Trade Gomez for SS upgrade

[TheCrew]

Hardy has plummeted since 2008 - He had major value then (after hitting 50 HR over 2 season with solid avg/obp) and could have brought back some very, very nice talent, but it's easy to sit back and say that now. Did anyone really want to deal Hardy after 2008?

 

I really don't understand the manlove with Hardy around here - don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed his play while he was here but he was terrible in 2008 and has done absolutely nothing since he has left that made me miss him. People need to realize that the 2011 version of JJ Hardy is not the same as the 2007-2008 version.

 

Yuni has been solid - better than what I thought in the field and it's far, far too early to judge anything at the plate. For those that are into it, he has been above average defensively according to fan graphs. That said, I'll admit, I haven't been able to watch as much as I normally do at this point in the season but from what I've seen, It's been better than I expected as I anticipate his offensive numbers will come around.............. it sure seems like some are still judging him based on what they heard rather than what they see and are splitting hairs in their criticism.

[TheCrew]

My problem isn't so much with YuBet's bat. Betancourt has the potential to put up exactly the kind of numbers JJ did during his prime years. The only thing Betancourt can't do on offense that JJ could, is draw walks. The bigger issue I have is with his lackadaisical defense. JJ was a consistent defender at SS and that is where he separates himself from Betancourt in my opinion.

This is the best summary I've read - but realistically, Betancourt is the best option out of the two at this point and as we sit right now, there are only 2 options:

- Go with Betancourt, see if he can put up great offensive numbers and deal with his defense.

- Go with a FA plus defender who offers little to no upside - I love 'em to death, but another Counsell type but maybe a bit better on defense..... that is pretty much are only option at this point.

 

I'd rather wait until closer to June and see where a team like the Mets are - if they are out of it, Reyes will probably become available.

[yoshii8]

I brought up two Guthrie to Mil for Hardy to Bal threads before we dealt him for Gomez. I still think we could have made that trade happen (ironic Baltimore now has both).

I'm pretty sure Baltimore wouldn't of traded Guthrie for Hardy, otherwise it probably would've happened. I think we overvalued what Hardy was actually worth.

[TheCrew]

Maybe after 08, but there was no way in heck that offer was on the table in 09

[JohnBriggs12]

Gomez came up with the Mets. The Mets current CF is Carlos Beltran, who's contract expires after this year and who is rumored will be on the block if the Mets are out of it in July.

 

Jose Reyes is a rental candidate too. Brewer fans, especially those that can't live with Betancourt, instead of clamoring for more Nyjer Morgan, and less Carlos Gomez, should be hoping Gomez starts putting up some numbers between now and July so that a team like the Mets might have interest in him replacing Beltran. The Brewers don't have a lot to deal in the minors, if Gomez can start hitting with more consistency, he can up his value between now and July and perhaps be part of a package to get Reyes.

 

Keep in mind too that he's more likely to hit batting second ahead of Braun and Fielder.

[nate82]

Gomez came up with the Mets. The Mets current CF is Carlos Beltran, who's contract expires after this year and who is rumored will be on the block if the Mets are out of it in July.

 

Jose Reyes is a rental candidate too. Brewer fans, especially those that can't live with Betancourt, instead of clamoring for more Nyjer Morgan, and less Carlos Gomez, should be hoping Gomez starts putting up some numbers between now and July so that a team like the Mets might have interest in him replacing Beltran. The Brewers don't have a lot to deal in the minors, if Gomez can start hitting with more consistency, he can up his value between now and July and perhaps be part of a package to get Reyes.

 

Keep in mind too that he's more likely to hit batting second ahead of Braun and Fielder.

Beltran can only play RF or LF and I am not sure he really can play either of those two positions every day and I am not even sure he can go more than two games in a row. Health wise Beltran is not worth it and the Mets would be ecstatic to get Gomez back in return for dumping Beltran who has no value. The Brewers wouldn't be able to offer Beltran arbitration. Reyes maybe more realistic but I think that is going to cost the Brewers Rogers and Gennett at least with more being sent to the Mets. The only good thing the Brewers have going for them is that there will not be that many teams looking for a SS at the deadline. The only teams that I can think of right now that would need an upgrade at SS would be the Twins, Giants, and Brewers. I don't see the Twins making a big deal for Reyes and the Giants probably won't either so that leaves the Brewers and maybe a surprise team in the Red Sox but I doubt they will get involved.

Reyes makes sense for the Brewers but I am not sure the budget will allow it but I think Mark A. will open up the books and take the chance if the Brewers are in it and are close. Reyes would definitely take Rogers, Gennett, and another prospect while Beltran even if healthy at the most the Brewers should give up would be Gomez. Beltran really is a DH option at this point in his career.

[brettac1]

I'd rather see them stand pat and hang onto prospects for a while. The farm system needs to get back on the uptick quick if the Brewers are going to stay relevant in a couple years.

[ilikewisco]

Peralta or Rogers would be deal breakers for me. I can't see giving up 6 years of guys that are so close to contributing with big potential like those two for a mid season acquisition of Reyes. Everyone else is fair game for me and he would be a huge in season addition at a definite weak spot.

[KCBrewerfan34]

Until Friday Betancourt has been adequate (or better) at SS so far. I will say the guy hits the ball extremely hard, I wish he could elevate some of those a bit.

 

Guys referencing Hardy really are out in leftfield, the guy is a broken down shell of his early self. Time to move on fellas.

 

 

Go BREW

[razzzorsharp]

I see there is a lot of "DFA Betacourrt" but I don't see any FA options out there. Nothing in the minors either so I think we are stuck with him.

[Invader3K]

I see there is a lot of "DFA Betacourrt" but I don't see any FA options out there. Nothing in the minors either so I think we are stuck with him.

This is pretty much what it boils down to. Other teams know the Brewers have no SS depth, so getting any decent shortstop is going to require giving up more than Melvin can afford at this point.

[adambr2]

Hardy has plummeted since 2008 - He had major value then (after hitting 50 HR over 2 season with solid avg/obp) and could have brought back some very, very nice talent, but it's easy to sit back and say that now. Did anyone really want to deal Hardy after 2008?

 

I really don't understand the manlove with Hardy around here - don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed his play while he was here but he was terrible in 2008 and has done absolutely nothing since he has left that made me miss him. People need to realize that the 2011 version of JJ Hardy is not the same as the 2007-2008 version.

 

Yuni has been solid - better than what I thought in the field and it's far, far too early to judge anything at the plate. For those that are into it, he has been above average defensively according to fan graphs. That said, I'll admit, I haven't been able to watch as much as I normally do at this point in the season but from what I've seen, It's been better than I expected as I anticipate his offensive numbers will come around.............. it sure seems like some are still judging him based on what they heard rather than what they see and are splitting hairs in their criticism.

I did. I know it would have upset a lot of Brewer fans, but I was definitely advocating a trade for Hardy after 2008. It was the perfect situation -- quality shortstops post-2008 were at a major premium. The quality defensive play from Hardy had been anticipated, but what hadn't been anticipated is 2 straight .800 or so OPS seasons from the SS position. As such, he was worth a very substantial return, and one of our top prospects was a near-MLB ready SS. While I don't think anyone saw Hardy dropping off as far as he did, I think it was agreed by many here that his offensive output from 2007 and 2008 was not sustainable, and thus he was a very good trade high candidate.

 

Also, we lost our #1 and #2 starting pitchers after 2011 to free agency and our closer to retirement, and had to plug our rotation with guys like Braden Looper. Hardy had 2 years left at the time after which he was considered pretty likely to leave, and it was pretty apparent that while .500 was a realistic goal in 2009, the playoffs were not.

 

So while it would have definitely been an unpopular decision, I think from some perspective, there was definitely some solid logic behind trading Hardy post-2008.