Kelly Johnson at SS?

[Dollarbill13]

I normally don't favor moving people the wrong way on the defensive spectrum but this one might work and provide a substantial upgrade at SS while requiring much less of a commitment than Reyes or Rollins.

 

Why Kelly Johnson might be an option at SS:

- He was a shortstop in the minors and was moved (originally to outfield then 2B) due to his fielding

- In his first two years with the Braves, he was a poor defensive 2B. In his last two seasons, he has become an above average defensive 2B. The primary driver behind his improvement is a substantial improvement in range

- While 2B is an easier position than SS, it is right next to SS on the defensive spectrum.

- He has a 10.7% career walk rate, which is about 12% higher than Yuni B's

- Despite only hitting .222 in 2011, he managed a .717 OPS. The average MLB 2B had a .709 OPS.

- Even if he's terrible at SS, it's hard to be much worse than Betancourt.

- He had a down season in 2011 so he might be willing to sign a shorter contract hoping for a rebound.

 

 

Why he's a risk:

- The biggest risk is adapting to playing SS. If he can't handle it, we'd have to decide between playing him at 3B (which he has never played) and OF (which he hasn't played since 2005). Neither is appealing. Some have proposed moving Weeks to the OF, which would open up 2B but require moves elsewhere (what to do with Hart or Morgan)

- He declined with the bat significantly in 2011. While much of his decline is due to an abnormally low BABIP (.277 in 2011 vs. .311 for his career), he also has dramatically increased his strikeouts over the last two seasons, which certainly won't help his average. If he continues to strikeout more and more, even a likely improvement in BABIP won't allow him to return to where he was in 2010.

 

 

Why he might be willing to make the switch:

MLB Trade Rumors suggested that he might be able to take a 1 year deal to try and improve his market value to get a big contract after the 2012 season, when he'll be 30. Even if he was a total butcher at SS, he has proven himself to be an above average defender at 2B so his market value as a 2B will depend almost entirely on his bat. However, if he can prove to be even mediocre at SS, his value will likely skyrocket due to the lack of decent shortstops in the league.

 

Flame away! http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[DHonks]

I thought Kelly Johnson was a catcher in the minors. Maybe I'm thinking of someone else

[Dollarbill13]

I thought Kelly Johnson was a catcher in the minors. Maybe I'm thinking of someone else

Kelly Shoppach maybe?

 

Baseball Prospectus Profile (I don't believe subscription is required for that link)

[jerichoholicninja]

I had this same thought this afternoon. Might not be a terrible idea.

[YoungGeezy]

This is just as bad as the Rickie Weeks to SS idea. Plain and simple, if you are not a great fielding 2B with a powerful arm, there is zero chance of not being a major liability in the field. SS is a specialty just like catcher. You can't just take average fielders and throw them there and expect them to do good

[MNBrew]

There's nothing in the logic of signing Kelly Johnson to play SS that makes it any better of an idea to me than just re-signing Betancourt. I'm not convinced re-signing Betancourt would be a great decision. But I do think this would be a worse one.

[YoungGeezy]

The number one thing people need to start to realize with Johnson, Weeks, Gennett, and etc, some guys just are not meant to be SS no matter how desprate we get. If we need a catcher you just don't throw Braun back there. It is a specific talent just like SS. People complain about Yuni but compared to Johnson, Yuni would look like Omar Vazsquez. There is a reason why over half the SS in MLB are able to remain starters well into their 30's regardless if they can hit a ball or not. Defense is important and just because a guy played there a little in the minors doesn't make him a MLB SS. If I guy can't field second or is slightly above average, he has zero hope. Even a guy like Farris who is maybe the best fielder in our system can't be a full time SS. You need a lot of features; range, arm, instincts, etc. If we want to a SS, resign Yuni, pick up a defensive guy like Gonzo, Furcal, or make a trade. Do don't try to sign or move a guy who can't play there just because it looks good in a batting order. Lets help our pitching by have guys who can field their position.

[NYChez]

This is the reason Craig Counsell has been able to hang around so long, too. Guys who can play multiple positions, including shortstop, are hard to find.

[Dollarbill13]

This is just as bad as the Rickie Weeks to SS idea. Plain and simple, if you are not a great fielding 2B with a powerful arm, there is zero chance of not being a major liability in the field. SS is a specialty just like catcher. You can't just take average fielders and throw them there and expect them to do good

SS isn't a specialty position like Catcher. Catcher requires a completely different skill set than any other position on the field. Shortstop requires the same skill set only with much more skill due to the combination of length of throw, range required, and quantity of balls hit there. Catchers require a completely different skill set that includes blocking pitches, framing pitches, game-calling, and constantly throwing from an awkward position.

 

Players don't typically move to more difficult positions, especially to shortstop. But I think if there is someone who could maybe do it, it'd be a middle infielder with good range who seems to have improved in the last couple years. It would certainly be a risk but we're also talking about replacing the worst hitting (Link) and fielding (Link) regular SS over the past thee years. I'd be fine with signing a slick fielding SS but Rollins will require at least a 4 year deal and Alex Gonzalez either just had a poor defensive season by his standards or he is declining.

[Dollarbill13]

Actually I just looked where KJ compares in range to other 2B and while he's solid, he's not great. So he'd probably, at best, be a guy with very little range for a SS who is solid but unspectacular on plays that he gets to.

[YoungGeezy]

He is an average 2nd Baseman at best therefore will never play SS in his pro career. He he had the skill sets to play there, they would have kept him there. Same thing with Gennett. Some people just cannot play SS and they both are examples of that. As for the Brewers, we are terrible defensively, the last thing I'd ever want to do is throw a guy who has zero ability to play even average at SS out there because he can hit. People say Yuni is bad, wait to you watch a guy who can't even be good at 2nd base try to cut it at SS. Yikes, I'd be the first pitcher demanding a trade as all the ERA's skyrocket. You don't move to harder positions.

 

A bad/average fielding SS can move to 2B but a bad/average fielding 2B doesn't move to SS.

A bad/average fielding 3B can move to 1B but a bad/average fielding 1B doesn't move to 3B.

A bad/average fielding CF can move to LF/RF but a bad/average fielding RF/LF doesn't move to CF.

 

*Statement above is true, at least for any team who wants to win*

[The Truth]

I would much prefer Jerry Hairston Jr fulltime at SS over a Kelly Johnson type who has very few of the skillsets needed to play the position

[MNBrew]

I would much prefer Jerry Hairston Jr fulltime at SS over a Kelly Johnson type who has very few of the skillsets needed to play the position

Ditto. I'd much prefer Hairston or most any other proven & competent SS over a Kelly Johnson type. Yes, I'd even put Yuni B. in that group (the former, not the latter).

[The Truth]

I would much prefer Jerry Hairston Jr fulltime at SS over a Kelly Johnson type who has very few of the skillsets needed to play the position

Ditto. I'd much prefer Hairston or most any other proven & competent SS over a Kelly Johnson type. Yes, I'd even put Yuni B. in that group (the former, not the latter).

I tend to put Yuni B in the incompetent Kelly Johnson type group, but I hear ya!

[Dollarbill13]

I would much prefer Jerry Hairston Jr fulltime at SS over a Kelly Johnson type who has very few of the skillsets needed to play the position

Ditto. I'd much prefer Hairston or most any other proven & competent SS over a Kelly Johnson type. Yes, I'd even put Yuni B. in that group (the former, not the latter).

I tend to put Yuni B in the incompetent Kelly Johnson type group, but I hear ya!

Agreed regarding Yuni B as incompetant. The original thought behind my post (and I'm assuming the Weeks to SS post) was that if we're going to have a bad defensive SS, might as well have someone who can hit. I hope we can bring back Hairston but I'm not sure he'll be able to handle playing SS every day.

[pingman]

SS ? ....no way ...the rap on Johnson in Atlanta was his stiff hands, he needs to play 2B (or 3B) where he can drop a ball but still pick it up & use his strong arm to throw someone out... not a luxury for a SS

 

3B? ...now you're getting closer.....at one point the Braves insiders thought KJ would play 2B until he would be needed to succeed Chipper at 3B

 

looks like the Tigers will make a move on Johnson to be their 2B....