Carlos Zambrano as the 2nd greatest hitting Pitcher of all-time?

[The Truth]

Obviously, Babe Ruth was the greatest hitting pitcher of all-time

 

And leaving out anomalies like Jeff Cirillo pitching an inning (and apparently both Ted Williams & Ty Cobb pitched more than a couple innings in their career too) I'm starting to think of Carlos Zambrano as possibly the 2nd greatest hitting pitcher of all-time

 

Warren Spahn often gets credit for being one of the greats, & he does have the most career HR's among pitchers with 35 (in 21 seasons.... Zambrano has 22 HR's in 11 seasons) but Zambrano has a higher career BA, OBP, & OPS than Spahn (and Steve Carlton, too)

 

Anyone else I'm not thinking of? Bob Gibson had 24 career HR's, a .204 Career BA and .545 career OPS

 

Zambrano has a .239 career BA, .640 career OPS

[The Truth]

Wanted to add: Gallardo has a .650 career OPS but its only been 200 or so at-bats, Narveson has a .250 + career BA but that is in only 90 at-bats

 

Not sure where to draw the line in terms of minimum at-bats, maybe Gallardo is close

 

(Zambrano has 648 career at-bats)

[RockCoCougars]

Walter Johnson was a pretty good hitter as well. There were lots of guys from the 60's who could hit- Tony Cloninger and Rick Wise come to mind.

[dlk9s]

Rick Ankiel

[The Truth]

Walter Johnson was a pretty good hitter as well.

Thanks. Didn't realize that and checked: a .235 career BA, .616 career OPS and 24 career HR's (many of them in the dead ball era too)

[chadomac]

I realize it's very early in his career, but if he's healthy I could definitely see Gallardo going down as the 2nd greatest hitting pitcher.

[The Truth]

Just thought of another one who may be better than Zambrano:

 

Don Larsen : .242 BA, .662 OPS

[DuWayne Steurer]

http://www.baseball-refer...layers/f/ferrewe01.shtml

 

Wes Farrell, and it's not even close.

 

.797 OPS, and still has the record for most HR as a pitcher, with 38. He hit so well that he was frequently used as a PH'er.

 

His 1935 season was just flat out stupid for a pitcher. .347, 7 homeruns, and 32 RBI, with a .960 OPS. In 179 PA's.

 

Zambrano doesn't even SNIFF Farrell's overall stats.

[The Truth]

http://www.baseball-refer...layers/f/ferrewe01.shtml

 

Wes Farrell, and it's not even close.

I think we have a winner. Thanks! Never heard of him until today

 

Farrell looks like he was a good solid pitcher, too: 4.04 career ERA, 6 full seasons with a 3 something ERA.

[DuWayne Steurer]

http://www.baseball-refer...layers/f/ferrewe01.shtml

 

Wes Farrell, and it's not even close.

I think we have a winner. Thanks! Never heard of him until today

 

Farrell looks like he was a good solid pitcher, too: 4.04 career ERA, 6 full seasons with a 3 something ERA.

His brother Rick was a catcher (mostly for the Browns and Senators) and made it to the HOF, ironically with a lower career BA, OPS, and fewer homeruns.

[The Truth]

His 1935 season was just flat out stupid for a pitcher. .347, 7 homeruns, and 32 RBI, with a .960 OPS. In 179 PA's.

Wow. I see he was 2nd in the voting for the American League MVP that year, too, as in addition to the hitting he went 25-14 with a 3.52 ERA (322 Innings Pitched)

[DuWayne Steurer]

http://www.baseball-refer...yers/o/o%27doule01.shtml[/url]

 

Lefty O'Doul was brought up as a pitcher, and honestly, wasn't very good. He flamed out in '23, and made it back to the majors as an outfielder in '28.

In '29 and '30, he posted back to back seasons with over a 1.000 OPS, batting .398 in '29, and posted a career .945 OPS.

 

THat was mostly as an outfielder though, so I'm certain it doesn't really count.

 

http://www.baseball-refer...players/w/woodjo02.shtml

 

Joe Wood was a fine hitting pitcher for the Red Sox, but went out early after an arm injury at age 25. Like O'Doul, he came back as an outfielder, and was still an ok hitter, but nowhere near the success as O'Doul

[DuWayne Steurer]

http://www.baseball-refer...layers/r/ruffire01.shtml

 

Red Ruffing, .695 OPS with 36 career homers.

[3Putt]

If we count Babe Ruth don't we have to include Ankiel?

[TSack27]

"He hit so well that he was frequently used as a PH'er."

Could we also be talking about our own Tool Shed?

[chadomac]

Wow, there's a lot of pitchers that could hit. Never knew.

[DuWayne Steurer]

3Putt]If we count Babe Ruth don't we have to include Ankiel?

Counting only the seasons in which Ruth was used predominantly as a pitcher, we still have to say he was the best hitting pitcher of all time.

 

During the seasons Ankiel was used predominantly as a pitcher, his hitting stats weren't all that special. And in truth, he had a grand total of 96 at bats when he was a pitcher, so I'd tend to dis-count him anyways.

[endaround]

Zambrano isn't the best hitting pitcher currently playing. Its Micah Owings and that isn't close:

.288/.317/.524

[pingman]

without even looking at numbers, my guess

 

Catfish Hunter

Mike Hampton

[JohnBriggs12]

Don't overlook Don Newcombe, the old Dodger. Newcombe hit .271/.338/.367. He "only" had 15 HR total but he had arguable the greatest offensive year by any pitcher not named Ruth in 1955.

 

In 1955, Newcombe hit .359/.395/.632, with 7 HR 23 RBI in 117 AB's. That year he also went 20-5 with a 3.20 ERA yet incredibly only finished 7th in the MVP voting.

 

Zambrano's a good hitter, but he's not in Newcombe's class as evidenced by the .089 difference in OBP. It's also worth noting that starters got a lot more AB's back in the days of complete games.

 

My top 3 are: Ruth, Ferrell, Newcombe

 

Another guy nobody's mentioned is Gary Peters. His numbers were .222/.253/.348, with 19 HR and 109 RBI, playing in spacious old Comiskey. He was often used as a pinch hitter.

 

An interesting note on Catfish Hunter. When he pitched his perfect game in 1968 against the Twins, he was 3 for 4 with 2 doubles and drove in 3 of the A's 4 runs in the game.