Brewers acquire Shaun Marcum for Brett Lawrie 1 for 1; 3/24/12 -- Jayson Stark article

[kramnoj]

Lawrie for Marcum is probably as fair a trade as could be made. The Brewers are dealing from depth, and one very good prospect for a good pitcher with 2 years control is reasonable. I'm sure there are going to be plenty of Blue Jay fans that aren't going to be happy about trading away a good pitcher for a prospect that has questions about his defensive value.

 

I don't like losing Lawrie, but this should improve the team for the next two years.

 

The Brewers were in a fairly tough position. They have enough good players and a fanbase that wants to come to the ballpark that there is pressure to keep the team decent. The future of the Brewers may be better off by selling off players and building for 2013, or whenever, but it's tough to tell the fans that bought millions of tickets in recent years that the Brewers don't plan on being competitive for a couple of years.

[Crew2323]

Well that would look absolutely awful for Doug.

How so? Chances are the Brewers didn't have the combination of players that the Royals would want. It doesn't mean that the Royals didn't like Lawrie, they probably didn't like who would have come with him from the Brewers. The Jays, however, likely have some higher profile pitching prospects to go along with Lawrie that the Royals would want. That's not an indictment on Lawrie; or Melvin for that matter. It's simply a matter of what additional players the Royals would want.

[logan82]

I guess the real question is this a move made so Melvin can look better over the next 2 years or is this a good move for the long term heath of the franchise?

[chadomac]

It's tough to lose Lawrie but this is what you have to give up to get a solid #2 like Marcum. If we could just add one more starter that is as good or better than Randy Wolf.... we would absolutely compete next year. Especially if we didn't have to lose Prince to acquire that pitcher.

[sveumrules]

If we were going to trade Lawrie I would've preferred to get a guy back like Garza or Billingsley. Guys in about the same position service time/results wise as Marcum but with better stuff, less injury history. Apparently they weren't available.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like Marcum as a pitcher for the most part. He has gotten good results in the toughest division in baseball. It seems like he can swing it a little bit. He's already had his surgery. His change up was devastating and amongst the best pitches in baseball last year. Guys with good change ups and blah fastballs have to be on top of their game at all times, though. Just ask James Shields.

[BrewCrewForever]

This trade has me even more excited to watch MLB Network Hot Stove tomorrow night.

[Ennder]

Well if it is Lawrie maybe the deal has other players on both sides. Not going to judge this until we have real details instead of 'my sources say'.

[Gobias Industries]

I guess the real question is this a move made so Melvin can look better over the next 2 years or is this a good move for the long term heath of the franchise?

If we win in the 70s again he's probably gone. I think the answer is pretty simple.

[hawing]

I'm glad for brewerfan.net and the internets, because there is almost no chance the Madison media will have room for this story amid all the football (although admittedly the Rose Bowl is one of the better reasons to push baseball off the radar).

[kramnoj]

I don't neccessarily see this as Melvin trying to save himself. I'd be fairly surprised if this didn't have Attanasio's approval (at the very least a heads-up before it went through). Attanasio wants the Brewers to win right now every bit as much as Mevlin does, and this move improves the chance of that happening in the immediate future.

[NievesNoNO]

I like this deal alot. Marcum is instantly at least our 2nd best pitcher and might be out best. There's obviously a risk involved with the previous arm injury, but I wouldn't say there's any more risk with him than any other pitcher. I do think that this means the Jays acquire Grienke though. There's no way they gave up their best starter without another deal in place.... IMO.

 

Got to give to get.

[sveumrules]

I guess this also means no more posts from Clancy about moving Lawrie to SS.

[Mr QL]

This guy better be good that's all I gotta say if we're selling the house for him. If we were going to give all that up, I would of rather got Greinke.

[crewcrazy]

People are free to dislike Marcum if they wish, but I don't quite understand the "he doesn't have good enough stuff" argument. There's certainly nothing wrong with his strikeout and walk numbers compared to some other names that are constantly brought up:

 

Shaun Marcum

2010: 7.60 K/9, 1.98 BB/9

Career: 7.28 K/9, 2.80 BB/9

 

Zack Greinke:

2010: 7.40 K/9, 2.25 BB/9

Career: 7.56 K/9, 2.25 BB/9

 

Matt Garza

2010: 6.60 K/9, 2.77 BB/9

Career: 7.10 K/9, 3.18 BB/9

 

I think this also says a bit about just how much not having a real position affects Lawrie's value, and that's before you even get into the character issues. Jim Callis of Baseball America seems to think it's fair, and they've been fairly complimentary of Lawrie in terms of where they've ranked him.

[PeaveyFury]

But our prospects always pan out. We could have just traded the next Dave Krynzel or Matt LaPorta.

 

This. Aside from Nelson Cruz, we have yet to really be haunted by a prospect this organization has moved.

 

If we were going to give all that up, I would of rather got Greinke.

 

Lawrie straight up wouldn't have gotten Greinke.

 

There's lots of talk about 'only 2 years' of Marcum. Why is everyone convinced that he's going to bolt when he's a free agent? I think it's at least reasonable to assume that the team will make some effort to keep him if he continues to pitch well.

[Gobias Industries]

I like Marcum's results. Hate his mechanics. This is Anthony Reyes-esque.

 

http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/baseball/pitching/Images/Pitchers/ShaunMarcum/ShaunMarcum_2006_001.jpg

[jjfanec]

This guy better be good that's all I gotta say if we're selling the house for him. If we were going to give all that up, I would of rather got Greinke.

Selling the house? Lawrie is not that cant miss of a prospect. This is not Jason Heyward. Lawrie is our best prospect but he has some red flags - fielding ability, attitude, etc. Of course we would rather have Greinke but Greinke would have cost a top pitching prospect as well.

 

Marcum's lack of fastball velocity seems to be clouding some people's view of him. His numbers, in a much tougher division than Greinke, are very, very good.

[dlk9s]

Do I see an inverted W?

[sbrylski]

Do I see an inverted W?

Oof.

[jjfanec]

But our prospects always pan out. We could have just traded the next Dave Krynzel or Matt LaPorta.

 

This. Aside from Nelson Cruz, we have yet to really be haunted by a prospect this organization has moved.

Not to mention we (and the rest of the league) could have gotten Cruz back in 2008 after he got DFA'ed by Texas.

[chuit11]

I totally see Reyes as well in that picture. Yikes!

[jjkoestler]

Do I see an inverted W?

It appears that way to me. Is the inverted W a problem after a TJ surgery though?

[sgtcluels]

I don't think there's a big correlation between invert W and injury. I think someone did a study, but don't quote me on that.

[sbrylski]

Marcum is a flat-out good pitcher, despite lacking velocity on his fastball. His changeup is absolutely sick. Fangraphs advanced metrics had it ranked second in the league behind King Felix last season.

 

Marcum was 7th in the entire MLB in swinging strike rate at 10.9%, so he's excellent at making hitters miss. He also had a 1.98 BB/9 rate last season, good for 5th in the entire MLB. That's a heck of a combo. Finally, he also sported the 11th best out-of-zone swing rate, so gets people to chase too. He's not just pounding the zone which could lead to some ugly innings.

 

Also, consider the fact that it was his first full season back from Tommy John surgery. In 2009, he tossed just 15.2 innings. So, we should have expected Marcum to probably hit a bit of a wall in 2010 at some point, right? In his first 125 innings, he had a 3.24 ERA. And, sure enough, over the final two months of the season he had a 4.35 ERA, though even that's not bad considering his schedule. (Yankees, Boston x3, Tampa x2, Rangers)

 

I'm not even sure you could call that stretch hitting a wall either, because the only rate that really changed was his HR rate, despite his GB% staying about the same. K/9 and BB/9 were nearly exactly the same over the last two months of the season. One thing I can say for sure is that he's healthy as an ox at the moment.

 

Marcum's a 98 mph blow-you-away fastball away from being a Cy Young candidate every year. That's never going to come, but it doesn't have to. He'll slot in wonderfully as our #2. I'm excited to have him.

 

Questions to ask...

 

Was the price we paid too much for just two seasons of Marcum? You'll have to debate what you think Lawrie truly is to answer that. As in, can he handle second base? Would his bat be anything special in a corner outfield spot?

 

Secondly, is Marcum still a health risk? He has a bit of an "inverted w" delivery in that picture above. Hopefully that's pre-TJ surgery and he's fixed that post-op.

[brewerfan82]

And more importantly, why don't they just call the inverted W an M?