Alternatives for 3rd base

[Hammer]

Ok, small sample police can remember also that McGehee played the same position quite poorly last year so please don't jump down my throat for saying this after 2+ games. He is a complete statue out there that we are going to be stuck with this year. Bigger, older slower...he is not going to get better. Who is out there to replace him next year? Will the Crew have enough money to get a good player at the hot corner?

[Schlitz001]

Seriously? McGehee has been fantastic offensively and at least serviceable defensively plus he's under team control through 2014. I would look at upgrading CF, SS, C, 1B, SP, and RP before I started worrying about 3B for next year. And if his knees really start to be a problem we can move him to 1B next year.

[TooLiveBrew]

While I won't worry about 3B as a main priority, I agree that it would be nice to have a non-statue defending at 3B. The Brewers have to find a way to get better defenders on the field. This team's defense could well keep them out of the postseason.

[chuckiehacks]

Watch out - the sky is falling! I'll agree with Schlitz - way more pressing issues on this team than 3B. With McGehee, you know what you're getting on offense and his defense, while not great is at least passable.

[Hammer]

There is nothing passable about McGehee's defense. He simply cannot move around enough to be more than a 1b/dh.

[DHonks]

McGehee is solid on defense and very good on offense. He's just not in the same class as Rolen or the other whizzes.

[brewmann04]

You have to really be kidding me about casey playing 3rd, you really feel like this is a major issue.

[jason21nl]

This has a lot to do with the weak ground ball to Casey today where he went home and just missed making the out. That was a play where most players won't make let alone just Casey and he made the correct play by going home. He isn't the best 3rdbase in the league but he is just fine over there.

[DHonks]

let's worry about Betancourt, not McGehee. We don't need to upgrade 3b, we need anything at SS

[nate82]

Ok, small sample police can remember also that McGehee played the same position quite poorly last year so please don't jump down my throat for saying this after 2+ games. He is a complete statue out there that we are going to be stuck with this year. Bigger, older slower...he is not going to get better. Who is out there to replace him next year? Will the Crew have enough money to get a good player at the hot corner?

Short answer no to the first question. Somewhat long answer 2012 3B Free Agents: Casey Blake LAD *, Mark DeRosa SF, Greg Dobbs PHI, Aramis Ramirez CHC

All four of those options would be just as good or worse than McGehee defensively so no improvement there and offensively you are probably looking at a drop off probably a considerable one. The best option would be keeping McGehee at 3B if you have to you can move him to 1B but I would rather have Braun at 1B than McGehee as Braun's lack of defense in LF hurts the Brewers more than McGehee's defense at 3B. Plus there are options in the OF next year with Gamel, Schafer, Komatsu, and Gindl. I could see Gamel in LF/RF with Hart either moving to LF or staying in RF. Komatsu or Schafer could handle CF fine I actually believe Komatsu will finish out the year in AAA this year and will be a strong contender as the starting CF in 2012 for the Brewers along with Schafer, Morgan, and Gomez. Defensively the OF gets better by moving either Braun or Hart out of the OF would see a bigger improvement defensively without Braun in the OF.

[The Truth]

McGehee is what he is. Nothing special defensively but not horrible. He's a pretty good hitter. Personally I'd love to see better hitting out of a 3rd baseman and certainly better hitting out of the 5th spot in the batting order! He's certainly no David Wright. He's not even as good as Scott Rolen was last year with the bat (though I think Rolen is starting to show signs of slowing down)

 

I agree that McGehee is down the list of problems that we have... He doesn't have anywhere near the power to be a credible 1B. We're pretty much stuck with him at 3B. I'd like him alot better if we had a powerful enough lineup where McGehee could bat 7th, but that is more a knock on our lineup than on Casey himself

[logan82]

McGehee has been fantastic offensively and at least serviceable defensively plus he's under team control through 2014.

 

He has been just ok offensively not fantastic and below average defensively. He is what he is, a decent long term option at 3B. He could still fall off offensively. He did the year before. Not a guy you are looking to upgrade but if somebody comes along you upgrade.

[Schlitz001]

McGehee has been fantastic offensively and at least serviceable defensively plus he's under team control through 2014.

 

He has been just ok offensively not fantastic and below average defensively. He is what he is, a decent long term option at 3B. He could still fall off offensively. He did the year before. Not a guy you are looking to upgrade but if somebody comes along you upgrade.

Here is what the National League leaders in wOBA look like over the last 2 years:

 

.383 - Zimmerman

.366 - Wright

.356 - Reynolds

.356 - Sandoval

.353 - McGehee

 

We know he is not a good defender, but would you really be willing to offer a multiyear deal to a 3B for an upgrade defensively? Maybe at SS something like that is reasonable where there is little separation between players offensive production (aside from Tulo and H-Ram), but with a third baseman I'll take what McGehee is giving us at his price.

 

Yes he could fall off offensively, but so could any of the other position players. Who do you anticipate will come along to as an upgrade to McGehee?

[DHonks]

It's also important to note that we're in a drought in baseball for slugging 3b. Shortstop has also taken a hit since ARod, Nomar, Renteria, etc have suffered declines or have retired.

 

 

To be honest, not re-acquiring Hardy this offseason looks like a mistake. I miss his defense and offensive capabilities. I'd love to try to trade for him

[Oxy]

It's also important to note that we're in a drought in baseball for slugging 3b. Shortstop has also taken a hit since ARod, Nomar, Renteria, etc have suffered declines or have retired.

 

 

To be honest, not re-acquiring Hardy this offseason looks like a mistake. I miss his defense and offensive capabilities. I'd love to try to trade for him

It's not so much that we are in a drought now as it is that 1993-2007 or so was an exceptional period for power across the league at all positions....there is a reason for that. The league has been normalizing lately so that the big-boppers will basically only be at 1B and the corner OF spots, with occasional exceptions at the rest of the spots. Consequently, defense and speed and batting avg., (yes batting avg) have become more important at most positions and OBP and slugging pct. will be not quite as important as they have been.

[logan82]

Here is what the National League leaders in wOBA look like over the last 2 years:

 

.383 - Zimmerman

.366 - Wright

.356 - Reynolds

.356 - Sandoval

.353 - McGehee

 

We know he is not a good defender, but would you really be willing to offer a multiyear deal to a 3B for an upgrade defensively? Maybe at SS something like that is reasonable where there is little separation between players offensive production (aside from Tulo and H-Ram), but with a third baseman I'll take what McGehee is giving us at his price.

 

Yes he could fall off offensively, but so could any of the other position players. Who do you anticipate will come along to as an upgrade to McGehee?

McGehee dropped of significantly in 2010 on offense. He could fall off even further. He is a little above average as a hitter, not fantastic. He is what he is, a solid 3B that should be replaced if something better comes along.

[Flood Pants]

McGehee may be an average third baseman, but he's a very cheap average third baseman. And for this team, that's a very valuable thing to have. If they can improve third base production without spending more money, that would be great. But I think the Brewers may as well leave him alone and spend the money on positions that are clearly below average (shortstop, center field).

[Schlitz001]

logan3825]McGehee dropped of significantly in 2010 on offense. He could fall off even further. He is a little above average as a hitter, not fantastic. He is what he is, a solid 3B that should be replaced if something better comes along.

He went from a .367 wOBA in 394 PAs in 2009 to .346 wOBA in 670 PAs in 2010. In what world is that a "significant" drop off while you're arguing about the definition of "fantastic"? If I see McGehee on the street I'm going to tell him I think he's fantastic. You can tell him he's ok.

 

BTW, I've never been a huge McGehee supporter (see the McGehee extension thread), but you can't argue with the return on his current contract.

[jason21nl]

It might be just my perception but it sure does seem like Casey gets a bad rap on the site. Especially considering he is the best 3rd baseman we have had in quite some time.

[logan82]

Who is arguing with the return on his contract? I said was he was a solid player. Talking to a guy and telling him he is fantastic has nothing to do with how well he actually performs.

 

A .367 wOBA to a .346 wOBA is a difference of about one win over a full season. I consider that significant. An average MLB wOBA is around .335 I believe(I think Tango said .340 if you look it up but that was a while ago). I am not sure how you can say a guy who is a little over average is "fantastic." Fielder, Braun and Weeks are fantastic. McGehee is a solid MLB player

[dlk9s]

I always love reading complaints people have about players and their suggestions on how to replace them:

 

1) Those who want a better defender usually ignore/downplay the drop off that will occur at the plate.

 

2) Those who want a better hitter usually ignore/downplay the drop off that will occur in the field.

 

3) Those who want a great fielder AND hitter are high.

[Invader3K]

It might be just my perception but it sure does seem like Casey gets a bad rap on the site. Especially considering he is the best 3rd baseman we have had in quite some time.

If he had come up through the Brewers' system, he would have a huge following. The fact that he was a waiver acquisition and not a heralded prospect diminishes his perceived upside for many around here. Really, as a complete player (obviously Braun was awesome offensively, but terrible manning the hot corner), McGehee is a much better 3B than we've had in years.

[Polish Falcons]

It might be just my perception but it sure does seem like Casey gets a bad rap on the site. Especially considering he is the best 3rd baseman we have had in quite some time.

Yes, ever since his breakout season in 2009 we had all these people saying that his success was a fluke, and it seems like no matter how long McGehe continues to be successful we will still have all these haters. Even after easily being in top quarter of offensive 3rd baseman in all of MLB in 2010, and at the league minimum salary, we have people making posts about replacing him, and some folks agreeing that he doesn't have enough pop in his bat for a 3rd baseman. Last year McGehe hit 25 homeruns (5th among MLB 3B), and had 104 RBI (2nd among MLB 3B), and an OPS of .801 (3rd among MLB 3B). If you look at the players ranking ahead of him offensively, they are all making millions and millions of dollars (ARod, Beltre, Wright, Longoria, Zimmerman). One could argue that on a cash strapped team McGehe offers more value right now (and next year) than any of these guys. The amount that McGehe earns allows us to get high level of production at 3B while saving money for an upgrade at SS next year. The defense leaves a little to be desired but is more than made up for with the bat and low salary.

[JohnBriggs12]

It might be just my perception but it sure does seem like Casey gets a bad rap on the site. Especially considering he is the best 3rd baseman we have had in quite some time.

If he had come up through the Brewers' system, he would have a huge following. The fact that he was a waiver acquisition and not a heralded prospect diminishes his perceived upside for many around here. Really, as a complete player (obviously Braun was awesome offensively, but terrible manning the hot corner), McGehee is a much better 3B than we've had in years.

Agree completely. At some point major league production trumps numbers a prospect put up at age 21 in low A ball. McGehee long ago passed that threshold. Because I live outside Wisconsin, I get the opportunity to hear telecasts from the opposition. McGehee is highly respected around the league and especially within the division as one of the top 3B in the league and a hitter the opponent doesn't want to see up there with the game on the line.