Ryan Braun exonerated, no suspension… Latest: MLB drops Eliezer Alfonzo suspension; case similar to Braun's (part 1)

[AZBrewCrew]

Im assuming its the Will Carrol that is @injuryexpert? He keeps talking about a "repeatable result" which certainly sounds interesting.

[burnzy24]

If you don't follow will carrol on twitter. Check out his recent posts. He seems to have more info than the masses.

 

To expand on this, he is saying that Braun's camp was actually able to repeat the process and not only show how the sample became corrupted, but also produce and identical result of an insanely high test result from that process. http://twitter.com/#!/injuryexpert

[Madtown343]

“@injuryexpert: Repeatable result showed exactly how Braun's single test showed positive. Arbitrator agreed. Simple, isn't it?”

 

“@injuryexpert: The Braun decision was based on HOW the sample was corrupted. Panel was shown exactly what happened, why result was invalid.”

[Fear The Chorizo]

Braun's had to deal with this speculation for the better part of 4 months, more than half of which after this was leaked - here we are 5 hours after news broke that he was exonerated and MLB, ESPN, and other hacks are jumping to conclusions dealing with "technicalities" and twitter posts citing close sources again. If I'm not mistaken, the written decision hasn't been made available yet, correct? Braun hasn't talked with reporters yet, either. There's going to be more to this than a simple technicality of a courier keeping Braun's sample in his fridge over a weekend - if that was indeed a common practice (if it is, MLB's testing system is ridiculous, frankly), there HAS to be more to it that led to Braun overturning his suspension.

 

Braun's too smart to not tell his entire side of the story - MLB's crazy statement after the result came out all but guarantees that Braun's going to defend his name. I bet he's just sitting in his hotel room wearing an affliction T-shirt and reading all the articles and posts from the baseball "experts" that have no idea what they're talking about, and he can't wait to clown them as more information from this comes out.

[Madtown343]

And I'll take his opinion all day over Karl at Espn, or kruk...

[jjfanec]

“@injuryexpert: Repeatable result showed exactly how Braun's single test showed positive. Arbitrator agreed. Simple, isn't it?”

 

“@injuryexpert: The Braun decision was based on HOW the sample was corrupted. Panel was shown exactly what happened, why result was invalid.”

 

Wow. If this is the case it is irresponsible journalism on espn and others account right now. This sheds way more light on the situation and shows why Braun would be innocent.

 

Who is Will Carrol?

[fondybrewfan]

So Will Carrol says that the Braun team was actually able to replicate the insanely high test and showed exactly how it could have happened? I think that might be pretty convincing to an arbitrator. So it wasn't even so much that the chain of custody got screwed up; but that Braun's team clearly show that screw up messed the sample?

 

If that truly is the case; Braun is innocent plain and simple. I would be very interested to see how the sample could have produced that result.

[dlk9s]

 

Who is Will Carrol?

 

Sportswriter who specializes in covering medical stuff and PED's. He writes for SI.com and used to write for Baseball Prospectus. Bottom line: he knows what he's talking about.

[umphrey]

I hate it how MLB screwed up at every point in the process, and then still felt the need to totally throw Braun under the bus in the " not guilty" announcement

[jjfanec]

 

Who is Will Carrol?

 

Sportswriter who specializes in covering medical stuff and PED's. He writes for SI.com and used to write for Baseball Prospectus. Bottom line: he knows what he's talking about.

 

When is he going to write an article on this whole situation? Oh wait he is probably being a responsible journalist and gathering facts

[Cyanogen5]

New info from TOM, according to Brauns side there is more to it than a chain of effidense, there is a chance that it is not even Brauns unine sample.

 

I imagine it not being Braun's actual pee could pose a problem. No idea how that could happen though

 

depends on how the samples are identified - I'm sure the procedure is to label the samples in a way that doesn't allow the lab to know who's it is. If the sample ID for Braun's sample was incorrectly identified by the sample key, it would be very easy to have a mislabeled sample. There are also occasions where quality control samples are included with batches of samples (duplicates, trip blanks, matrix spikes, etc) to check the accuracy/integrity of the lab. If there was a spike sample included in a batch of samples that was potentially mislabeled, it isn't inconceivable that a previously prepared sample containing synthetic T was misidentified as Braun's urine sample. Braun's camp could have argued looking at the lab report to see if a spike sample that was supposed to have a high result ended up testing clean, and Braun's ended up testing ridiculously high.

 

sounds like a huge reach, but everything else that's happened in this situation has been, too...

 

I don't think that is a huge reach at all. I am a chemist who works in a lab...not that kind of lab, but the principles are the same. When we run tests, I keep a notebook designating which cells have what chemicals in them. we also run a blank. Every once in a while (but at least once a year) results come back weird...as in a blank shows results similar to what would have been expected with chemical, and vise versa. When that happens, everything is thrown into question as you can no longer trust your labeling. The only thing you can do is re-run the entire test. The huge reach in this scenario is that results like that would have been reported as accurate in the first place. The lab should catch instances like this and re-run...unless of course there wasn't enough sample.

[Madtown343]

If carrol has this info, I think we all will be able to hear it eventually.

 

Which will make Espn and MLB net running with their fed ex versions even more comical.

[Fear The Chorizo]

So Carrol writes for reputable sources AND his specialty lies in issues very closely related to this situation...and the alternative is to get information from a network who broke this story and desperately doesn't want to look stupid and from MLB, who views letting a guy keep urine samples in his beer fridge for several days as acceptable procedure for its drug testing program?

 

I think I'll side with Mr. Carrol on this one.

[crewcrazy]

Carroll has tweeted he's on a plane on his way back from vacation. I'm sure he'll have something for SI in the next day or so. Just because he has stuff that hasn't been reported yet doesn't mean that others who didn't report the info earlier were being irresponsible. This is an incredibly fluid story, and details will continue to trickle out unless/until Das releases his report on why he ruled the way he did.

 

On another note, I'm only going to put this reminder in here once -- keep the political stuff out of this thread, and off Brewerfan in general. You guys know the rules.

[JET15]

So Will Carrol says that the Braun team was actually able to replicate the insanely high test and showed exactly how it could have happened? I think that might be pretty convincing to an arbitrator. So it wasn't even so much that the chain of custody got screwed up; but that Braun's team clearly show that screw up messed the sample?

 

If that truly is the case; Braun is innocent plain and simple. I would be very interested to see how the sample could have produced that result.

 

 

If this is true, I wonder how the vote was 2-1 and not 3-0

[jjfanec]

So Will Carrol says that the Braun team was actually able to replicate the insanely high test and showed exactly how it could have happened? I think that might be pretty convincing to an arbitrator. So it wasn't even so much that the chain of custody got screwed up; but that Braun's team clearly show that screw up messed the sample?

 

If that truly is the case; Braun is innocent plain and simple. I would be very interested to see how the sample could have produced that result.

 

 

If this is true, I wonder how the vote was 2-1 and not 3-0

 

Once this went public there was no way someone from MLB to vote for Braun

[fondybrewfan]

I definitely get the feeling that the tide will turn in Braun's favor by the end of the weekend.

 

MLB's reaction to this issue really is mind boggling. If their system hadn't let the leak occur in the first place they wouldn't have this egg on their face and then to openly ridicule the reigning MVP? Just messed up

[Madtown343]

If this is true, I wonder how the vote was 2-1 and not 3-0

 

 

That's how bad MLB wanted to protect their "integrity". That worked out well.

[brewers19]

So Will Carrol says that the Braun team was actually able to replicate the insanely high test and showed exactly how it could have happened? I think that might be pretty convincing to an arbitrator. So it wasn't even so much that the chain of custody got screwed up; but that Braun's team clearly show that screw up messed the sample?

 

If that truly is the case; Braun is innocent plain and simple. I would be very interested to see how the sample could have produced that result.

 

 

If this is true, I wonder how the vote was 2-1 and not 3-0

Because the dissenting vote was a representative of MLB, which is throwing a tantrum about the ruling instead of keeping its mouth shut and quietly accepting the decision like it should. MLBPA executive director and independent arbitrator Shyam Das were the other two votes. MLB and MLBPA are pretty much going to vote along the party lines, so Das is essentially the single deciding vote. If it was 3-0, MLB would more or less be admitting that the whole process is deeply flawed, and they'd rather look like petulant children than do that.

[jazzytrav]

I hate it how MLB screwed up at every point in the process, and then still felt the need to totally throw Braun under the bus in the " not guilty" announcement

 

That's what I was thinking. Awfully ballsy of them to mock the decision when they're the ones that leaked this in the first place. I'm thoroughly disgusted with MLB throughout this process. While it would be disappointing, I'll completely understand if Braun's name never shows up on an MLB video game again.

 

MLB and MLBPA are pretty much going to vote along the party lines, so Das is essentially the single deciding vote.

 

I find it funny when I read articles on this saying that Das made the decision, as if it was his decision and there was no panel. I get that there may as well not be a panel, but to read journalist just disregard the entire panel concept and call it a decision by Das makes light of the ridiculousness of even having the panel. Like someone said way back in the original Braun thread, if you're going to have a panel, it should be all independents.

[Fear The Chorizo]

I'm hoping this whole ridiculous process leads to an adjustment of the appeals process - why not have a panel of 3 or 5 independent arbitrators? To have only 3, when the player's union and MLB reps essentially having their votes cast before the appeal is heard leaves it to one man's opinion every time.

 

MLB has egg on its face, and the more they squeal about it the worse they look.

[trwi7]

So Will Carrol says that the Braun team was actually able to replicate the insanely high test and showed exactly how it could have happened? I think that might be pretty convincing to an arbitrator. So it wasn't even so much that the chain of custody got screwed up; but that Braun's team clearly show that screw up messed the sample?

 

If that truly is the case; Braun is innocent plain and simple. I would be very interested to see how the sample could have produced that result.

 

 

If this is true, I wonder how the vote was 2-1 and not 3-0

 

Only vote that matters is the one from the independent arbitrator. Players union rep and MLB representative are the other two "voters". Obviously players union will side with the player and MLB rep will side with MLB.

[Cyanogen5]

If it was 3-0, MLB would more or less be admitting that the whole process is deeply flawed, and they'd rather look like petulant children than do that.

 

I disagree that the process is deeply flawed (except that they stubbornly pursued a conviction even with chain of custody issues, among others). Chain of custody issues happen...they can happen in any lab at any time. The proper thing to do when it happens is to simply re-test. Period. End of story. I think the flaw is that MLB saw the test results and were happy that they had finally caught a star in the prime of his career, and wanted to use it as the shining example of the unpartiality of their system. Unfortunately by proceeding with the prosecution and then reacting to the verdict as they did, they showed how biased they really are.

[JJHardy7]

First of all...excited it worked out for us. Great news. I've been a Braun fan for a long time.

 

They reported that he tested positive for PEDs. We were almost immediately told by every other news agency that was not the case.

 

I've defended ESPN and other news outlets and will continue to do so to a certain degree. What did Braun test positive for? Do we know? Will we know?

 

I've loved Braun...for a long time. I long to see what Braun tested positive for and what his story is. I do blame ESPN and any other network for 'assuming' he was guilty...but was he? Do we know? Again, haven't read the thread, but he could have been guilty for the test. We don't know.

 

I love the fact that we hate the East Coast here...but I don't want to be the person always ripping on that kind of stuff. If it was a Red Sox or Yankees player, we'd be crying foul. You can't have it both ways.

 

I see it this way:

 

1. Braun got 'lucky' that the MLB botched the process and did a very smart thing (either way he did really) in what he argued. He didn't argue the test. Smart. He tested positive for something he was taking that wasn't performance enhancing.

2. Braun was lucky and didn't do anything wrong.

 

I love Braun. I still do worry why the test failed. It could be a science thing that I don't understand. The results obviously indicate his levels were very high.

 

It will be interesting to see what comes out. As a huge Braun fan, I hope he has a press conference and answers these questions as honestly as he can. I just don't see the need to bash the media because we are a small market team, etc. Let's not act small market. Some journalists may have said things wrong...and that happens...but let's get the facts out. Great to have our MVP back though. Great way to start the spring.

[brewers19]

I disagree that the process is deeply flawed (except that they stubbornly pursued a conviction even with chain of custody issues, among others). Chain of custody issues happen...they can happen in any lab at any time. The proper thing to do when it happens is to simply re-test. Period. End of story. I think the flaw is that MLB saw the test results and were happy that they had finally caught a star in the prime of his career, and wanted to use it as the shining example of the unpartiality of their system. Unfortunately by proceeding with the prosecution and then reacting to the verdict as they did, they showed how biased they really are.

Oh, I'm not saying that it is deeply flawed. Just that MLB publicly feels that the whole Joint Drug Prevention And Treatment Program is absolutely perfect in every way, and acknowledging that something went wrong in the overall process in this particular case would be incomprehensible.