285/325, I'm still holding out hope he can be that player. At least as long as he IS being that player.

[logan82]

Those types of players sometimes struggle early on.

It is no longer "early on" for Gomez. He has over 1700 Major league PA and has shown no sustained improvement since he got to the majors. Nothing more than a good week here or there which every player has.

[jerichoholicninja]

Those types of players sometimes struggle early on.

It is no longer "early on" for Gomez. He has over 1700 Major league PA and has shown no sustained improvement since he got to the majors. Nothing more than a good week here or there which every player has.

 

People can use the excuse of Gomez being "young" and "inexperienced" all they want but 26 isn't young for a major leaguer anymore and he's spent 5 full seasons on a major league roster. What you see is what you get. He'll play great defense, run fast, hit the ball far sometimes, swing at anything that's within 10 feet of the plate, and occasionally do something stupid on the bases. He's a useful player but will never be an every day player.

[JohnBriggs12]

Those types of players sometimes struggle early on.

It is no longer "early on" for Gomez. He has over 1700 Major league PA and has shown no sustained improvement since he got to the majors. Nothing more than a good week here or there which every player has.

 

People can use the excuse of Gomez being "young" and "inexperienced" all they want but 26 isn't young for a major leaguer anymore and he's spent 5 full seasons on a major league roster. What you see is what you get. He'll play great defense, run fast, hit the ball far sometimes, swing at anything that's within 10 feet of the plate, and occasionally do something stupid on the bases. He's a useful player but will never be an every day player.

 

 

Pretty much the same was said about Mike Cameron when he was with the White Sox and hit .210 at age 25.

[brewtown82]

Can he play first base?

[endaround]

 

 

Pretty much the same was said about Mike Cameron when he was with the White Sox and hit .210 at age 25.

 

And if Gomez hit at age 24 like Cameron did everyone would not be saying this.

[logan82]

Pretty much the same was said about Mike Cameron when he was with the White Sox and hit .210 at age 25.

That is a borderline trollish comment. Thanks for your insight.

[Brewtacular]

Beautiful grab by Aoki last night. I don't get to see many games since I live out of state but when I do get to see them it seems like Aoki continually has good/long at bats. I'd like to see him playing more, he does a good job.

 

I also wish announcers could learn to pronounce his name. Man, the Twins announcers continually butchered it with different enunciations each time.

[Funketown]

What do people think of Aoki's defense? I feel like he's a bit sluggish for CF, though his routes look fine. I've also not been impressed by his arm very much. Of course, we're used to watching Gomez in CF so that might be part of why I haven't been overly impressed with his defense.

 

I've really liked what he's been able to do at the plate. It's clear that he's going to hit with little power, but he strikes out so rarely that I wouldn't be surprised to see him carry a .290/.350/.400 line. At this point I almost wish they would have dealt Plush before the season, but I guess the additional depth can't hurt.

[trwi7]

Not impressed at all by his defense. He seems slow to react and doesn't have the foot speed to make up for it.

[Glennron]

. I've also not been impressed by his arm very much. Of course, we're used to watching Gomez in CF so that might be part of why I haven't been overly impressed with his defense.

 

I feel like at best his arm is as "strong" as Morgan's. Which is to say he has a weak arm.

[endaround]

There is a reason he wasn't projected as a major league CFer. His bat was questionable for LF and his arm makes RF a question. Hence he's in Milwaukee as a 4th OFer.

[mothershipconnection]

I don't get to see many games since I live out of state but when I do get to see them it seems like Aoki continually has good/long at bats.

 

Mlb.tv. Do it.

 

I agree with others on Aoki's defense. Dude is definitely our weakest CF. He should probably be in LF, but that ain't happening in this lineup.

[pete]

Morgan is a bad defender. Aoki is a significant upgrade if you ask me. His arm is stronger too. Of course the ball boys probably have stronger throwing arms than Morgan.

[ninja33]

I won't debate the arm, but Morgan is a better defender than Aoki. One nice over the shoulder catch from Aoki does not count for more than 3+ seasons of Morgan grading out as an above-average to very good defender in just about every metric (aside from however they measure arm strength). I really don't think it's even that close. And that's not me saying I have a problem with the way Aoki plays defense in CF...I just don't understand people saying Morgan is a bad defender.

[pete]

To quote Kevin Goldstein, there are a truck load of flaws in defensive metrics.

 

Last season he had several plays where if he just tracked the ball and put up his glove he would have caught it but instead he just threw his arms up. Its one thing to fail to catch the ball, but its another to just run and flail. Its not uncommon for him to get a bad jump or take a bad route.

[cvollbrecht]

With the team as constructed as it is this year I would actually think I makes for our best lineup to have all 3 platoon in both CF and RF with Hart moving to 1B full time. It would improve our defense in the outfield and infield while improving our offense as well.

 

The pairings would be:

RHP - Morgan and Aoki

LHP - Gomez and Aoki

Occasional RHP lineup - Gomez and Morgan

 

Basically make it so everyone gets 2/3 starts in the OF.

 

Sorry if this is incoherent but I'm typing it on my phone!

[ninja33]

To quote Kevin Goldstein, there are a truck load of flaws in defensive metrics.

 

yes, there are plenty of flaws. But over 3+ seasons most defensive metrics give a pretty accurate description of a player. And just about every defensive metric agrees that Nyjer Morgan is an above average to very good defender.

 

it's probably not fair for me to use metrics that need 3 seasons to say Morgan is a better defender than Aoki, for whom I am using the eye test (from the brief time we've had him, I don't think he has the speed/range to be anything more than adequate). But I still feel comfortable saying that Morgan is a good defender based on what I've seen (and that includes a weak arm and the occasional bad route to a ball) and the defensive metrics that support that conclusion.

[Funketown]

I don't think Morgan is a great defender, but he is at worst average. I'd peg him as slightly above average right now. He takes some poor routes and looks like a complete fool 3-4 times per year, but he has the speed to make fairly difficult plays look routine. Also, over the past few years we're used to watching Carlos Gomez and Mike Cameron. Those are hard standards to live up to.

[DHonks]

Morgan is a great defender in CF. He goes back on the ball amazingly well. To be honest, the only things Gomez does better are coming in on the ball and throwing. To the sides they're pretty much the same. Both are great to have

 

As for Aoki, he's hitting well, but I worry that he has a hard time getting the ball to the OF grass on fewer than 10 hops. Morgan drives the ball much better, which is hard to believe. I do love Aoki's at bats until the ball is weakly in play and I have to hope it'll find a hole.

[HiAndTight]

Morgan is a great defender in CF. He goes back on the ball amazingly well. To be honest, the only things Gomez does better are coming in on the ball and throwing. To the sides they're pretty much the same. Both are great to have

 

As for Aoki, he's hitting well, but I worry that he has a hard time getting the ball to the OF grass on fewer than 10 hops. Morgan drives the ball much better, which is hard to believe. I do love Aoki's at bats until the ball is weakly in play and I have to hope it'll find a hole.

 

 

I don't agree with that at all. Gomez gets a better jump and just has much better speed than Morgan. He covers a lot more ground going back, forward and throwing the ball.

 

And by the way, when you say he's "only, " better at coming in on balls and throwing, well, he has a HUGE advantage throwing the ball than Mogan does. So I don't see the two being all that close.

 

In fairness Gomez may be the best defender in the game in CF while Morgan is simply a well above average CF'er.

[brettac1]

Morgan is a great defender in CF. He goes back on the ball amazingly well. To be honest, the only things Gomez does better are coming in on the ball and throwing. To the sides they're pretty much the same. Both are great to have

 

As for Aoki, he's hitting well, but I worry that he has a hard time getting the ball to the OF grass on fewer than 10 hops. Morgan drives the ball much better, which is hard to believe. I do love Aoki's at bats until the ball is weakly in play and I have to hope it'll find a hole.

 

 

I don't agree with that at all. Gomez gets a better jump and just has much better speed than Morgan. He covers a lot more ground going back, forward and throwing the ball.

 

And by the way, when you say he's "only, " better at coming in on balls and throwing, well, he has a HUGE advantage throwing the ball than Mogan does. So I don't see the two being all that close.

 

In fairness Gomez may be the best defender in the game in CF while Morgan is simply a well above average CF'er.

This is pretty much how I feel. As much as I detest watching Gomez try to hit, his defense is a joy to watch. I think he's head and shoulders above Morgan, though I think Morgan is average or maybe above. I love the attacking CF that Gomez plays, though I also loved the easy grace that Mike Cameron played the position with. Even though I am generally more of a fan of offense, watching great CF play is one of my favorite things.

 

As far as Aoki, he shouldn't be in CF at all when you have those two guys healthy.