Brewers Acquire RHP Sergio Mitre from NYY for Chris Dickerson

[And That]

trwi7 wrote:Loe, Egan, Segovia and Green are all similar pitchers to Mitre and we've gotten all of them either from the Rule V or minor league deals in the past two years.

 

 

Green was a MLB deal, Segovia has yet to prove to be as good as Mitre, and Egan wasn't good enough/healthy enough to keep.

[trwi7]

I never said they were better, I said they were similar. Low strikeout, high ground ball guys.

[GormanHarvey]

Wow, we need real baseball ASAP! 7 pages on Chris Dickerson for Sergio Mitre!

[PrinceEatMeat]

Yeah, the Greinke trade only had 29 pages during he offseason. This trade probably doesn't deserve 7.

[TooLiveBrew]

http://espn.go.com/blog/n...st/_/id/13668/mitre-gone

 

I'm sure things can change, heck Granderson's leg could reinjure. But as of that posting, that's all I had been hearing. Scranton, Scranton, Scranton.

The latest on Granderson at LoHud's excellent Yankees blog is that they're still not sure if he'll be ready for Opening Day (I linked to the whole blog as opposed to a specific post because there are several mentions of Granderson). The most recent comment is:

 

Granderson said it’s 50-50 whether he’ll be ready for Opening Day. He

feels fine going through baseball activities, it’s just a matter of how

quickly the Yankees move him. Based on conversations with Granderson,

Girardi and Brian Cashman, I think the team legitimately doesn’t know

whether he’ll be on the Opening Day roster. I believe they’ll probably

move with caution and my guess is that he won’t be in the lineup on Thursday, but I don’t think it’s out of the question.

 

Per other Girardi quotes, Dickerson is being considered to start in place of Granderson if Curtis isn't ready. I haven't seen anything at the LoHud blog that suggests Dickerson isn't in the mix for the MLB roster, and I'd trust their beat coverage over ESPN any day of the week. And honestly it doesn't change my opinion on the deal whether or not Dickerson

makes the Yankees' 25-man, obviously I feel he would've been a nice

addition to the Brewers' 25-man (or at the very worst, nice OF depth).

 

My general stance agrees with cwolf -- in my opinion this deal was giving something of value for something that could have been had for free in another few days. I'm not claiming Dickerson is some savior, just that LH hitting players that play CF/OF defense as well as Dickerson are harder to find, and therefore more valuable, than long relief pitchers like Mitre. Obviously it's nice for the Yankees that they can always send him to AAA

if they need or want to, but that's a luxury the Brewers used to

have as well.

 

With all that said, I genuinely hope Mitre comes in this season, pitches really well, and makes people like me feel a-ok about giving up Dickerson for him.

[Oldcity]

If Mitre pitches well this year, it will be the first time in his career. His great last season everyone refers to: 4.69 FIP, 1.88 k/bb, and exactly 0.0 wins above replacement. He's a replacement level pitcher, and those who have been saying dozens of guys like him will be available after roster cuts are exactly right. Trading anything of use for him is a bad trade.

The Brewers must have the worst 3rd-5th outfielders in baseball.

[And That]

If Mitre pitches well this year, it will be the first time in his career.

Mitre had a 2.6 WAR for the Marlins in '07. I don't know how you define well, but that's a pretty decent 3/4 of a season.

 

He was >0 RAR both of the last two seasons, which is more than Dickerson can say.

 

Look, no one is saying Mitre is this great, or even good pitcher. I don't think anyone here seriously thinks he was the bee's knees last season (if they do, well, that's on them). He is a pitcher that will likely be somewhere slightly above replacement level next season, he can pitch junk innings, he provides depth for an already deep bullpen, and he's cheap.

 

I would like to see a list of these "dozens of guys" people keep talking about that we can get for free, who have even Mitre's MLB track record.

 

Dickerson is turning 29 here in a few weeks and has shown both the inability to stay healthy (<600 PA MLB career) and the ability to strike out a lot for what his power is. From watching him, it appears to me that he draws walks more out of guesswork than actual knowledge of the strike zone. He also flat-out can't hit lefties. He's one of those guys that should be really good, and he is defensively, but I think he may well be past his prime with the stick. Maybe the injuries have taken a toll. I dunno.

[Oldcity]

And That wrote:

I would like to see a list of these "dozens of guys" people keep talking about that we can get for free, who have even Mitre's MLB track record.

His MLB track record is replacement level the last few years, or very slightly above. Those guys are everywhere. Marco Estrada may be one of them.

[endaround]

The Yankees just signed Millwood to a minor league contract and he's better than Mitre

[Ennder]

The Brewers must have the worst 3rd-5th outfielders in baseball.

4-6 I agree, Gomez isn't anywhere close to the worst CF in baseball, even if he can't hit.

[And That]

The Yankees just signed Millwood to a minor league contract and he's better than Mitre

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Millwood was not going to sign a $900K contract to be a RP for the Brewers.

[And That]

His MLB track record is replacement level the last few years, or very slightly above. Those guys are everywhere. Marco Estrada may be one of them.

See, that's the thing though. You know what you're likely going to get with Mitre, more or less. All these guys floating around in the theoretical major league replacement level relief pitcher ether, like Marco Estrada, might be replacement level, or they might be terrible. Someone brought up Zack Segovia earlier - he's a guy that looks like he might be good. He also might be terrible. Who knows? I'd rather not waste too much time trying to find out if the Brewers are going to be in contention.

 

I'd also rather not have a a guy like Kintzler trying to eat the junk innings that the Brewers are going to foist on Mitre. Mitre is going to have a crap job, and he'll be mediocre at it, but there's value there.

[Ennder]

Now that we traded for Morgan I really have no issue at all with this, Dickerson would be the teams 5th OF at best now and has even less value for us.

[endaround]

The Yankees just signed Millwood to a minor league contract and he's better than Mitre

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Millwood was not going to sign a $900K contract to be a RP for the Brewers.

I going out on alimb and say he'd take a 25 man spot over a minor league deal at the salary he's getting right now.

[PrinceEatMeat]

I'm back to say that I now love Doug, and love this trade, just like I said I'd do earlier in the thread if we traded for Morgan.

[And That]

The fact that he didn't take a 25 man spot over a MiLB deal - you don't think the Pirates or Nationals would have given him $1.5M? - makes me think that Milwaukee wasn't really an option, unless it was as a SP. We're not operating in a vacuum, where we can just snatch up all of these guys in the theoretical major league replacement level relief pitcher ether.

[gregmag]

Dickerson would have been optioned once Hart returned. Dickerson was vastly overrated by many on this board. Gomez' sterling spring also made Dickerson more expendable. Reed simply beat him out. It's not that complicated. We'll see how it works out but they needed a swing man like Mitre.

 

Mitre is a good pickup. Especially with Parra shut down.

Love the logic here. Dickerson is overrated -- which you just keep on repeating, post after redundant post, without ever considering the facts -- and yet somehow he was good enough to net someone you consider a "nice pickup." I wish I knew how to be right about things as often as you think you are.

 

 

[Oldcity]

The Brewers must have the worst 3rd-5th outfielders in baseball.

4-6 I agree, Gomez isn't anywhere close to the worst CF in baseball, even if he can't hit.

I meant as a collective group 3-5.

You know what you're likely going to get with Mitre, more or less.

The only thing you know with Mitre is that he won't be.... Mike Burns? It's only 2-3 starts. It's not like he's going to be the fifth starter all year long. That wasn't worth giving up a competent major league reserve outfielder for. Even if Melvin says he sees Mitre as a reliever, they have plenty of better RP options than him.

[And That]

I don't think Mitre is going to start at all for the Brewers. It's gonna be Estrada/Rogers. Mitre will be the guy that soaks up the junk innings. As those innings are often distributed very unevenly, I don't want a young reliever pitching those, both for arm health and for development.

 

50-70 junk innings of 4.50ish ERA ball are valuable, especially when they're pitched by a guy that isn't very valuable.

[LouisEly]

If Mitre Marco Estrada pitches well this year, it will be the first time in his career. His great last season everyone refers to: 4.69 FIP, 1.88 k/bb, and exactly 0.0 0.7 wins above below replacement. He's a below replacement level pitcher, and those who have been saying dozens of guys like him will be available after roster cuts are exactly right.

Fixed.

[MJLiverock]

The angst over letting a player like Dickerson go reminds me of another vastly overrated backup outfielder some on this board fell in love wtih, Gabe Gross. The guy was nothing more than a worse hitting Kevin Mench, yet teeth gnashed and it was like we traded a future all star. A few years later and it hasn't mattered a bit and the guy is barely in baseball.

 

I guess it is a good thing that the Brewer's actually have a battle for the 25th spot instead of fielding team full of guys who should the 25th man.

[monty57]

Of course, the year we traded Gabe Gross is the year Hart floundered in the second half and people were wishing we had a LH RF to platoon with Hart. Sometimes it's less about the overall player and more about the talents he brings to the table. Kotsay brings little to the table at this stage of his career. I'm fine with trading Dickerson for Mitre, as we have a lot of OF on the roster and I do see a spot on this team for Mitre, but I would certainly rather have Dickerson on the roster than Kotsay, who apparently is the reason Dickerson was expendable and Boggs was sent packing. I'd be much happier if we made this trade and then kept Boggs over Kotsay, as the ability to switch-hit and have some defensive acumen would be wonderful for the Brewers.

[TooLiveBrew]

Of course, the year we traded Gabe Gross is the year Hart floundered in the second half and people were wishing we had a LH RF to platoon with Hart. Sometimes it's less about the overall player and more about the talents he brings to the table

 

Well said. And MJ, I'd actually thought back on the Gross trade during the Dickerson-Mitre discussion here, too.

[endaround]

Carlos Silva was vastly superior to Mitre last year. It isn't losing Dickerson so much as basically getting guy who is replacement level and costs $1m at the same time.

[DocBrewPack]

Just wondering if i got this right in my head. With Estrada pitching pretty solid, he will be our 5th starter when needed Mitre will be long reliever/SP depth? Then when Grienke comes back Estrada will still be the one to go down to AAA? (or at least is that what is most likely)