2012 Shortstop

[Invader3K]

Can someone explain to me how Gonzalez is better than Yuni?

Better glove, though he is quite a bit older (turns 35 in February).

[chadomac]

Career OBP of .291. Yuck. I wish there were better options out there. I'm not feeling so good about this offseason.

[Warning Track Power]

 

- Hardy was lousy for 3/4 of a season and didn't play the last 1/4. That means he was lousy for HIS WHOLE season. He didn't have a good 1/4 of the season, and...

- McGehee did. That means he was lousy for roughly the same 3/4 of a season Hardy was in '09, not the WHOLE season you're saying, and still actually was GOOD 1/4 of the season (and wasn't his April respectable?).

 

I think my general unhappiness about the Hardy v. McGehee/Yuni situation is Melvin's willingess to give McGehee and Yuni all of 2011 and possibly the beginning of 2012 when Hardy wasn't afforded the same opportunity. Additionally, Hardy brought a glove that McGehee and Yuni both don't have. While Hardy didn't have a good 2009 with the bat, he could still field.

 

It's just frustrating to me as a fan to hear Melvin defend McGehee and Yuni, who were bad on offense and defense in 2011, and basically throw away Hardy, who was an all star SS having a down year with the bat, for nothing (even though I like Gomez). Nevermind the fact that we now have a black hole at SS with no prospects on the horizon.

[BritInWI]

Warning Track Power]It's just frustrating to me as a fan to hear Melvin defend McGehee and Yuni, who were bad on offense and defense in 2011, and basically throw away Hardy, who was an all star SS having a down year with the bat, for nothing (even though I like Gomez). Nevermind the fact that we now have a black hole at SS with no prospects on the horizon.

Well that's because at the time Hardy was struggling so badly, the Brewers had an in-house replacement they were excited about and eager to get playing time for (in Escobar). He didn't have the same for Yuni and probably was unsure about what he had behind McGehee (and that may still be the case).

[Warning Track Power]

It's just frustrating to me as a fan to hear Melvin defend McGehee and Yuni, who were bad on offense and defense in 2011, and basically throw away Hardy, who was an all star SS having a down year with the bat, for nothing (even though I like Gomez). Nevermind the fact that we now have a black hole at SS with no prospects on the horizon.

Well that's because at the time Hardy was struggling so badly, the Brewers had an in-house replacement they were excited about and eager to get playing time for (in Escobar). He didn't have the same for Yuni and probably was unsure about what he had behind McGehee (and that may still be the case).

Yes I agree with you about Escobar's presence.

 

However, that doesn't mean you trade a former All-Star at his absolute lowest value. That's just bad business.

 

[brewerfan82]

Can someone explain to me how Gonzalez is better than Yuni?

Past three seasons:

 

Betancourt: 1680 PAs, 35 HRs, .252/.277/.381 -33.1 UZR, -.07 WAR

Gonzalez: 1662 PAs, 46 HRs, .244/.281/.397 12.5 UZR, 5.0 WAR

 

Minimal boost in offense without the horrendous defense.

[reillymcshane]

Career OBP of .291. Yuck. I wish there were better options out there. I'm not feeling so good about this offseason.

Gonzalez is almost the same as Yuni at the plate last year. Neither guy walks. Both have okay power. Gonzalez strikes out twice as much as Yuni. Over the last three years Gonzalez ranks a bit better, but not by a lot. And at 35, he's going to crash and burn before Yuni, who will be 30 next year.

 

Defensively, Gonzalez is ranked better, but 2011 wasn't all that stellar. His UZR ratings show him steadily dropping. You have to wonder if he's fading (I haven't really watched him play lately, so I can't give any clear report on him). He turns 35 in Feburary, so it's not out of the question that he's simply lost some of his defensive pizazz.

 

Gonzalez has been more inconsistent. He did quite good in 2010 (23 HR), but terrible in 2009, and nothing great last year (just a 1.1 WAR).

 

In the end, I'd take the risk on Gonzalez than Yuni. He offers some hope of good - even average - fielding. And maybe the new environment would get him exciting and result in a bit of a bounce back year. If you get a 1.5 WAR out of him, you're showing a big improvement over 2011.

 

2011

Yuni: .252 BA, .271 OBP, .381 SLG, .652 OPS

Gonzalez: .241, 270, .371, .642

 

2009-2011

Yuni:.252, .277. 381, .658

Gonzalez: .244, .281, .397, .678

 

WAR comparison (from fangraphs):

 

Yuni/Gonzalez:

2011: 0.5 / 1.1

2010: 0.9 / 3.4

2009: -2.1 / 0.6

 

Fielding:

 

2011

Yuni:

Fielding %: 19 of 22 qualified players

Range factor: 19 of 22

Zone rating: 19 of 22

 

Gozalez:

Fielding %: 5th of 22

Range factor: 16 of 22

Zone rating: 17 of 22

 

UZR Ratings:

 

Yuni / Gonzalez

2011: -6.9 / -0.3

2010: -9.2 / 5.1

2009: -19.7 / 7.7

 

[Warning Track Power]

Gonzalez it is per Ken Rosenthal

[craigharmann]

It will not be Yuni. Let's be done with this conversation!

[thumperden]

Not a bad stopgap for one year. He made around $5.25 million total the last two years, so he's affordable. Gonzalez is a defensive upgrade over Betancourt even at the age of 35. Similar bats however. I'd rather have him for one year than Yuni. I'm guessing Gonzalez is about a 2 win upgrade (at first glance) at the position for an affordable price. Probably hits out of the 7 hole too.

[TooLiveBrew]

It will not be Yuni. Let's be done with this conversation!

I'm so happy with this outcome

[pogokat]

i'm happy, but i want a pure defense guy on the bench as a utility guy

[TooLiveBrew]

I vote for Brendan Ryan (still, but in that different role), pogo. He's cheap & a good defender. You have to imagine with Weeks & a 35-yo Gonzalez that there'll be plenty of playing time to be had for a MIF backup.

[GoudaBrew]

I'm a little scared that the Brewers could sign Theriot (assuming he gets non-tendered), although you'd hope they'd sign someone that can play respectably at SS. Is Orlando Cabrera toast? I see had just a terrible year last year. Was he hurt or is he just old?

[reillymcshane]

I'm a little scared that the Brewers could sign Theriot (assuming he gets non-tendered), although you'd hope they'd sign someone that can play respectably at SS. Is Orlando Cabrera toast? I see had just a terrible year last year. Was he hurt or is he just old?

I think Cabrera is toast. I saw him a couple of times last year and he didn't impress. Maybe he was hurt, but he almost looked like a guy who just didn't care or was taking pain medication.

[BrycePecore]

I would like to see them sign Punto. He's a solid defender who can play 2B, SS and 3B and is affordable (he made $750K in 2011).

[logan82]

Gonzalez is almost the same as Yuni at the plate last year. Neither guy walks. Both have okay power. Gonzalez strikes out twice as much as Yuni. Over the last three years Gonzalez ranks a bit better, but not by a lot. And at 35, he's going to crash and burn before Yuni, who will be 30 next year.

 

I don't think Yuni has played at a high enough level to crash let alone crash and burn.

[MNBrew]

Having watched Punto most of his career up here in MN, I've been thinking since the Gonzalez news broke that we need a veteran utility IF who's a capable starting SS & 2B, and Punto certainly fits that bill. Switch hitter. Bursts of good hitting. Good speed. Great hands & overall excellent on defense. Awesome team player.

 

So I emailed TH before dinner and he said he hadn't heard Punto's name yet. I'd guess that they weren't gonna worry about a backup middle IF 'til they got the starting SS figured out. Now I hope they move in that direction big-time. He's a FA so wouldn't cost us anything in exchange, and he'd be very cheap.

[DHonks]

I wouldn't mind us signing a guy like Theriot to back up in the infield, although ideally we'd find a lefty swinging utility guy.

 

And Thumperden, Gonzalez is a stopgap? Sorry but who do we have that replaces him after one year? I hope Prince rebounds in AA, but I'm not counting on it

[TooLiveBrew]

Having watched Punto most of his career up here in MN, I've been thinking since the Gonzalez news broke that we need a veteran utility IF who's a capable starting SS & 2B, and Punto certainly fits that bill. Switch hitter. Bursts of good hitting. Good speed. Great hands & overall excellent on defense. Awesome team player.

I agree with you & BrycePecore. Punto would be a very nice compliment to the RH-hitting middle infielders the Brewers have. Of course Punto has his durability questions, but with Weeks & Gonzalez healthy he'd only start once or maybe twice a week. He's a very nice idea, basically what I'd draw up given Weeks/Gonzo -- a lefty (or switch) bat that is a plus in the field at 2B & SS.

I like Ryan just in a general sense of having a good defender to back up 2B & SS. But Punto's switch/lefty bat fits nicely.

[Hate those Rodents]

Since I want Green backing up second as well as third if he's not our starter at third, I really want a backup ss that we only look to at that particular position.

[PrinceEatMeat]

Since I want Green backing up second as well as third if he's not our starter at third, I really want a backup ss that we only look to at that particular position.

Green will be in AAA if we get Ramirez. Otherwise he'll platoon will McGehee. Doubt he'll see any time at 2B. I doubt anyone will if Weeks stays healthy.

[TooLiveBrew]

My point on a MIF reserve is that you have to forecast Weeks to miss time in any given season. The one certainty with Weeks so far in his career is that his all-out play means inevitable DL time.

So while I agree on Green being the 2B/3B supersub, I wouldn't want to see a roster spot used on a backup that can only play one position. I think there will be plenty of playing time for two players to back up the MIF spots.

[pogokat]

i think green is the backup everything...but i'm really hoping that there's budget left after aram for punto

[Hate those Rodents]

Jack Wilson might work. Good defensively at ss and not a good enough bat for RRR to justify playing him at second over Green.