Minor league Pitching

[jjfanec]

I have not been following the Brewers near as long as many on this board, especially the minors, but when was the last time we had this many young pitchers worth following. It seems like every night we have another young guy who were excited about pitching. The best part is each one has had a good first game!

 

AAA - Peralta, Fiers, Rogers

AA - Thornburg, Scarpetta and to a lesser extent Merklinger and Heckathorn

A+ - Bradley, Jungmann, Nelson and Hall. This team will be fun

A - Not as much here but I am intrigued by Gagnon and to a lesser extent Miller

[Tedaldtada]

The lower levels are packed full of interesting names as well. I wish they would move guys like Ross, McClung and even Miller to the pen in favor of being more aggressive with the younger guys.

[TheCrew07]

In 2003 we looked pretty loaded with pitchers up and down the minors and after the 2008 draft as well. The team really didn't have the draft focus turned towards pitching until recently so we've never had this many high draft picks in the minors from a pitching perspective in the past.

 

Most people probably remember the state of the system in 2008 when Braddock and Rogers were still starters and there was still hope for Parra, but in 2003:

At Beloit we had Parra, Pena, Sarfate, and Wilhelmsen all starting

At Huntsville we had SPs Liriano, Martinez, Jones, Hendrickson, and RPs Adams, Diggins, Childers

At High Desert Chris Saenz put up K rate over 9.

At Indianapolis the only guy I remember being excited about was Ford, he didn't walk anyone.

At Helena we had Eveland, Dillard, and Taubenheim

At MLB there was still hope that Neugebauer would be able to return from injury and pitch effectively again.

i didn't care much about the AZL so I have no idea who was playing there.

 

It's crazy how fast that list got thinned out. Liriano and Martinez never repeated their success and were oldish for AA anyway, Saenz got one start in Mil out of AA in 2004 and his career was over due to injury. Wilhelmsen got the death penalty from the organization for smoking weed, Taubenheim was eventually traded in the Overbay deal. Eveland never realized his potential and was traded, Hendrickson didn't cut it in MLB and was released (who can forget that crazy parting shot at the board from his dad?), Jones suffered multiple injuries and never made it, Parra was injured and has performed poorly in MLB relegating himself to the bullpen. Pena ended up being converted to a closer but never mastered his command eventually being released, Sarfate was converted to the pen but also never mastered his command. Diggins topped out at AA, but I believe he got injured as well? Childers peaked at AAA for Milwaukee that same season but eventually pitched in the major leagues for the Rays making 5 appearances in 2006, I thought there was hope he was late bloomer. Finally Adams was in the majors by 2004 in Mil, was traded to the Mets for Gonzalez in 2006, was eventually put on waivers that same season by the Mets, claimed by Cleveland, and traded to San Diego where he put up very good numbers. He's now pitching for TX (traded yet again) and still doing a nice job.

 

edit. I should add that I was very new to the board in 2003 and these were players that I was excited about for various reasons and not necessarily legit prospects (mostly the older guys). I learned some hard lessons rooting for these guys but I'm better for it now, or at least I like to think I am.

[igor67]

Perhaps the most interesting thing about that analysis is that if you had poled people back in '03 Adams probably would have been the one of the group least likely to have a noteworthy career, except maybe Childers. The guys with the stuff on that list all had a nasty run of injuries for the most part or never got enough command. Saenz in that one start sure looked like he was going to be a solid starter.

[TheCrew07]

Yep of the guys on that list with legit starting stuff I'm not too upset about the guys that injured anymore, though Neugy still bothers me because of how hard he was pushed.

 

Most of the healthy guys were just filthy and couldn't do anything with it for various reasons which is extremely disappointing. Wilhelmsen is the only guy I can kind of understand but still to just cut bait with the guy rubs me the wrong way even today, someone needed to step in and attempt to save him from himself. At least they learned from that mistake when Jeffress came through system so I will give the organization that much.

[DHonks]

I remember getting excited when one of Neugy, Jones, Mieses, Poe, Gold, or Stewart would get to start. When Rogers and Scarpetta return, this will be the most exciting rotation we've had

[jjfanec]

I remember getting excited when one of Neugy, Jones, Mieses, Poe, Gold, or Stewart would get to start. When Rogers and Scarpetta return, this will be the most exciting rotation we've had

 

And Bucci. I forgot him in the initial list. Guys like Santo and Wooten are relievers with potential as well

 

Lopez and some of the international players will be fun to watch when rookie ball starts up.

[TURBO]

Where does Maverick Lasker fit into everyone's excitement plans?

[TheCrew07]

Where does Maverick Lasker fit into everyone's excitement plans?

 

I love his name and had high hopes for him when he was drafted, I was hoping he'd top out in that 2/3 range, he was already hitting the low 90s as an 18 year old. Now I don't hold out much hope he'll make it, he just hasn't shown any kind of ascension in his performance, his rate stats aren't showing massive improvement.

 

Loved the pick on draft day, love his name, I just wish he would have performed better. He's currently MIA from any active roster which isn't a good thing, hopefully it's just a minor injury and he explodes this season.

[CheezWizHed]

I agree with Crew07. He is in the Seth Linz category right now. There is some hope, yet, but its not looking good. Maverick might get another chance as an SP, but it wouldn't surprise me if they moved him to the pen to try to get something out of him.

[jjfanec]

A week in and Nelson and Thornburg have increased my optimism. Reports and results on both have been outstanding. Thornburg is touching mid to upper 90's and missing a lot of bats. Nelson is touching mid-90s with a ton of sink. He is missing bats and when guys do hit him it is usually on the ground.

 

It is funny because Fiers, Peralta, Jungmann, and Bradley have all been solid or better but right now Thornburg and Nelson have me the most excited.

[paul253]

I'm really starting to get excited about Thornburg. Junggmann has been ok. Bradley and Nelson have been good but considering Bradley has only had two starts in the minors and Nelson wasn't exactly dominant in Wisconsin I'd like to see them keep it up awhile before I get too excited about them. But Thornburg....wow. If he and Peralta can step into the rotation next season and replace Marcum and Wolf, not only would we save a ton of money but (especially if we re-sign Greinke) this could be a very good rotation for quite awhile.

[YoungGeezy]

Who wants to answer the impossible question: What pitcher has had the most impressive start?

 

Thornburg

Bradley

Nelson

Gagnon

Jungmann

[TooLiveBrew]

My vote goes to Thornburg. But it's great to have such a tough decision.

[jjfanec]

Obviously it is a small sample size but it seems like each night we have a good to great pitching performance.

 

Here is a fun question. Who has been the most impressive pitcher so far?

 

Bradley and his inability to give up runs

Nelson and his inability to give up fly balls

Thornburg and his ability to miss bats

 

Nice start for our pitchers. Peralta has been really solid but since his strike outs are down he probably does get the consideration of the top 3. Jungmann has been fine but he needs to get strike outs as well.

[Tedaldtada]

With the lack of pitch counts at the A+ level, I cannot prove this, but I think Jimmy Nelson has been the most dominant. I just get the feeling he is cruising through his innings right now. Lots of 10 pitch and fewer types. That is what ground balls can do for you. Thornburg and Bradley are right there. Peralta and Jungmann will probably be the answer in a month once they get hot.

[YoungGeezy]

I'm starting to see more of Peralta in Nelson. Both have outstanding sliders, throw mid 90s, have very heavy fastballs (I believe Nelson not sure about Peralta actually throws a sinker). Both get ton of groundballs and have raw ability to do so while having pretty solid K rate. Peralta has a better change-up at this point but I have read that Nelson's is developing pretty well.

 

So far I would also pick Nelson as most impressive in the small sample size. Part of that is because we expected Thorny and Bradley to perform at this high of level. Most of us thought Jimmy would be good and solid in rotation but not this dominant. Gagnon has also really impressed and hope he works his way to BC once one of the big 3 bounce up to Huntsville. He'll prob skip over Miller as first to promote. Miller has been very unimpressive as an older college repeat in MWL

[TooLiveBrew]

One reason I voted Thornburg is that I wasn't expecting him to continue his dominance so soon at AA. But I don't think you can really make a wrong choice in this situation... really a fun time to be following the system.

[YoungGeezy]

One reason I voted Thornburg is that I wasn't expecting him to continue his dominance so soon at AA. But I don't think you can really make a wrong choice in this situation... really a fun time to be following the system.

 

Don't tell the experts that! Have to remember we are a terrible, bottom feeding, bottom 5 system to them

[jjfanec]

I pick Thornburg just because he has been dominant at a higher level. However, Nelson and Bradley have been great as well. When was the last time a guy starting out as hot as Bradley would be our third best start to a season?

 

On a related note the stud pitcher we traded for Greinke - Odorizzi - is really struggling again in AA. He has three starts and has only pitched 10.2 innings. He has given up 8 runs. He started great but his last two games have been really rough. This is not a knock on Odorizzi (I would love to still have him) but just another reason why we should be really excited right now. Our top prospects have results to match their stuff right now. It is also a reason why I go with Thornburg because I think that jump for high A to AA is the hardest and he has been great

[markedman5]

As a kid that was drafted out of college isn't Nelson a little old to still be in A ball?

 

Is he a late bloomer?

[paul253]

I believe Nelson pitched in Wisconsin the year he was drafted and didn't do particularly well so he pitched there again last year. He probably stayed there a little longer than you'd like a 2nd round college pitcher to have but it's not like he's 28 years old. He's actually only about 6 months older than Taylor Jungmann.

[narwhalattack]

I'd say Bradley because he's flat out dominant without having much previous experience in pro-ball. Thornburg and Nelson has had the time to refine their stuff in the minors.

[YoungGeezy]

After he signed, he pitched in Helena (21), then last year (21/22) in Wisconsin, now his 22/23 season is in BC. That is a pretty common trend for college pitchers in the Brewers system. I foresee him promoting soon after he turns 23 (end of June) if not he will still start AA at 23 next season which is not bad at all.

[homer]

I'm tempering my enthusiasm about the Brevard County guys simply because of TC07's post about Beloit back in '03. I hadn't followed the minors that closely until that season and was sure we had at least three sure fire MLB starters on that team. So while I am certainly enjoying the success of Bradley, Nelson, etc. I'll wait until AA before I get too excited (like I am with Thornburg).