Draft Pick Discussion, Rounds 1-5

[JJHardy7]

How many projected #1 starting pitchers were in this draft?

[crewcrazy]

I'm not too crazy about the Jungmann pick at this point, but I was pleasantly surprised with Bradley. I can't complain too much when a guy generally considered a Top 5 talent falls to you at 15.

[Never Outhustled]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more and dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Bradley was a no one light up the guns at a cool 86 in high school. Got to GT because he had really good off speed stuff to mix with that slow fastball. Now he is hitting 94 and has command of all 3 pitches (hope they give him a fourth to work on). He can throw all three anywhere in the count and from reports I have read they all can be out pitches. With him (about to turn 21) you can actually see his progression and him evolve over his time at GT.

 

So overall I think Bradley is still growing as a pitcher making his ceiling higher but has a lower floor because he had not been lights out. Jungmann has been lights out in his career giving him a really high ceiling but has not shown much progression giving him a lower ceiling. That is how I seperate them. I think Jungmann will be fine, I love the righty/lefty combo, now just hope they pan out. Said news is our system has gotten no younger so hope these guys get signed now and get working. Hate to see a whole rotation of 22 year olds dominating or struggling in MWL again.

Jungman has improved infinately more than Bradley. Jungman didn't give up less than half as many runs as Bradly last year, but this year he did. Jungman dominated college baseball this year, Bradley was simply pedestrian. They don't even compare.

 

 

[HiAndTight]

I remember people were not all that happy with the Braun pick. In the baseball draft you never know.

Sure, but what if the guy who begged for Braun hates a pick? Bradley is Jimmy Nelson 2.0

 

Then nothing, the point being made is that the draft is very unpredictable. Well, at least I thought it was. Now that I know Bradley is nothing more than Jimmy Nelson 2.0, I don't have to bother following him for the next couple years.

 

A LOT of people should be out of work as well, as many have very high opinions of him.

[LouisEly]

any early predictions for tomorrow's round 2 pick?

Brett Austin, C, HS

Williams Jerez, OF, HS

Joe Panik, SS, St. John's (I'm really warming up to him - decent pop, LH bat)

Brad Miller, SS, Clemson (less power than Panik but also hits lefty and played in a tougher conference)

Dante Bichette Jr., 3B/OF, HS

Charlie Lowell, LHP, Wichita St. (6'4", 245, 114K in 91 IP... but if the Brewers take another college pitcher half the board will have a poop hemorrhage)

 

Edit: TB took Jake Hager, another SS prospect I forgot about. Connor Barron is another HS SS that I'll add to the list.

Edit 2: Well, apparently other GMs think the same way I do about some people.

[danzig6767]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more and dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Bradley was a no one light up the guns at a cool 86 in high school. Got to GT because he had really good off speed stuff to mix with that slow fastball. Now he is hitting 94 and has command of all 3 pitches (hope they give him a fourth to work on). He can throw all three anywhere in the count and from reports I have read they all can be out pitches. With him (about to turn 21) you can actually see his progression and him evolve over his time at GT.

 

So overall I think Bradley is still growing as a pitcher making his ceiling higher but has a lower floor because he had not been lights out. Jungmann has been lights out in his career giving him a really high ceiling but has not shown much progression giving him a lower ceiling. That is how I seperate them. I think Jungmann will be fine, I love the righty/lefty combo, now just hope they pan out. Said news is our system has gotten no younger so hope these guys get signed now and get working. Hate to see a whole rotation of 22 year olds dominating or struggling in MWL again.

Jungman has improved infinately more than Bradley. Jungman didn't give up less than half as many runs as Bradly last year, but this year he did. Jungman dominated college baseball this year, Bradley was simply pedestrian. They don't even compare.

 

I didn't read up on this draft at all so i'm coming into this blind, but if Bradley has such pedestrian abilities, why did so many people and sites that follow the MLB draft closely predict Bradley to go in the top 10?

[southpaw121505]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more and dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Yeah, he should be ashamed of that sub 1 ERA.He had the most wins, most shut outs, 2nd best ERA, 3rd best opponents batting average. He was dominant.

[And That]

Baseball America scouting report on Jungmann:

As a freshman in 2009, Jungmann won 11 games and pitched a complete-game

five-hitter against Louisiana State in the College World Series finals.

As a sophomore, he was the ace of a Texas staff that led NCAA Division I

with a 2.45 ERA. Jungmann has taken another step this spring, leading

all D-I pitchers with 12 victories and three shutouts and ranking second

with a 0.95 ERA at the end of the regular season. He pitches at 91-93

mph and tops out at 95 with his fastball, and he has done a better job

of using his 6-foot-6, 220-pound frame to command his heater down in the

strike zone. He has improved the sharpness and command of his slider as

well. His changeup is average at times but more of a work in progress,

though he can get lefthanders out with the sink and life on his

fastball. Jungmann excels under pressure—he's 6-0 in NCAA tournament

play—and has demonstrated the ability to win without his best stuff. He

has some effort and a short stride in his delivery, but he has cleaned

it up since high school and it doesn't impede his ability to throw

strikes.

[And That]

Baseball America scouting report on Bradley:

 

 

Bradley was not drafted out of high school in Huntsville, Ala., but has

pitched in the Yellow Jackets weekend rotation for the better part of

the last three seasons as he has filled out his 6-foot-4 frame, going

from 180-190 pounds when he came to school to a sturdy 224. A rotation

stalwart his last two seasons, Bradley was at his best last summer, when

he ranked as the Cape Cod League's No. 4 prospect while tying for the

league lead in strikeouts. While he's not generally thought of as

overpowering, Bradley knows how to miss bats. Scouts love his pitcher's

frame, and he has a clean, loose arm. Bradley's fastball sits anywhere

from 88-94 mph. In better starts, he's at the higher end of that range,

touching 95. His low 80s slider gives him a second plus pitch, and his

changeup sits around 80 mph with fade. He earns high marks for his

confidence and work ethic. Bradley's performance (6-3, 3.71) has slipped

as the draft has neared. Scouts have noticed Bradley's stuff has not

been as sharp out of the stretch this spring, and his changeup has

lacked consistency, but he's still expected to be drafted among the

first 15 picks.

[HiAndTight]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Bradley was a no one light up the guns at a cool 86 in high school. Got to GT because he had really good off speed stuff to mix with that slow fastball. Now he is hitting 94 and has command of all 3 pitches (hope they give him a fourth to work on). He can throw all three anywhere in the count and from reports I have read they all can be out pitches. With him (about to turn 21) you can actually see his progression and him evolve over his time at GT.

 

So overall I think Bradley is still growing as a pitcher making his ceiling higher but has a lower floor because he had not been lights out. Jungmann has been lights out in his career giving him a really high ceiling but has not shown much progression giving him a lower ceiling. That is how I seperate them. I think Jungmann will be fine, I love the righty/lefty combo, now just hope they pan out. Said news is our system has gotten no younger so hope these guys get signed now and get working. Hate to see a whole rotation of 22 year olds dominating or struggling in MWL again.

I don't understand what Jungmann could have done then in order to prove he's progressed.

 

If you're throwing out this years improvement as being a result of the bats, and he was still the best or among the very best in the nation, then what could he do? Moreover, what did Bradley do that he didn't?

[HiAndTight]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more and dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Bradley was a no one light up the guns at a cool 86 in high school. Got to GT because he had really good off speed stuff to mix with that slow fastball. Now he is hitting 94 and has command of all 3 pitches (hope they give him a fourth to work on). He can throw all three anywhere in the count and from reports I have read they all can be out pitches. With him (about to turn 21) you can actually see his progression and him evolve over his time at GT.

 

So overall I think Bradley is still growing as a pitcher making his ceiling higher but has a lower floor because he had not been lights out. Jungmann has been lights out in his career giving him a really high ceiling but has not shown much progression giving him a lower ceiling. That is how I seperate them. I think Jungmann will be fine, I love the righty/lefty combo, now just hope they pan out. Said news is our system has gotten no younger so hope these guys get signed now and get working. Hate to see a whole rotation of 22 year olds dominating or struggling in MWL again.

Jungman has improved infinately more than Bradley. Jungman didn't give up less than half as many runs as Bradly last year, but this year he did. Jungman dominated college baseball this year, Bradley was simply pedestrian. They don't even compare.

 

I didn't read up on this draft at all so i'm coming into this blind, but if Bradley has such pedestrian abilities, why did so many people and sites that follow the MLB draft closely predict Bradley to go in the top 10?

He didn't say he had pedestrian abilities, he said his performance this year was pedestrian.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Both players the Brewers drafted were top 10 in most of the mock drafts I saw...why is getting them at #12 and #15 a bad thing again? I'd argue this draft is deep in pitching, and the position player prospects picked right in front of the Brewers were reaches to go where they went. talk high ceiling all we want, Strasburg's and Prior's ceilings were limitless until their arms fell off.

 

would've been nice to add a position player prospect and an arm to the system in round 1, but I'll take two good arms instead of reaching for a position player to make up for one that was already off the board

[Never Outhustled]

The way I split them up by ceiling is. Jungmann is the same guy he was walking in as a freshman. Texas Gatorade player of the year, Freshman All-American, and etc. but he never really took it to the next level. This years ERA I think has more to do with the bats than stuff. When a guy walks in and pitches the way he did as a freshman you'd like to see him continue to become more and dominate but he sayed at the same level IMO. Why would he all of a sudden take it to the next level now and be that electric Ace or #2. It is possible but he hasn't shown the progress to me.

 

Bradley was a no one light up the guns at a cool 86 in high school. Got to GT because he had really good off speed stuff to mix with that slow fastball. Now he is hitting 94 and has command of all 3 pitches (hope they give him a fourth to work on). He can throw all three anywhere in the count and from reports I have read they all can be out pitches. With him (about to turn 21) you can actually see his progression and him evolve over his time at GT.

 

So overall I think Bradley is still growing as a pitcher making his ceiling higher but has a lower floor because he had not been lights out. Jungmann has been lights out in his career giving him a really high ceiling but has not shown much progression giving him a lower ceiling. That is how I seperate them. I think Jungmann will be fine, I love the righty/lefty combo, now just hope they pan out. Said news is our system has gotten no younger so hope these guys get signed now and get working. Hate to see a whole rotation of 22 year olds dominating or struggling in MWL again.

Jungman has improved infinately more than Bradley. Jungman didn't give up less than half as many runs as Bradly last year, but this year he did. Jungman dominated college baseball this year, Bradley was simply pedestrian. They don't even compare.

 

I didn't read up on this draft at all so i'm coming into this blind, but if Bradley has such pedestrian abilities, why did so many people and sites that follow the MLB draft closely predict Bradley to go in the top 10?

There's early busts that the draftniks like every year. bradley profiles like many of them.

[Fear The Chorizo]

He also profiles like Mark Mulder and Andy Pettite

[patrickgpe]

i think you have to be happy, by giving up the players you did this offseason, the brewers need to look at college players for the first couple rounds i think to get the farm systems rank up.

[trwi7]

i think you have to be happy, by giving up the players you did this offseason, the brewers need to look at college players for the first couple rounds i think to get the farm systems rank up.

 

What? College players don't "bring up" system rankings up. The best talent does, they don't care if it's high school, college or junior college.

[Never Outhustled]

i think you have to be happy, by giving up the players you did this offseason, the brewers need to look at college players for the first couple rounds i think to get the farm systems rank up.

 

 

I'd be happy if they took 2 dominant college players like Jungman., but instead they took a guy who lost his job as Friday starter. CJ Cron dominated college, and he was available.

[ListachRides]

If anyone wants to see a glowing scouting report on Jed Bradley: http://baseballbeginnings...03/22/jed-bradley-report

[YoungGeezy]

Thanks Toby, for the reports. I think Jungmann is a very good pitcher and I'll come around once he gets going, but as I have said for the last month or two, I wanted the Brewers to get away from the Tall 6'6 college power arm righty. That is my biggest issue I have with Jungmann is that he is the exact same type off pitcher we have been targeting and it hasn't really worked out so far. ("Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting the same results" is a quote that kinda comes to mind). That is the main reason I want to stay away from guys liek Jungmann and Meyer. I felt they needed to go with a lefty (Bradley, Anderson Norris), or a short guy (Gray), or talented hs arm (Bradley, Norris, Guierrieri, Fernandez), something new. With this draft class there were a lot of talented guys that filled those that were all great picks were the Brewers were.

 

I think I am pretty much over that disappointment that we did go with the same type of guy but Jungmann is a darn good pitcher so hopefully it works out. I don't care how much X ellence complains about Bradley cause I have liked the guy for awhile. The way he pitched at Cap Cod last summer very well could be what he just got. I always tell myself to think before react but after Baez went to Cubs I was just in a bad mood and did the opposite and react then think (not a good rational approach) When you step back and look, this first round was pretty good. Jungmann/Bradley R/L combo could be pretty good and I'm excited to see how this works out!

 

GO Brewers and lets get younger tomorrow!!!

[TheCrew07]

I've been bouncing around reading scouting reports, is anyone aware if Jungmann has a plus pitch? It sounds like his FB has decent movement, but I find nothing about a plus secondary pitch? Lots of talk of improvement in his pitches, but nothing about 2 plus pitches? I thought maybe I was being a little harsh so I went and looked around, he'll get A ball hitters with FB command, but it's a bit unnerving that he doesn't have a second plus pitch listed... I'm struggling to recall a pitcher at any level the Brewers drafted high that didn't at least have 2 plus pitches.

 

I see And That posted the BA report recently. Is the slider a plus pitch or just average? If it's average does that make the change below average? I didn't want to base my entire assessment of him off reports here in the forum and the 1 time I saw him pitch, I'm looking to expand my analysis, but there isn't very information out there.

 

edit. I should add I've read plenty fan type scouting reports calling his curve tight breaking, overstating his velocity, some say the slider is a work in progress, some say the change is located effectively, and so on, but no actual reputable scouting report talking about plus pitches.

[xisxisxis]

There's early busts that the draftniks like every year.

 

 

 

like many of the ted thompson picks?

[Oldcity]

Like half the college pitchers taken in the first round who don't make the majors.

[Never Outhustled]

He also profiles like Mark Mulder and Andy Pettite

 

Mulders career ERA at Michigan State was 2.71, Bradleys career ERA at Georgia Tech was 4.62.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Like half the college pitchers taken in the first round who don't make the majors.

or half the high school pitchers taken in the first round who get injured and don't make the majors either - high ceilings are great, but sometimes the difference between high school and college pitchers is that the high schooler hasn't gotten to that first significant arm injury.

 

[StearnsFTW]

I'm OK with these picks. If it were up to me, I would've taken Barnes and Gray, but there's a reason it's not up to me. Seem like a couple of potential #2 starters to me. Nothing wrong with that.