The Remedy: Who and Where Are These Players?

[Warning Track Power]

I just posted in the lineup discussion about the type of players the Brewers need to field a successful lineup. Mark Loretta and Jeff Cirillo. Hitters who work the count and can be counted on to hit something close to .280 with marginal HR power but with gap power. Like I said in the Lineup discussion, this was not an idea of mine but an idea of another poster on the board and I believe this to be the remedy to our ails. Look at the Classies or even the Cubs. Every season they have their share of Aaron Miles, Brendan Ryans, Ryan Theriots, Daniel Descalsos, Reed Johnsons, Mike Fontenots, Darwin Barneys, Mark DeRosas, Skip Schumakers...maybe not world beaters but scrappy players who pester pitching staffs with their bloops, flares, doubles...etc. These guys get on base consistently so that (in the past) the Derrek Lees, Aramis Ramirez, (and in the present) Albert Pujols, and Matt Hollidays consistently have guys on base to drive in. Braun and Fielder have never had that luxury in my opinion.

 

Ideally, the Brewers #3-#6 hitters should be: Braun, Fielder, Weeks, Hart, with the guys mentioned above getting on in front of them. Unfortuantely, the Brewers continually rely on power hitting players who are more prone to slumps (Jose K, Yuni B, JJ Hardy to a certain extent, David Bell, Wes Helms, Keith Ginter). Why do we continually rely on boppers to fill these roles when consistent OBP guys serve that purpose? Why don't we have the Theriots and Fontenots or Ryans and Schumakers in our starting lineup or on our bench in Milwaukee? Can we not develop them like the Cubs and Cards? Is it an organizational philosophy in Milwaukee?

SS and CF are obvious the positions where holes currently exist and an opportunity to get better but maybe 3B needs assessment as well. I'm not saying deal McGehee but maybe you begin to look around at backup plans. I believe Morgan is the type of player needed but we have nothing now for SS coverage. Your long term Brewers are likely Weeks, Braun, McGehee, Hart, Lucroy. That means 1B, SS and CF are open for business for starters, but general backup roles can be had for those types of players as well.

 

Unfortuntately, the season has started and trades become far more difficult to make. However, Doug Melvin's charge right now should be the identify making the team all around better with that type of a player. Is it a trade for a Fontenot or DeRosa from SF? A trade with Seattle for Brendan Ryan? Or is it simply bringing up an Eric Farris type? Where are these players? Who are these players?

 

Where's Tony Graffanino when you need him?

 

EDIT: I bolded this string of questions about the Brewers philosophy because while the topic is who and where are these players, I think a secondary question that needs to be answered is the bolded section

[logan82]

CF has Gomez an Morgan long term. They are likely a good platoon in CF. At least league average on offense with very good defense. Gamel is likely the 1B long term. Really SS is the only open position in the next few years assuming the keep McGehee. We need competent bench players.

[RockCoCougars]

Paul Molitor and Robin Yount? Those two were about the prototype of what you want. Unfortunately they are once in a generation type talents. I know what you're saying though. A Shane Victorino/Rafael Furcal type combo at the top of the lineup would be perfect.

[TooLiveBrew]

Keep in mind that a healthy Logan Schafer is a viable option in CF. Not sure how well Komatsu defends in CF, but the Brewers have been committed to playing him there in MiLB. He's another OBP-type role player. Caleb Gindl is another one. The trouble I see is that we have these players, just not in the infield where we could use them most. If Taylor Green can return to hitting, he's an IF that profiles in this vein, but not a MIF.

[paul253]

I'm hoping that either Schafer or Komatsu is ready to be the every day right fielder next year. Trade Corey Hart to help replenish the system and let your prospects take over. Morgan in CF batting first, Weeks batting second, Gomez on the bench. Hopefully in a few years Scooter Gennett will be that type of hitter we are looking for. He's really been coming on lately after a terrible first few games.

[Warning Track Power]

Paul Molitor and Robin Yount? Those two were about the prototype of what you want. Unfortunately they are once in a generation type talents. I know what you're saying though. A Shane Victorino/Rafael Furcal type combo at the top of the lineup would be perfect.

Man I didn't know you held ALL of those guys I listed in my original post in the same breath as Molitor and Yount. Now I understand why we aren't able to get those "Hall of Famers" http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

 

 

[TooLiveBrew]

Good call on Gennett, Paul. He seems to fit the profile described in the OP, and even plays in the middle infield. Not sure how I forgot about him!

[RockCoCougars]

Paul Molitor and Robin Yount? Those two were about the prototype of what you want. Unfortunately they are once in a generation type talents. I know what you're saying though. A Shane Victorino/Rafael Furcal type combo at the top of the lineup would be perfect.

Man I didn't know you held ALL of those guys I listed in my original post in the same breath as Molitor and Yount. Now I understand why we aren't able to get those "Hall of Famers" http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

 

A guy can dream, can't he? Molly still looks like he could put up a decent OBP. Kind of like the Ty Cobb quote when he was about 70 years old, and someone asked him what he thought he'd hit in 'today's game'. He said something to the effect that "I'd hit .300, but what do you expect, I'm 70?"

[MJLiverock]

I think you are thinking too much about frustrating players that always seemed to come up big against the Brewers and prescribing a lot more ability to them than they really have. Guys like Miles, Theriot, Schumaker, Ryan, Fontenot really weren't very good, and were best used as role players or utility infielders who mostly played below average defense which would only add to the complaints about defense.

 

The other thing that stands out is these guys and their scrappy ilk are often 2nd baseman or poor shorstops. The Brewers already had a 2nd baseman who is better than any scrappy, bloop hitting guy you could want to get. It wouldn't matter if the Brewer's developed some "scrappy, gritty, battler" because they aren't going to play 2nd base in Milwaukee which seems to be the place where all these types end up. Or you can go back to some guy like Brady Clark in CF who played awful defense with his heels on warning track and managed a year or two of good hitting.

 

The best option to fit that scrappy (i.e. minimal power, bloop or seeing eye single hitter) mold right now is probably LuCroy.

[Kricket755]

I am not sure why we would want to copy the offensive strategy of the Cardinals or Cubs. The Brewers have outscored the Cardinals 3 of the last 5 years and the Cubs 4 of the last 5 years. Over that same 5 year stretch (2006-2010), the Brewers are about 65 runs better than Stl and 100 runs better than the Cubbies. I think they are probably looking at our lineup wondering why they don't have more hitters up and down the lineup that can make a pitcher pay.

 

With that said, Gomez and Betancourt aren't very good. I think most of us would take some people who could get on base at a decent rate over either of them. But it isn't as if Doug Melvin targeted Betancourt to fit his style. It is simply an afterthought of the Greinke trade. I would take this same lineup with a healthy Hardy and Cameron (hardly .280-.300 hitters that are safe players) and be perfectly happy without any scrappy gamers.

[bucksman4]

In an interview with 1250 WSSP yesterday, Doug Melvin was asked about his offensive philosophy and I think it speaks to the question that was posed in the original post. He said that he firmly believes an offense should play to it's home park. He feels that Miller Park is a hitter's park, specifically for fly ball hitters So he said what while you also would like to mix in hitters capable of hitting in non-pitcher's parks on the road, it was clear why he has so many boom or bust hitters. Because that's what high K, high HR hitters do...swing for the fences.

It was the first time I heard him make this point and found it very informative as to how our roster gets put together.