Chase Headley - My number 1 target in offseason

[molitor fan]

Yes, he had only 4 homers and 44 rbis last year, but Headley is a slick fielding third baseman that hit .330 away from Petco last year and is just 27. Rumor has it that he is on trading block due to his expected 3 million dollar arby figure. Would Thornburg be enough of a return or would we be expected to pony up Peralta?

[paul253]

I don't have a problem with Chase Headley at all. But we have three guys that can play third base (McGehee/Gamel/Green) already and have other holes to fill. Plus Headley is going to start getting expensive. We also have three starters that are set to be free agents after the season and aren't exactly brimming with top pitching prospects. I think we should be trying to trade for decent pitching prospects, not trading away the ones we have away. I don't want to give up yet another prospect for a guy who plays a position we already have three guys that can play (four if they resign Hairston).

[YoungGeezy]

Green is cheaper and I think can produce just as much. Hate to give people up and pay more when we have another option sitting there who has earned his opportunity, only cost 400k, and (prior and now post wrist injury) has hit for good average, good power, and has drove in runs. So we can ship away some players and up our salary or just stick with Green.....I'll take Green

[bkroppy2]

Headley is supposedly unavailable

[TooLiveBrew]

Green is cheaper and I think can produce just as much.

I think he can produce just as much, but only at the plate & from the LH side only. Headley's value is that he can give you Green's likely offensive upside from both sides of the plate, & he has the reputation of being a better defender. Green's great for what he is, a cheap upgrade as pretty well-groomed lefty bat. But if Headley became available this offseason, I'd love to see Melvin jump at that opportunity. He's put up a career road slash line of .303/.364/.441/.805 line (over 1,117 PA). He's also been a high-efficiency base stealer. Just too much for me to like about this guy.

I'm confused about the salary situation -- does he have super-two status? Cot's Contracts lists him with 2.123 yrs. of service time. Headley at $3M in 2012 would be a great deal, as would paying his escalating arbitration salaries. Many posters here are eager to sign Hairston Jr. to a $2.5M AAV or so contract. And for maybe $9 or $10M total for the next two seasons Headley could be in the mix? I'm all for that. Nothing against JHJ either, just a comparison.

Green would still be in the picture as a 2B/3B reserve & good lefty bat off the bench. He'd basically fill 2/3 of the Counsell role, but with a bat that can make an impact. A couple shortstops could be found from the Barmes/Santiago/Furcal FA mix, or Jack Wilson/Brendan Ryan/whoever else on the trade market. Heck, if you can find a LH shortstop to platoon with... gulp... Yuni, do it if you can keep costs down while still improving at SS.

Headley's a good player, and I'd love to see the Brewers capitalize upon the Padres' inability or unwillingness to pay him during his prime seasons.

[TooLiveBrew]

Headley is supposedly unavailable

Interesting... is "reluctant to move him" classic GM-speak? Here's the story, via MLBTR -- http://mlbbuzz.yardbarker...in_coming_months/8044309

[dadofandrew]

At $15M+ over the next 3 years, he's far from cheap. I like him, but Green might give you 90% (or more) of the production for 10% of the cost. You can't throw several million at every hole, or you're out of cash with plenty of holes left.

 

Many fail to see that's why Gamel and Green have so much value...they cost so little. No one's going to deny there are better options out there if you have an unlimited payroll, but the Crew doesn't. There are better catchers than Lucroy, better closers than Axford, better 5th SP's than Narveson. But in order to fit the guys that make $7-10M, you need several minimum salary guys.

[molitor fan]

I know 37 at bats is a miniscule sample size but Green's .622 OPS combined with looking overmatched in several of the at bats I saw make me wonder about Green being able to match the value of a switch hitter that is regarded as a plus or plus plus defender. Obviously the quote about being not motivated to move him after Headley's name coming out as being on the market is GM speak

[TheCrew]

I don't have a problem with Chase Headley at all. After all we only have one guy that can really play third base well (Green), and he is unproven at the MLB level.

Fixed that for you http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[TooLiveBrew]

At $15M+ over the next 3 years, he's far from cheap. I like him, but Green might give you 90% (or more) of the production for 10% of the cost.

 

No, he won't. Green's at best an average fielder, and only has value from the LH side of the plate. He gives you roughly 2/3 of Headley's offensive value, & then Headley's full-time PT ability & defense make him far more valuable. $15M over 3 years for the kind of production Headley will give at 3B is good value.

It's not that I'm not a believer in Green as a platoon bat, but I'd much rather have Headley. I really don't think people aren't aware that Green & Gamel's cheap salaries are valuable. There are lots of discussions about that both in this forum & the MLB forum.

[Beast Light]

A career .735 OPS player, no thanks. I'd rather the Brewers bring in players that won't block prospects that are knocking at the door to the Majors (Taylor Green). Especially when they'd have to give up prospects of their own to do it.

 

I think the Brewers should focus on 1B, SS and possibly RF (depending on what they do with Hart).

[YoungGeezy]

I miss the days when we embraced young talent and not wastefully throwing around money. We got to where by this strategy, homegrown talent for cheap.

[paul253]

We got to where by this strategy, homegrown talent for cheap.

 

Well technically we were a .500 team until we traded for established pitchers but I see the point and I agree with it. I see Wily Peralta as our best chance to develop a good, young, CHEAP, pitcher who will actually have success since Yovani Gallardo. He should considered absolutely untouchable right now. I think Tyler Thornburg is our best chance behind Peralta. His numbers in A+ were pretty good and if he can limit the walks they should be even better. While I don't think he is untouchable I also don't think they should trade him unless he's part of package that brings back a legitimate all star caliber major leaguer. We can't just keep trading away all of our talented prospects, especially pitchers. We'll never succeed as a team relying solely on free agents and trades.

[DHonks]

Much as I like Peralta, I think a lot of people are a bit too high on him. He probably won't contribute until 2013, and probably won't be significant until 2014 or 2015. He's no Yo. I think it's more likely that Thornburg or Rogers makes an impact soon

[YoungGeezy]

I couldn't disagree more. You don't push for a 22 year old who had only what 7 starts higher than A ball to be in your rotation if you don't feel he is special. Literally they made that job his to lose which he ended up doing. Outside of the games, RR made it seem like he was thriving all camp. As long as he keeps a handle on his command he has a chance to help now (not be ace like but slot in very well at the bottom) Not too many other high GB, High K, power arms floating around in our system. I think he will get great experience this season and be ready to breakout in 2013. He has really proved he can pitch. Thornburg i think is a little further back because his third pitch still needs a bunch of work and his command still needs to be more consistant. Rogers needs to be done starting (he is a closer/set up man) and is out of options so he has to make a big splash in ST. Fiers is the closest to being able to contribute but is a bottom of rotation type of guy.

[TooLiveBrew]

I'd rather the Brewers bring in players that won't block prospects that are knocking at the door to the Majors (Taylor Green). Especially when they'd have to give up prospects of their own to do it.

 

I respect this stance, & I don't believe that anyone was clamoring any louder than I was for Green to be up & playing ahead of McGehee this past season. But I dunno... even I don't view Green as a legit prospect at this point -- I think of "prospect" as young player who you believe can be a fulltime starter or fulltime in whatever role you view him occupying (semantics, I know). Can Green be a useful player? Yes. Is a LHB-only platoon player a prospect you worry about blocking? Not really for me. He'd still be great injury depth & a very legit 2B/3B backup, & have plenty of PAs from season to season. I mean, you have Weeks, whose all-out style of play probably means he won't have many 140-150+ start seasons, plus Green could give him days off against tough righties. Then Green would have the same role to back up (in this hypothetical) Headley -- who it sells entirely short to pigeonhole as a "career .735 OPS" guy, suggesting that's his true talent.

 

This deal just makes a lot of sense to me. I'd be fine with selling high(ish) on Thornburg -- for as much as I like him, the odds on him winding up being a more productive player than four seaons of Headley are very slim. Now, if Peralta had to be included... I'll pass & thanks for chatting http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif I do realize the Brewers wouldn't get Headley cheaply, but since he's in his prime & a good player at 3B he's a guy I could stand to see the Brewers pay to acquire... but to an extent.

[YoungGeezy]

Peralta, Thornburg, Gennett to me need to be untouchable this season unless it is for some big time player. One, 2013 we are going to have holes in the rotation so they are much more needed either to compete or be used in a Greinke type deal. Two, right now they are really our system. This is a big year where many of our prospects are FINALLY going to be in AA which makes or breaks them as a prospect. Plus how good will Bradley and Jungmann be? By 2013 we will have a much better feel for what we really have in the system and hopefully many set up and make them more expandable.

 

I just don't think Headley is worth it. He is good but I rather keep Thorny and have Green/McGehee stay at third. McGehee will bounce back, I don't think we need to panic so much. McGehee/Green I think will be fine. Why waste a prospect?

[MNBrew]

Green's become a better player than he was when he was the Brewers' MiLB POY. He just had a 2-year detour thanks to that lousy injury & the time it took him to truly get his game back.

 

And McGehee's got zero track record for being as lousy as he was last year, so I see him rebounding at least some of the way back toward where he was in '09 & '10.

 

Between those two guys -- one dirt-cheap & the other hardly overly expensive for what he could do -- I don't see any reason to waste assets on an area that's already got potentially quite good internal options for improvement. . . . unless, and only unless, such a move is made in tandem with another that uses those existing internal options to acquire better talent to fill a greater hole elsewhere on the roster.

[chickinbrickin]

Much as I like Peralta, I think a lot of people are a bit too high on him. He probably won't contribute until 2013, and probably won't be significant until 2014 or 2015. He's no Yo. I think it's more likely that Thornburg or Rogers makes an impact soon

 

I also couldn't disagree more. A 22 year old posting a 2 ERA and 40 K's in 30 IP at AAA. His walks are down and k's are up. He is a lock to be a June call up at the very latest, and might be in the rotation to start the year.

 

Back to the topic, I would love Headly, but the Brewers can't give up top pitching prospects to get him. Green and Ross for Headley would be awesome. I like Green, but I just don't buy in yet.

[PilprinBuddha]

I have no interest in trading any prospects this offseason...other than Gamel...simply because I don't view his as a prospect...Hope I am wrong.

[ilikewisco]

A writer at MASN talks about the Orioles options with Mark Reynolds:

Roch Kubatko

 

Could Mark Reynolds be an option? If the Brewers could trade McGehee and an outfield prospect for him, he could be a better version of the platoon mate we see McGehee being. And he has huge power to help with the loss of Fielder. He may be a butcher at third, but he's more athletic than McGehee. With the salary difference they may do the trade straight up. It would be brutal to watch all the strikeouts and botched routine plays at third, but we will see a lot of long balls and some great plays on the corners as well. He probably can play a pretty good first base and gives the Brewers an established alternative to Green and Gamel.

 

Baltimore would probably be interested in an established starter as well, their young guys haven't been very good so far.

[The Truth]

Yes, he had only 4 homers and 44 rbis last year, but Headley is a slick fielding third baseman that hit .330 away from Petco last year and is just 27. Rumor has it that he is on trading block due to his expected 3 million dollar arby figure. Would Thornburg be enough of a return or would we be expected to pony up Peralta?

I would think it would take 3 seconds to get a GM to trade Headley for Thornburg or Peralta but no way do I give up a huge piece of our pitching future for just about any 3B not named David Wright!

 

We need more pitching, not less

 

As far as Headley. Sure I'd love to add him but as was mentioned it wouldn't really be a wise move salary cap wise, we need to utlize the minimum salary guys and if we spend bigger money it should be on players like Greinke or Fielder or a big free agent like a Reyes type

[The Truth]

Could Mark Reynolds be an option?

Mark Reynolds is a more intriguing option, to me, because of his power numbers. I could see trading Narveson for him...

 

Reynolds isn't much of a defensive player though. But I think Reynolds would go a long ways towards replacing Prince Fielder in ways that Gamel couldn't

[ilikewisco]

I wonder what it would take to get Andino and Reynolds. Maybe have Wolf involved to off-set salaries. The Brewers could get creative and try to bring back one of their young, under achieving starters as a change of scenery move. I don't know if they are ready to sell on any of them, but if they are I would be interested.

 

I have no idea what Andino's defense looks like, but if he can play a passable short he's young enough to play everyday if needed

[YoungGeezy]

Yes, he had only 4 homers and 44 rbis last year, but Headley is a slick fielding third baseman that hit .330 away from Petco last year and is just 27. Rumor has it that he is on trading block due to his expected 3 million dollar arby figure. Would Thornburg be enough of a return or would we be expected to pony up Peralta?

I would think it would take 3 seconds to get a GM to trade Headley for Thornburg or Peralta but no way do I give up a huge piece of our pitching future for just about any 3B not named David Wright!

 

We need more pitching, not less

 

As far as Headley. Sure I'd love to add him but as was mentioned it wouldn't really be a wise move salary cap wise, we need to utlize the minimum salary guys and if we spend bigger money it should be on players like Greinke or Fielder or a big free agent like a Reyes type

I disagree. Pitching is much harder to find than hitting. GM's don't like to trade top pitching prospects for a middle of the pack 3rd baseman. (He fits in as the 12-16 best 3rd baseman in baseball) Why trade your top pitching prospect(s) for a pretty good hitting, solid defensive player (nothing great just solid). If your going to dip into the water, man up add a few more prospects and get a top guy. We can find another Headley, we can't just grab another legit pitching prospect off a tree.