Would you want/support an MLS team in Milwaukee?

[RockCoCougars]

No interest in a soccer team. No interest in keeping the Bucks. Quite interested in an NHL team.

Not to bag on you, but I've always found it surprising that most people who like soccer don't like hockey and vice-versa, because to me hockey is basically soccer on ice. For the record, I have no interest whatsoever in either of them.

[paul253]

I subscribe to the Sporting News and they had a nice article about how successful MLS has become in the Pacific Northwest (Seattle, Portland, Vancouver). I can't honestly say I'd go to a bunch of games, but it would be nice to have a team and a stadium in Milwaukee. I wouldn't mind continuing the Miller Park tax for it because 1) it really is a small tax and 2) the money goes directly to where it says it goes, unlike pretty much all other tax money which goes wherever politicians decide to put it. A stadium downtown would be great for Milwaukee and would hopefully spur some other development like Sports bars, retail shops and restaurants. And it doesn't have to be huge. Why not a nice little 20,000 seat stadium? It won't cost nearly as much as a new Arena or Miller Park did. You could also have some High School tournaments there as Wisconsin boasts some darn good High School soccer teams. Maybe even an international exhibition once and awhile? And maybe Milwaukee could work something out with the WIAA to move the State High School tournament there.

 

I have to honest about the MLS though. Their season runs from like March until November. What are they thinking? That's WAY too long. The weather sucks in northern and eastern cities like Chicago, Columbus, Philly, and so on in March and April and it's gotta be killing attendance. Why not just start the league in mid May and run it through September?

 

As far as the Bucks go. I couldn't care less if they moved. The NBA doesn't interest me at all. I wouldn't mind an NHL team to replace them, but I don't see it happening in Milwaukee. Nobody seems to have any interest in buying a team. I think Milwaukee is really separating itself as a baseball town. It could change but I don't see that happening anytime soon.

[patrickgpe]

we are on the verge of loosing a team with established roots in the city that has a following and we want to build a soccer stadium?, lets focus on getting an area under the park east freeway for the bucks, admirals, and marquette instead of messing around with something that i don't think would do well here.

[patrickgpe]

As far as the Bucks go. I couldn't care less if they moved. The NBA doesn't interest me at all.

 

while you may not, and while i am not as big follower of the bucks as i am the brewers and packers, the bucks do bring value to the city. They bring money to hotels and restraunts downtown, they also bring a spotlight to the city. There is something to be said for being a major league town in 2 sports to separate us from other communities with similar populations.

[RockCoCougars]

As far as the Bucks go. I couldn't care less if they moved. The NBA doesn't interest me at all.

 

while you may not, and while i am not as big follower of the bucks as i am the brewers and packers, the bucks do bring value to the city. They bring money to hotels and restraunts downtown, they also bring a spotlight to the city. There is something to be said for being a major league town in 2 sports to separate us from other communities with similar populations.

I agree. The NBA is much bigger than the NHL in America. There is a reason why the Stanley Cup games are on cable with lower ratings than American Pickers. As for the hockey people saying that is due to the fact that hockey isn't as good on TV, that's all fine and dandy- but that's where the big money is at for sports teams. For the record, my friends call me 'anti-hockey guy'.

[trwi7]

because to me hockey is basically soccer on ice.

Except it's basically not.

[Invader3K]

I don't live in Milwaukee, but I would think it's much more sensible to try and keep the Bucks long term than to try to attract an MLS or NHL team (the latter won't happen anyway due to objections from the Chicago Blackhawks).

[trwi7]

Really doubt the Blackhawks would care.

[bani1717]

I don't really care whether or not we'd actually get an MLS team, as I'm not a soccer fan and would only go when they had super awesome promotions (like the $1 beers someone mentioned) or when friends asked me to go, or if the team was in a championship hunt. That being said, I'd be interested to see what else besides the MLS and other soccer games would happen there. With a 20k seat stadium, you'd also have a site for high school football games, which would be kind of cool. Also, this is a far longer shot than even getting and MLS team in the first place, but maybe the Packers would even play a preseason game there to generate extra interest in the stadium. Like I said, a VERY long shot, but the NFL does have a preseason game at a small stadium in Canton, OH every year, so a guy can dream.

[paul253]

we are on the verge of loosing a team with established roots in
the city that has a following and we want to build a soccer stadium?,
lets focus on getting an area under the park east freeway for the bucks,
admirals, and marquette instead of messing around with something that i
don't think would do well here.

Marquette has no problem drawing fans to the very same arena the Bucks say they can't compete in. MU actually drew an average of 174 MORE fans per game than the Bucks last season. Think about that. A team that finished 11th in the Big East averaged more fans than an NBA team that plays in the same arena. Even the Admirals finished in the top third of their league attendance despite competing with the Bucks, Marquette, UWM, the Wave, and to a lesser extend the Packers and Badger basketball and hockey. My point is, I don't think we need to spend $400 million on a new arena when 2/3 of the tenants are drawing fine. The fact is, if the Bucks were winning, there'd be more fans and more money. Having a new arena isn't going to make people like Lebron James want to play in Milwaukee. NBA players want to play in cities where they can go out clubbing and show off their bling. Milwaukee isn't that city.

And just to bring it up again, building a brand new soccer stadium would probably cost half as much as building a new arena and would probably be done with mostly private funds. I think if the Bucks leave the Bradley Center could still survive. They could tear down the U.S. Cellular Arena and move the Wave and UWM to the BC. That would leave the BC with Marquette, UWM, The Admirals, the Wave and the Mustangs.

while you may not, and while i am not as big follower of the bucks as i
am the brewers and packers, the bucks do bring value to the city. They
bring money to hotels and restraunts downtown, they also bring a
spotlight to the city. There is something to be said for being a major
league town in 2 sports to separate us from other communities with
similar populations.


I think the MLS could do the same thing though. You'll have just as many people downtown, maybe more because the Bucks are barely averaging 15,000. Plus, the weather when the MLS team would play would be better than than when the Bucks play. I think in general people are more willing to stick around and eat and sit outside or just walk around downtown in the spring and summer when the MLS team plays than the late fall and winter when the Bucks play. And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I WANT the Bucks to leave. I just don't want spend $400 million on a new arena so we can watch the same crappy Bucks team who can't attract quality free agents when we could spend $150 million and bring a new team to Milwaukee in soccer. Plus the stadium would open up so many other possibilities like I mentioned like HS soccer, international soccer and someone else mentioned HS football too. Plus....and you never know....it would give Marquette or UWM a place to play should they ever decide to start up football again. I've heard one of the things preventing MU from doing this is not having anywhere to play.

[trwi7]

we are on the verge of loosing a team with established roots in the city that has a following

The Bucks have a following? This isn't the 1970s and 80s.

[RockCoCougars]

we are on the verge of loosing a team with established roots in the city that has a following

The Bucks have a following? This isn't the 1970s and 80s.

That was the argument people used when Miller Park was getting fought over. I hope that Kohl focuses his energies on getting something done. It would be the ultimate irony if the Bucks left because they couldn't get a new building when their owner contributed (I think) $50 million to build the same type of facility an hour away.

[patrickgpe]

we are on the verge of loosing a team with established roots in the city that has a following

The Bucks have a following? This isn't the 1970s and 80s.

That was the argument people used when Miller Park was getting fought over. I hope that Kohl focuses his energies on getting something done. It would be the ultimate irony if the Bucks left because they couldn't get a new building when their owner contributed (I think) $50 million to build the same type of facility an hour away.

I didn't say a brewer sized following but there is one, its not like the admirals that has about 1000 solid fans and the wave who have about 500. I know there aren't many bucks fans on this board, but I think most people that care about the city of milwaukee, like myself, believe that having the bucks is a good thing and that having a new arena would help the image of the city.

[patrickgpe]

also those who want an MLS team only need to look at how few people went to Milwaukee Rampage and Wave United games. I know the facilities were not great but the MLS was not formed yet and it was the top soccer league in the US and Canada. I would think that if MLS would survive here they should have atleast drew 1000 a game.

[RockCoCougars]

The Bucks have a following? This isn't the 1970s and 80s.

That was the argument people used when Miller Park was getting fought over. I hope that Kohl focuses his energies on getting something done. It would be the ultimate irony if the Bucks left because they couldn't get a new building when their owner contributed (I think) $50 million to build the same type of facility an hour away.

I didn't say a brewer sized following but there is one, its not like the admirals that has about 1000 solid fans and the wave who have about 500. I know there aren't many bucks fans on this board, but I think most people that care about the city of milwaukee, like myself, believe that having the bucks is a good thing and that having a new arena would help the image of the city.

I agree with you. All it would take is a deep run in the playoffs for the bandwagon to fill up again- easier said than done, I know. The issue with a basketball arena is that it's not really a destination like a new baseball stadium would be- I don't know if attendance would increase even slightly just with the new facility. The need for a new facility in this case is 100% money, which is going to make things pretty difficult.

[trwi7]

It's going to take more than one deep playoff run. Kohl has sucked as an owner for 25 years and we've already had one fluke good season with a deep playoff run. Fans aren't going to be fooled by that again.

[paul253]

That was the argument people used when Miller Park was getting fought over.

 

Another thing to consider though is that weather was also a huge issue in attendance at County Stadium. You can't expect people to sit through games when it is 45 degrees or rainy out. That's not an excuse for the Bucks. They haven't even been in the top half of league attendance in 7 years. A new arena would help but unless they get better the attendance will go right back down.

also those who want an MLS team only need to look at how few people went

to Milwaukee Rampage and Wave United games. I know the facilities were

not great but the MLS was not formed yet and it was the top soccer

league in the US and Canada. I would think that if MLS would survive

here they should have atleast drew 1000 a game.

 

I think that's a bad comparison. Soccer in the USA really got going after the 1994 World Cup and has been getting more popular since. Saying that since a second divison team who played in a terrible "stadium" couldn't draw fans so neither could a professional team in a state of the art stadium is like comparing apples to oranges I think. That's like saying Milwaukee wouldn't support an NHL team because we only draw 5,700 fans for the Admirals. And not to be technical but MLS formed in 1993 and the Rampage played all the way until 2002. The Wave United only played two seasons I think in 2003 and 2004.

[homer]

It's going to take more than one deep playoff run. Kohl has sucked as an owner for 25 years and we've already had one fluke good season with a deep playoff run. Fans aren't going to be fooled by that again.

How is that different from the Brewers situation under Selig?

[trwi7]

How is that different from the Brewers situation under Selig?

1. It took a state senator changing his mind for Miller Park to be approved.

 

2. This is more of a baseball state than basketball state imo.

 

 

 

 

 

[patrickgpe]

That was the argument people used when Miller Park was getting fought over.

 

Another thing to consider though is that weather was also a huge issue in attendance at County Stadium. You can't expect people to sit through games when it is 45 degrees or rainy out. That's not an excuse for the Bucks. They haven't even been in the top half of league attendance in 7 years. A new arena would help but unless they get better the attendance will go right back down.

also those who want an MLS team only need to look at how few people went

to Milwaukee Rampage and Wave United games. I know the facilities were

not great but the MLS was not formed yet and it was the top soccer

league in the US and Canada. I would think that if MLS would survive

here they should have atleast drew 1000 a game.

 

I think that's a bad comparison. Soccer in the USA really got going after the 1994 World Cup and has been getting more popular since. Saying that since a second divison team who played in a terrible "stadium" couldn't draw fans so neither could a professional team in a state of the art stadium is like comparing apples to oranges I think. That's like saying Milwaukee wouldn't support an NHL team because we only draw 5,700 fans for the Admirals. And not to be technical but MLS formed in 1993 and the Rampage played all the way until 2002. The Wave United only played two seasons I think in 2003 and 2004.

i think an NHL team would survive because there is a hockey following in the city. Also obviously more people would go to NHL games than toe AHL games since the level of competition is better. I don't see any evidence that there is anything but a minimal following of soccer in Milwaukee.

 

Also thats not my main point. I think we should focus on taking care of the teams that are established here instead of adding more facilities and franchises to an already tapped out market IMO.

[GAME05]

i remember Milwaukee had the option of getting an NHL team before Anaheim and Florida got theirs, but we turned it down. it would have meant disbanding the Admirals. first the NHL had their strike and how the Recession, and maybe Milwaukee made the right decision on that. plus it doesn't seem to me that having an NHL team is a great pull to draw convention-goers and big businesses into the city. an NBA team, though, that has a lot more cache. but for the limited amount of games that the MLS plays and the modest ticket prices, i could see that being a benefit to helping Milwaukee end any beer-drinking/blue-collar reputations the city has and add a more cultured touch.

 

is Milwaukee necessarily a tapped-out city, though? we've shown we'll support winning teams, so if our MLS team did well, i think people will start showing up. i doubt a bandwagon necessarily has to hitch to a popular sport.

[patrickgpe]

is Milwaukee necessarily a tapped-out city, though? we've shown we'll support winning teams, so if our MLS team did well, i think people will start showing up. i doubt a bandwagon necessarily has to hitch to a popular sport

 

yes, remember we are only a metroplotian ciity of 1n Million, much smaller than most major league markets, off of the top of my head we need to support the following (i'm including the arts because the money has to come from somewhere, corporations are the ones that buys luxury boxes for sports team, sponsor sports as well as donate to the arts, they can only give so much especially in a recession and has milwaukee has lost a couple in the past few years

 

Brewers

Bucks

Admirals

Wave

Mustangs

Marquette

UW-Milwaukee

 

Performing arts center

Milwaukee Ballet

Milwaukee Symphony

Milwaukee Pops

*i'm not exactly tapped into the arts community but these are the ones i can think of.

 

Venues that hold concerts regularly

Tuner Hall

Pabst Theater

Riverside Theater

Milwaukee Theater

Bradley Center

US Cellular arena

Shank Hall

 

i think thats just the major ones, we do have smaller theaters plus many bars like Linneman's that has shows just about every weekend for a small cover.

 

I don't think cities the size of Milwaukee can say they have that many theaters. My point is that if Miller Coors is expected to sponsor a MLS team the money has to come out of what they give the brewers, the PAC, or whatever.

[RyDogg66]

it doesn't seem to me that having an NHL team is a great pull to draw convention-goers and big businesses into the city. an NBA team, though, that has a lot more cache.

I disagree about this. If you are talking convention-goes and big business presumably you are talking the most casual of casual fans and nothing, I mean nothing, plays better in person than NHL Hockey. It would be HUGE with those types of people. Do you think Sarah from Accounting wants to watch a bunch of overly-tattooed and corn-rowed basketball players slack off for 3 1/2 quarters from the luxury boxes? Or watch some fast paced, hard hitting hockey?

[DHonks]

RyDogg, I've argued this before, but in Wisconsin people are likely to say their favorite hoops team is the Badgers or Marquette (or even UWM). The Bucks are basically inferior (in terms of entertainment value) to the products people can support in UW and MU.

 

You also nailed it that Hockey is much more entertaining for non-fans than the NBA, although both are equally over-priced.

 

As for the MLS, Milwaukee is a huge soccer market, but I don't know if they'd pay to go watch pro soccer. The wave has a nice niche , but I'm afraid that an MLS entrant would struggle in Milwaukee.

[homer]

it doesn't seem to me that having an NHL team is a great pull to draw convention-goers and big businesses into the city. an NBA team, though, that has a lot more cache.

I disagree about this. If you are talking convention-goes and big business presumably you are talking the most casual of casual fans and nothing, I mean nothing, plays better in person than NHL Hockey. It would be HUGE with those types of people. Do you think Sarah from Accounting wants to watch a bunch of overly-tattooed and corn-rowed basketball players slack off for 3 1/2 quarters from the luxury boxes? Or watch some fast paced, hard hitting hockey?

But Sarah from Accounting has probably heard of Lebron James and Kobe Bryant. She probably has no clue who Ovechkin or Luongo are.