Brewers Willing To Trade Lorenzo Cain; Braves Among the Interested

[Hate those Rodents]

I agree that's how it probably went down Pingman. From those two counter offers, which ever side offers the much better sweetener (us adding to the deal including Gomez or the Braves adding to a Cain deal involving Beachy) gets it done. More than likely, both teams have passed on this type of deal altogether and we'll just have to wait and see which side regrets not making a deal work more.

[Warning Track Power]

Without doing all the research I would do Gomez and Jeffress for Beachy.

 

While its obvious why I would be down on Gomez, I truly fear Jeffress will have another marijuana recurrence and we will lose him forever(?) as a prospect. I just don't trust guys who already know they are being tested in a drug program and relapse. May be harsh and stupid to deal his talent but I offer him for the equivalent Beachy only because the ATL assumes the drug risk.

[Hate those Rodents]

If you want to trade Jeffress, don't do it for Beachy. I would think Cain and Jeffress would get Minor for certain. But Jeffress should only be dealt in a deal for a Greinke/Garza type that is more MLB proven. Like I said, the Braves would probably accept Cain and Jeffress for Minor.

 

ETA: I wonder how bad Atlanta wants to shed Kawakami's salary? At a time when we are arguing over the lesser of the two evils of Blanton and Pavano, is Kawakami really much worse than those two when you consider we could maybe get Beachy as a throw in? I'll pay all of Kawakami to get a trade of Kawakami/Beachy for Gomez over trading for Blanton or signing Pavano eight days out of the week.

[PeaveyFury]

I guess I don't get why the Brewers wouldn't want Beachy then?

 

I think the general rule with Braves pitching prospects is that when they want to trade a particular guy, turn it down and ask for somebody else. The guys they usually are willing to give up usually end up sucking.

[Tedaldtada]

Jeffress cannot be suspended for marijuana as now he is on the 40 man roster.

[colbyjack]

I think it's more of a why would we move Cain? I don't think we are making Cain available just to get pitching. Its just that he's not untouchable in a really good offer.

 

We have other avenues yet available to add pitching. Why take the one right now that creates a glaring hole in CF?

 

Good assessment, as I don't really understand why a few people, at least what it seems to me, are getting so bent out of shape about the Braves eighth-best prospect. I like Beachy's upside as well, but I also really like Lorenzo Cain's. And no way do I trade both Cain and Jeffress for Beachy or Minor. That sounds painfully desperate and unnecessary to me, and I think some people are under-valuing some of the Brewers talent.

 

If nothing else I learned how much Atlanta's system has rebounded with pitching. Forget Beachy and Minor, gimme Randall Delgado.

[paul253]

And no way do I trade both Cain and Jeffress for Beachy or Minor.

 

Colby would you trade Cain and Jeffress for Beachy and Minor?

[Hate those Rodents]

And no way do I trade both Cain and Jeffress for Beachy or Minor.

 

Colby would you trade Cain and Jeffress for Beachy and Minor?

 

I was thinking that may be an option if we ate all of Kawakami's salary. Maybe we throw them Parra, who they may have some interest in. That three for three trade would really be nice.

[colbyjack]

Colby would you trade Cain and Jeffress for Beachy and Minor?

 

Yes, I would pull the trigger on that trade fairly quick.

 

But no thanks to Kawakami. And Parra still has value to the team, I wouldn't sell low on him just because he hasn't come close to living up to his potential. Jorge de la Rosa is proof that Melvin might be on to something about lefties blooming late.

[Hate those Rodents]

But no thanks to Kawakami. And Parra still has value to the team, I wouldn't sell low on him just because he hasn't come close to living up to his potential. Jorge de la Rosa is proof that Melvin might be on to something about lefties blooming late.

While I agree to the end of your reasoning, I am not sure we can turn that down. Two probably good young starters that are either 2/3's or 3/4's for six years as well as a year of a guy that could be a good fill-in starter for a year trumps a possible starting CF for six years, a closer type reliever, and a high upside lefty that hasn't yet figured it out for three years. Doug would have to pull the trigger on that prospective trade.

 

 

[TooLiveBrew]

a closer type reliever

 

Colby, I apologize if you've answered this before on BF, but are you ready to limit Jeffress's projection to a reliever? Just seems like one of those prospect labels that got thrown around by a lot of 'prospect experts' this season once JJ made the switch... which as best I've seen & heard, was a temporary move for the '10 season.

[Hate those Rodents]

That was me TLB. I'm not ready to call that his ceiling. He maybe can be a starter.

 

In my opinion

 

Minor > Cain

Beachy = Jeffress

Kawakami < Parra

 

All in all, I think when you consider the need for starting pitching, we have to make this deal. No that it's even being talked about though...

[colbyjack]

While I agree to the end of your reasoning, I am not sure we can turn that down. Two probably good young starters that are either 2/3's or 3/4's for six years as well as a year of a guy that could be a good fill-in starter for a year trumps a possible starting CF for six years, a closer type reliever, and a high upside lefty that hasn't yet figured it out for three years. Doug would have to pull the trigger on that prospective trade.

 

But the prospective trade was Cain/Jeffress for Beachy/Minor. I'm not sure why you lumped Kawakami into that mix, tossing Parra into it as well. Sorry, of all of the starters that have been tossed out for discussion in recent weeks, Kawakami has the most "Suppan" to him of any of them. I'm not so sure I would pull the trigger on that one, as he significantly lessens that trade. And why would you want Kawakami if you could get Beachy and Minor for Jeffress and Cain? I'm not saying you could, but that was paul253's original question.

 

TLB, re-check the quote you grabbed. That didn't come from me.

[TooLiveBrew]

Sorry guys, I should have been more clear -- I realized that was HTR who said it, but I'd really like to hear Patrick's take on the Jeffress RP/SP discussion, if he wants to give it.

[endaround]

Sorry guys, I should have been more clear -- I realized that was HTR who said it, but I'd really like to hear Patrick's take on the Jeffress RP/SP discussion, if he wants to give it.

I'll give you mine even if you didn't ask for it. Until he shows he can start I think he'll be valued as a reliever by other teams. He is still young enough to go back to starting without it being a big deal but while he's projected to be in Milwaukee next year as a reliever he'll be lucky to come up midseason 2012 as a starter.

[colbyjack]

You put Jeffress at Nashville to open the 2011 season as a starter. Reports out of Arizona noted that he struggled as much as he did because he was working on his changeup. I think that indicates the Brewers intend (as they should) to return him to a starting role to at least open next year.

 

I still see him being incredibly similar to Edison Volquez, and hopefully Jeffress can learn to be more consistent (and healthy). Even if he doesn't pan out as a starter he has very good value. Pitchers that can throw 100 mph don't grow on trees.

[Tedaldtada]

Sorry guys, I should have been more clear -- I realized that was HTR who said it, but I'd really like to hear Patrick's take on the Jeffress RP/SP discussion, if he wants to give it.

I'll give you mine even if you didn't ask for it. Until he shows he can start I think he'll be valued as a reliever by other teams. He is still young enough to go back to starting without it being a big deal but while he's projected to be in Milwaukee next year as a reliever he'll be lucky to come up midseason 2012 as a starter.

Maybe that is how other teams value him. How do you value him? Do you see him as a starter?

[pingman]

1) I'd keep Jeffress ....gotta build the staff around young (cheap) power arms... wish the organization would commit to him as a starter but what do I know

 

2) Braves.... Teheran, Freeman, Delgado, Minor & Vizcaino were all rated by Baseball America in their last midseason top 50 list....and Frank Wren has been quoted as saying he wants to build around those cats, not trade them (unless someone blows him away with an oppportunity to get a Braun type of bat) ....the next name on their list is Beachy and IMHO that's why his name came up

 

3) Kawakami..... Wren said his needs are CF, a 2B/SS utility man, and moving Kawakami's contract..... rumored to be currently negotiating with the Pirates for Kawakami.... could be had for $2mm to $3mm net with the Braves picking up the balance ....he'd be a steal if he returns to his 2009 form, and there's no reason he shouldn't.... I've always liked him; his pitching style reminded me of Nomo

[endaround]

Sorry guys, I should have been more clear -- I realized that was HTR who said it, but I'd really like to hear Patrick's take on the Jeffress RP/SP discussion, if he wants to give it.

I'll give you mine even if you didn't ask for it. Until he shows he can start I think he'll be valued as a reliever by other teams. He is still young enough to go back to starting without it being a big deal but while he's projected to be in Milwaukee next year as a reliever he'll be lucky to come up midseason 2012 as a starter.

Maybe that is how other teams value him. How do you value him? Do you see him as a starter?

I think he should definitely start. And all indications are the Brewers are going to have him start.

[sveumrules]

If the Brewers do indeed intend to compete in 2011 I think they'll start Jeffress in the AAA rotation for a few months and then call him up to the big league bullpen sometime after the All Star break. As for how he's viewed by other teams I think it ultimately depends on that teams 2011 intentions. An organization like TB or ATL would probably view him as a reliever while KC might be more inclined to try him as a starter.