I Like Carlos Gomez

[JJHardy7]

I have been in fear of saying this for awhile and hope I don’t get kicked off bf.net for saying this. I know he has many detractors. I know we keep saying the guy has potential and he’s not reaching it/won’t reach it, etc.

I think Gomez could potentially be a nice fit long-term on this team. I’m not saying we should give him a huge contract or anything like that…but for a team that many here think struggles on defense and has limitations he’s a nice fit. We say we want an all-defense shortstop since Betancourt is a liability at times. What is the difference with Gomez though? He is a pretty good defensive player IMO and yes he does struggle at time with the bat and makes some base running blunders. Isn’t he what a team like the Brewers need? I’m not saying he should be the number 2 hitter or anything like that, but in the ideal world if he plays the defense he can and provides sparks on offense from time to time…what’s wrong with him?

Again, I’m not saying Gomez is an all-star or will come close to being that, but if we are looking for defense so much Gomez is a nice fit. He’s still young and might develop, etc.

He was critical in today’s win and I just want to give him some love on the bf.net board. I know there will be detractors and such and that is fine. That’s what being a fan is all about, but at the same time I don’t think it’s fair to constantly complain about this team’s defense and then complain about Gomez. He’s not perfect, but I do think he could play a critical role in this team’s future.


(edit: font size --1992)

[pastoradub]

Beating the throw to second on Gallardo's roller to SS was a thing of beauty. His speed and defense is a thing of beauty. Now if he could just get on base at a .325 rate this team could be going places.

[Schlitz001]

We all agree that he is a plus defender on a team that needs all the defense it can get. The backlash comes from his lack of discipline at the plate, his over aggressiveness on the bases and his overconfidence in his bunting ability. He is a very hot tempered player and it leads to some great plays, but also a lot of dumb plays. For instance in today's game, where he was batting 8th in front of the pitcher, a heads up base running play let him stretch a bloop single into a double. He made it into second safely sliding, but he could have very easily been thrown out and we would have had the pitcher leading off the following inning. It may just be perception, but it seems like he is getting himself in trouble quite often on the basepaths because he's not thinking about the situation.

 

As a plus defender at a prime defensive position, batting 8th in the lineup, he does a decent job, but it gets harder to defend him when higher OBP guys like Morgan become available.

[Oxy]

Gomez is just plain fun to watch. I have no problems with a Morgan/Gomez CF platoon for the next few years. I think that as he gets more playing time he will develop a better barometer of when he can take chances and when he can't (I hope). The things that make him a frustrating/poor baseball player are generally correctable or at least improvable mistakes, i.e. baserunning errors and plate discipline. He has a lot of tools that cannot be taught.

[giffted1]

Gomez can make you want to stand up and clap after a great play in center, and then he'll have an at bat that makes you want to punch him through your TV. He has no plate discipline and is not the smartest base runner, but his outstanding defense gives him value.

 

Gomez has no place batting second the lineup, but I have no problem with him getting regular starts in CF even when Morgan comes back.

[JonnyLungs]

I do like him, just not as the number two hitter. His defense does have a lot of value.

 

Put it this way, if Mark Kotsay is the next option on Ron Roenicke's mind, I'll take Gomez any day of the week.

[BrewCrewForever]

As someone once put it on twitter, Carlos Gomez is the Brewers version of Jarrett Bush for the Packers. A very polarizing figure who looks great one second and terrible the next. Lots of raw talent and ability but sometimes lacks the smarts. I have been hard on Gomez in the past but you just take the good with the bad I guess. And as long as he bats 8th I am okay with him being an everyday player.

[benji]

I agree. I love his tools and want him to play everyday. He just should not bat second. They should just throw Hart out there let him get his at bats. Im sick of seeing Kotsay although he did hit the ball hard today.

[Gobias Industries]

As someone once put it on twitter, Carlos Gomez is the Brewers version of Jarrett Bush for the Packers. A very polarizing figure who looks great one second and terrible the next. Lots of raw talent and ability but sometimes lacks the smarts. I have been hard on Gomez in the past but you just take the good with the bad I guess. And as long as he bats 8th I am okay with him being an everyday player.

That's actually a very good comparison. Both are very good at something that's undervalued by casual fans (D & ST's), and pretty much suck at the glaring aspects of the game (hitting & coverage).

 

Also, nice job on the podcasts man. I've listened to a few of them and you've got a great voice for radio haha.

[endaround]

Comparing Gomez to Bush sells Gomez short. Gomez's defense alone makes about an average starter. His UZR/150 is 15.1 over his career. The problem is that people see Rickey Henderson when he's not that guy. He's a fine #8 hitter. Teams just keep giving him an extra 150 PAs a year that he just shouldn't get.

[bucksman4]

I do not think Gomez is a major league player. While his defense is good, his batting average and OBP tell me that he cannot hit MLB pitching.

 

It's not like this is a small sample size. His OBP every year is under .300. That is beyond pathetic.

 

A wise baseball sage once said, "you cannot steal first base." This applies directly to Gomez.

[ELCABALLO45]

I think over the past year here I have been one of the biggest if not the biggest Gomez supporters on this board.

 

As endaround noted, Gomez's defense alone makes him about an average starter. If he could hit even a little bit he would be above average. And when he was hitting 2nd I said all along as well he has no business hitting that high. If you bat him 8th and give him a full season's of at bats I really think he would be a solid player for the Brewers. He just needs to play everyday. His only year he played in over 140 games he had a WAR of 2.4 in that year. In a line up with Braun, Fielder, Weeks, Hart and McGehee. I really think having a elite defensive CF and AS LONG AS HE IS HITTING 8TH is just fine.

 

And I understand he does some boneheaded things on the basepaths, but guess what? So does Nyjer Morgan. So even though he can be frustrating as heck at times, as long as he is hitting 8th he is perfectly fine playing everyday IMO. And he certainly is not "worthless" or "terrible" as some people on this board might think.

[bucksman4]

It's funny how people are making Gomez out to be Willy Mays in CF now. I find this quite amusing.

[mothershipconnection]

I find it amusing that you gleaned from this discussion that anyone has said he's "Willy" Mays.

[bucksman4]

I find it amusing that you gleaned from this discussion that anyone has said he's "Willy" Mays.

Willie, sorry. Are you reading these posts? Making him seem like a defensive superstar. Yes, he makes nice plays once in awhile out there, but he also throws to the wrong bases often, misses cutoffs and does not do enough out there to make up for his shoddy bat. I'm sorry, but I'm not drinking the same Kool Aid.

[RockCoCougars]

It's funny how people are making Gomez out to be Willy Mays in CF now. I find this quite amusing.

Well, in my opinion, he's better out there then Cammy was. Based on how highly regarded Cammy's defense was here, that may make Cargo the best defensive centerfielder that ever played.

[derflotr]

I find it amusing that you gleaned from this discussion that anyone has said he's "Willy" Mays.

Willie, sorry. Are you reading these posts? Making him seem like a defensive superstar. Yes, he makes nice plays once in awhile out there, but he also throws to the wrong bases often, misses cutoffs and does not do enough out there to make up for his shoddy bat. I'm sorry, but I'm not drinking the same Kool Aid.

I'm sorry, but I honestly can't imagine a better defensive centerfielder. Maybe he makes a "wrong" decision now and again with his arm, but unlike most CF he actually has one and usually throws out the guy who challenges it. His range and reactions are phenomenal, as we've all seen. I still think there's reason to hope that he can be an acceptable ML hitter, he's shown some progress (no matter how gradual) in the last few weeks. He's got extra opportunity with Morgan out again, maybe the results will start coming like they did today.

Definitely a guy that's hard to keep out of the lineup for a manager. You don't see many professional athletes give 'er like he does all the time. I'm rooting for him as hard as anyone.

[milwaukeesportsfan]

With the exception of Almonte, if anyone other than Berkman is playing right field, that triple is an out, and the 9th inning is a whole different situation. He did make a nice catch in the 1st, though.

 

The guy can't hit and he's an idiot. He gets picked off more than anyone I've ever seen, and he makes the worst baserunning decisions of anyone I've ever seen. I still think you need to send him down to AAA to learn how to run the bases. Unfortunately, you can't now that Morgan is hurt again.

[TooLiveBrew]

Well, in my opinion, he's better out there then Cammy was. Based on how highly regarded Cammy's defense was here, that may make Cargo the best defensive centerfielder that ever played.

 

I said in a different thread (heh, can't remember which one) that I would put Carlos up against any other CF in the league in terms of defense. I think he's as good as there is out there right now. I love watching him patroll the OF.

 

Do I think he's Willie Mays, once-in-several-generations good? No, but that's not a very useful standard. I mean, if that's the bar, then we should be laughing at just about every hitter not named Pujols.

[And That]

I don't believe that there is definitely a better defensive CF in MLB than Gomez. You could make arguments for a few guys - Gutierrez, maybe Bourn - but there is no one definitively better. He makes boneheaded throws now and again, but no one is perfect, and he's better than most everyone despite his faults. He's worth a tremendous amount on defense.

 

And FWIW, it seems he's taking a slightly better approach at the plate this year. Fewer out of zone swings, more in zone swings, generally just swinging a bit less. It's also important to remember that he's 25 years old. I think that a lot of people truly don't know how young he is. Lorenzo Cain is 25 years old, too. No one here was too quick to run him out of town, yah?

 

The things that drive me nuts with Gomez are his baserunning miscues, complete inability to bunt and Roenicke batting him second. Now that we seem to have taken care of the 3rd issue, let him hit 8th (or 9th) and play great defense. He's worth a lot. He really is.

[MessiahRp]

I find it amusing that you gleaned from this discussion that anyone has said he's "Willy" Mays.

Willie "Mays" Hayes, possibly. Especially from the first Major League movie.

[endaround]

The thing is that Morgan is almost as good defensively and is far superior offensively so Gomez really should still be behind him.

[RockCoCougars]

With my Brewers blinders on, Gomez is in my view the best defensive CF in the game today. I haven't seen every inning of every game, but can recall only one (for sure) or two balls hit over his head all year. If the ballpark will hold it, he's almost always going to run it down, the guy is a regular gazelle out there. I'm not sure if it's due to the coaching, but another thing I've noticed is that he seems to always be in perfect position. Frankly, I think that the reason that people get so down on him is that he is so 'toolsy' he could be a star player if only he could do something offensively.

[PKBadger]

He's the only player on the roster who's actually made me scream at the television this season (getting thrown out at 3rd base in that game @ Houston when we needed a run and Braun was due next).

 

Also, he gives away too many at-bats with his little "fake bunt" nonsense. Either swing away or bunt. Make a decision. I blame Roenicke and Sveum for even giving him the option.

[mothershipconnection]

Agreed on the fake bunt - drives me nuts. There doesn't seem to be any function other than committing ahead that you'll take that pitch, as he's not a big enough bunt threat that pitchers are gonna get all freaked out that he may lay one down. They may actually welcome it.