Brewers Willing To Trade Lorenzo Cain; Braves Among the Interested

[And That]

According to Cot's, Garza was a Super 2 last year (which is why he was arbitration eligible) and would have finished 2010 with under 4 years of service. That means he'd be under team control through 2013.

[NievesNoNO]

According to Cot's, Garza was a Super 2 last year (which is why he was arbitration eligible) and would have finished 2010 with under 4 years of service. That means he'd be under team control through 2013.

Ahh, thanks. I would be fine with Jeffress and Cain then. However, I think the Rays might not be a match. Do they really need and OF? They still have Jennings, Upton and Zorbist.

 

 

[strawbossisevil]

Cain>Jennings. Compare their AAA/MLB numbers from last season. Also Zobrist has the athletic ability to be moved to another position, if needed.

[chadomac]

I don't know the Rays roster well enough, so maybe they don't even need or want Cain, but if they do... an added incentive is that we are just the type of team that can afford to take on Garza's increasing contract right now. No long term risk, either, if they wanted to just pay him year by year the next two seasons.

[Nader Raider Tim]

I don't see how Tampa Bay would want Lorenzo Cain, or I guess I should say I can't see how Tampa would want to give up a player like Garza for Cain +. They do have a hole in the OF but they also have a pretty darn amazing potential replacement in Desmond Jennings. You might be able to try and do a mega deal with Prince and Cain going to Tampa and Garza and BJ Upton going to Milwaukee. That honestly is a deal that I think might make a ton of sense for both teams. From the Brewers perspective they are getting a great pitcher and a CFer with tremendous potential. From the Rays perspective they loose a tremendous player in Garza but do so with an amazing fallback plan Hellickson. They also shed the payroll of Upton and end up getting an OFer to replace him. The Rays OF would still be pretty sexy with a Zobrist, Jennings, Cain starting lineup with Matt Joyce in there too.

 

Dealing with Tampa is tough because they don't have the money to spend that other clubs do. I don't know what Garza and Upton are going to make this year. My guess is it is going to be around the, combined, 14 million mark or so. That won't be to far off of what Fielder would get. (I know he will get more than that but no more than 16 to 18) With all this being said I am not a huge Upton fan but his upside is just amazing and he is a better option than Gomez / Dickerson / FA. Plus it's mostly about getting another controllable Garza type pitcher.

 

Brewer trade - Fielder and Cain

Tampa trade - Garza and Upton

 

 

The other deal that I thinks makes a ton of sense for both teams is with the Marlins. Right now it looks like the Marlins could use a CF, unless they want to play Coghlan there and Wes Helms at 3rd. So a deal based around Lorenzo Cain for Ricky Nolasco might be a nice deal for both sides. I know Cain isn't enough to get Nolasco but an offer of something like Cain, Parra and Rivas should be ballpark i think. The Marlins shed some payroll and fill a need in CF, get an upside arm they can slot at the back of there rotation or in the BP, and a near ready lower ceiling arm to offer a bit more flexability for another cash strapped club. The Brewers lose their starting CFer but get another really sexy pitcher in return. Parra and Rivas are both guys that I am not going to be heartbroken to see leave but do both still have some value.

 

Brewers trade - Lorenzo Cain, Manny Parra and Amaury Rivas

Marlins trade - Ricky Nolasco (see if they will throw in Emiliano Bonifacio)

 

 

I do think both of those trades are win win for both teams. The one with the Rays might not work depending on if the Rays want to try and "go for it" again next season or try and do a 1 year rebuild before going for it again.

[NievesNoNO]

The more I think about Garza the more I want him in a Milwaukee uni next season. I probably shouldn't get my hopes up though, maybe the Brewerfan.net faithful can force a trade if we keep discussing it http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif. If that doesn't work out, what do people think about Cain for Mike Minor (Braves)? Not sure if that's an upgrade for this season as Minor is largely unproven, however I like that he was able to maintain his K ratio in limited work in the big leagues.

[strawbossisevil]

Adding to the idea that the Rays aren't content with Jennings in left:

 

From NBC Sports:

"He’s [Jennings] undoubtedly in the long-term plans of the organization, but Mooney writes that Friedman has “left field” written on his to-do list as he heads to the winter meetings next week."

[Nader Raider Tim]

I don't see how the Rays would find Cain to be an upgrade over Jennings though. I've read the same things about the Rays and should have addressed it but I view that as the Rays wanting to bring in a proven veteran to make Jennings compete for playing time with. Someone that will act as a placeholder for their young star in the making. Johnny Damon on a 1 year deal would probably the ideal player they would like to sign. More realistic options of what I think they are looking for are Scott Podsednik or Xavier Nady.

 

So I guess what I am saying is that I don't think the Rays view Jennings as a sure fire starter on what they think can be a World Series team. I also doubt that they would think that Cain is a surefire starter on a World Series team.

[HiAndTight]

Agreed on not wanting Crawford, he'll be too pricey. But Tampa seems to be interested in cutting costs and Garza would seem like a perfect candidate to be traded by them.

 

Add on top of the fact that they just lost Crawford, and Cain is a player with a similar skill set (steals, high average, defense etc). It seems like a good match. We might have to add another significant player to the deal (perhaps Gamel...1B option now that Tampa has lost Peña), but I think the needs line up for a Cain for Garza trade.

 

Our rotation would be exceptional with the addition of Garza. And if we can get extensions for both Garza and Marcum, extending them a year or two into their FA years, it would be even more awesome as it would allow us to add our top pitching prospects (Rogers, Odorrizi etc.) without a great deal of pressure being placed on them to carry the team.

I'd gladly throw Hart to Tampa, even taking on a few million in salary for Garza.

 

They want to cut costs, but I think that's more with regard to Garza and Shields as they've got a plethora of starting pitching. They don't want to hit the later arby years with pitchers who are not their best couple.

 

He doesn't replace Crawford, but he doesn't cost 25 million a year either.....

[strawbossisevil]

Look at their stats, Cain put up far better numbers than Jennings at both the AAA level, and the MLB level.

 

Jennings slugged below .400 last year at AAA. There is reason for the Ray's apprehension to hand him the starting LF spot, he hasn't been very good over the past year. Starting Jennings in LF next year would be the equivalent of starting Alcides Escobar in LF.

 

Cain has at least shown the ability to hit at AAA and, in a small sample, in the Majors.

[ELCABALLO45]

Jennings has a career MILB OBP of .384. That is a ton better then Escobar ever had.

 

Also, I understand this is a Brewer board but I am willing to bet 25 out of 30 GM's would rather have Jennings over Cain.

[Mass Haas]

Braves showing interest in Cain

[Bnowell4evr]

According to this article the Rays are looking to trade Garza, Bartlett and Upton because they're reaching arbitration. They need help at 1st, DH, OF and massive help rebuilding their bullpen.

 

I actually think we match up great with a deal for Garza centered around Cain, Gamel and McClendon. They could put Cain and Jennings in LF and CF and use Upton to acquire a closer.

[JoeHova]

You could do worse than a Dickerson/Gomez platoon...

Yup. You could, for example, give Gomez the job by himself like the Brewers did last season.

[Warning Track Power]

I actually think we match up great with a deal for Garza centered around Cain, Gamel and McClendon. They could put Cain and Jennings in LF and CF and use Upton to acquire a closer.

 

If this trade of Cain+ for Garza were to go down, I would immediately change my demands on Fielder to a bat. With Gallardo, Marcum and Garza at the front of the rotation for the next 2+ years, the Brewers would theoretically be set at pitching in the short term but now have a glaring weakness in the OF. Dickerson and Gomez are career backups, not starters. If in fact, the Loney whispers are true, the Dodgers would be the team I would be targeting and Matt Kemp has fallen out of favor with the team and may be available. But in my perfect dream world the following plays out before the 2011 season begins:

 

-Marcum is acquired for Lawrie

-Weeks signs extension

-Garza is acquired for Cain+

-Loney is traded by the Dodgers

-Fielder is dealt straight up for Matt Kemp. The Dodgers may do this because of the need to replace Loney and with Fielder being the dynamic power threat their lineup is missing. Kemp is an ideal fit for the Brewers who now would lack a CF and the Brewers could shift Hart/Braun/Gamel to 1B. I think Kemp for Fielder straight up is a win for both teams.

 

If all this were to go down...WOW:

 

Weeks

Kemp

Braun

Hart

McGehee

Gamel

Lucroy

Escobar

 

Gallardo

Garza

Marcum

Wolf

Capuano/Narveson

 

A guy can dream right? The best thing about this dream is that I don't think it is all that far fetched either.

[jjkoestler]

I really like this idea, but instead of moving Braun/Hart/Gamel to 1B I'd sign Derrick Lee.

[Weirdos19]

My 2 cents is that the Brewers feel they need to get less right handed, especially if Prince is dealt.

 

I could see a flyer on Ankiel. A power left handed stick off the bench is necessary.

[TooLiveBrew]

Also, I understand this is a Brewer board but I am willing to bet 25 out of 30 GM's would rather have Jennings over Cain.

 

Yeah, Jennings is regarded as a better prospect, league-wide. Jennings produced better than Cain in their age-22 seasons at AA. Cain performed a bit better at AAA last season, but was a year older than Jennings & at the same level. If I were a betting man, I'd be betting on Jennings exceeding Cain's age-24 production at AAA in his own age-24 season this year.

 

And I think Doug Melvin has totally uncovered the next market inefficiency: player origin. Before you know it, Corey Hart will be with the Reds, Ryan Braun with the Dodgers, Rickie Weeks with the Rays, Carlos Gomez with the Cibao Eagles, and the Brewers will be in the World Series!

[Weirdos19]

Would a Cain/Odorizzi/Jeffress combo land Grienke and a lefty stick?

[nate82]

When I first read about this rumor the Braves came straight to my mind. They are in an obvious need of a CF type of a player.

 

The Rays may work but I would have to believe they would want to dump Upton along with Garza on the Brewers along with a better prospect to go along with Cain maybe even Gamel would fit that mold as he could become the teams 1B or DH. I think that would be a rather hefty price for Upton and Garza I am not sure I would do that trade though. Maybe if it was McGehee and Cain for Upton and Garza but that would probably be not enough maybe Shields and Upton would work better.

[Invader3K]

Would a Cain/Odorizzi/Jeffress combo land Grienke and a lefty stick?

If they'd be willing to include Alex Gordon with Greinke, I'd consider it.

I really think the better option would be exploring a trade like Garza from the Rays, or someone from the Braves (Mike Minor? Jair Jurrjens?). I think we'd have to give up less.

 

[TooLiveBrew]

I don't want to be rude, but Cain/Odorizzi/Jeffress most likely wouldn't net Greinke, let alone tacking on Gordon.

[Invader3K]

I don't want to be rude, but Cain/Odorizzi/Jeffress most likely wouldn't net Greinke, let alone tacking on Gordon.

You are probably right. I am somewhat biased because I would rather not trade Odorizzi if at all possible.

[GoudaBrew]

The Rays may work but I would have to believe they would want to dump Upton along with Garza on the Brewers along with a better prospect to go along with Cain maybe even Gamel would fit that mold as he could become the teams 1B or DH.

Why so down on Upton? He isn't over priced, has boatloads of potential, plays above average CF defense, and if we acquired him with with Garza we'd be instantly filling one hole without creating another one. I know he's under-acheived for two years now, but he's still a 3-4 WAR player with potential for more. He definitely has some attitude problems, but maybe a change of scenery will be good for him. He also would be great in Roenicke's "run often" philosophy. Plus I'd love to see him at the top of the order so Weeks can hit lower in the lineup.

 

I would do a Cain/Gamel for Garza/Upton swap. No idea how this would look to the Rays though (probably would look light).

[nate82]

Why so down on Upton? He isn't over priced, has boatloads of potential, plays above average CF defense, and if we acquired him with with Garza we'd be instantly filling one hole without creating another one. I know he's under-acheived for two years now, but he's still a 3-4 WAR player with potential for more. He definitely has some attitude problems, but maybe a change of scenery will be good for him. He also would be great in Roenicke's "run often" philosophy. Plus I'd love to see him at the top of the order so Weeks can hit lower in the lineup.

 

I would do a Cain/Gamel for Garza/Upton swap. No idea how this would look to the Rays though (probably would look light).

Why so down? Because Upton will be making around $5-7m this year that is why. Plus Cain is going to cost less for the Rays to play him and get about the same production as they would for Upton who is going to cost them about $5-7m. I believe a Shields and Upton for Cain and McGehee would be a fair trade for both teams. It relieves the Rays of some salary while getting the same amount of production back and then some it also fills some holes that the Rays would have to fill through either free agency or through another trade. The Rays would only have to sign someone like Lee to fill in at 1B or DH depending on where they would put McGehee.