Brewers trade Villanueva to Toronto for a PTBNL [Latest: Brewers get cash]

[And That]

Per the Brewers.

 

I would hazard a guess that the player to be named is eligible to be selected in the Rule 5 draft.

 

Kind of a strange trade, but it seems like the Brewers are really trying to pinch pennies on relievers.

[reillymcshane]

Villy probably should get a change of scenery. It just seems like the team lost faith in him. I wondered if it was just Macha, but I assume that means Melvin and others as well.

 

He had some flashes of brilliance, and then he'd just totally screw up. Kind of frustrating because you can see the talent.

[Dnye23]

Good riddance, personally did not like this guy.

[And That]

FWIW, here are the Blue Jays' Rule 5 draft eligibles, at least as of a few days ago: link.

[RyDogg66]

Good riddance, personally did not like this guy.

Stepped away from my computer for a while, came back and read this post and thought I was still in the Ron Santo thread. Imagine how much of a jerk I thought you were before I realized I was in the Carlos Villanueva thread.

[Invader3K]

RyDogg, that's hilarious.

 

Anyway, I didn't think they were going to tender him a contract anyway. They're going younger int he bullpen, and that should be a good thing.

[dadofandrew]

Here would the top 4 guys, if indeed it is a Rule 5 eligible, which Adam M also reported.

 

My guess would be Frank Gailey, check out how similar to Braddock he is.

 

http://albethke.blogspot....nandez-frank-gailey.html

 

All 3 pitchers have more ceiling than CV, though I bet TOR thinks he can be a #4/5 SP. Looking at his stats, I'd agree, but he sure has sucked as a SP. If he'd use his fastball as anything except a waste pitch/down 2-0 pitch, he might still be. For $1.5-2M, I think the Blue Jays like his potential as an SP.

[trwi7]

I for one am shocked that he got traded to Toronto.

[And That]

I agree on Gailey. He's going into his 25 year old season, hasn't played above advanced-A ball, and is only 5'9, but the stats speak for themselves.

 

I came up with the same four names on Twitter as Al did - Brad Emaus, Ronald Uviedo, Juan Hernandez, Gailey. I'd add Chad Beck and Randy Boone as possibilities. Adam Loewen is available too, but his time seems to have come and gone, unless the Brewers like his bat enough.

[logan82]

The guy goes from thought of as a possible closer to being a possible non-tender and traded. I think he got misused by Macha. He had a few bad games and got buried. Macha was ok overall with the bullpen but ha had a bad habit of letting guys rot on the bench so they were rusty when needed.

[JohnBriggs12]

Villanueva battled every time out there. There wasn't a more competitive guy on the pitching staff the last several years. He took every failure personally. Macha never connected with him. He couldn't just rare back and blow people away. He needed to be able to spot his fastball to make his change and slider effective. When he struggled it was because he wasn't spotting his fastball.

 

Somebody's going to unlock something in him and he's going to have a big year. Maybe that will happen in Toronto.

 

Regarding the return, most of those names are barely younger than Villanueva. I have a hard time believing guys in their mid 20's in A ball have a high ceiling. Looks to me they just were going to non tender him but Toronto offered a warm body.

[dadofandrew]

CV was awful after the first 40 games or so. He is still the same pitcher he was the day they brought him up, he has not matured at all. He has a plus curveball, plus change, and his fastball averages 91-92...he's got the stuff. He's just never developed into anything more than a decent middle reliever.

 

Macha rewarded guys who pitched well with the higher leverage innings. CV never earned them.

[Milltownhooker]

Just cutting the fat for the injury risk SP:)

[JohnBriggs12]

CV was awful after the first 40 games or so. He is still the same pitcher he was the day they brought him up, he has not matured at all. He has a plus curveball, plus change, and his fastball averages 91-92...he's got the stuff. He's just never developed into anything more than a decent middle reliever.

 

Macha rewarded guys who pitched well with the higher leverage innings. CV never earned them.

He came in 18 games in save situations, saved 1, and got holds on 14. He didn't take a single loss. That's a far cry from horrible. 15 of the 27 runs allowed came in 4 games. His ERA in his other 46 games was 2.70.

 

Coffey was worse and Macha kept using him.

[dadofandrew]

If they are going to trade Prince or Rickie, they may be looking to clear spots on the 40 man. It's at 35 now, but when Counsell (hopefully) and a couple more return, and then maybe a Rule 5 pick, it's darn near full again.

[UeckerAddict]

I never was gaga for Carlos, but I appreciated his versatility. He pitched as a starter, in long relief, as the setup man, and even closed briefly. Maybe that's because he wasn't great at any one thing, but he was good enough to get a chance to do everything. I never minded him being our "number 7" starter or our "3rd option" closer. He was a guy you could plug in anywhere in a pinch and every team needs a guy like that. I wish him the best.

[HiAndTight]

FWIW, here are the Blue Jays' Rule 5 draft eligibles, at least as of a few days ago: link.

There are at least a couple Brewers on there that I would really hate seeing exposed to the rule 5.

 

The most obvious one that jumps off the page is Taylor Green. Is it possible we're trying to clear so much room from the 40 man in order to protect guys like him, Periard(whom I've been a BIG fan of for a while and still see him as being a fantastic back of the rotation type guy for us).

 

Ramlow and Hand are two other guys I'd like to see us hold onto, though neither really seem to be difference makers.

 

 

One guy that intrigues me a great deal, and who I could see becoming a pretty damn nice arm is Adam Ottavino from the Cards. Had a bad debut last year in the big leagues, but he's a big, strong, power arm who I could see developing a nice niche for the Brewers down in their rotation.

[Sage]

This caught me off-guard a little bit. I figured it was just that Macha didn't like him, but I guess he'd fallen out of favor in the organization. Good pickup for Toronto, a solid guy to help build their bullpen after losing Gregg, Frasor, and Downs.

 

As for the PTBNL, I am kind of hoping for Brad Emaus. He's played mostly 2B, with a fair amount of 3B as well. His numbers suggest he's a solid hitter and defender (at both 3B and 2B), and I could see bringing him in allowing us to trade Lawrie/Rickie for pitching, or giving us another possible at 3B if we trade McGehee.

[trwi7]

and his fastball averages 91-92...

Since when?

[And That]

Emaus could well be the guy, but he stands a decent chance of being a Rule 5 pick. Of course, the Brewers could just take him in the Rule 5 and then get another guy (like Gailey) from Toronto.

[HiAndTight]

He came in 18 games in save situations, saved 1, and got holds on 14. He didn't take a single loss. That's a far cry from horrible. 15 of the 27 runs allowed came in 4 games. His ERA in his other 46 games was 2.70.

 

Coffey was worse and Macha kept using him.

Completely, completely agree. I was a big Villanueva fan. When he was spotting his fastball, he was just damn near unhittable. In fact, when he was on last year, he was as untouchable as anyone on this roster. Of course he had his let downs and for whatever reason he wasn't able to maintain that dominance. I always thought he was better off as a starter as well. 88-90 Fastball 4 seemer, throw a 2 seemer that really moved in on lefties, one helluva change when it was on, and both a slider and a curve that it seemed like came directly behind his change.

 

 

I also think someone's going to figure something out for him and he'll end up being a damn good pitcher.

[giffted1]

As for the PTBNL, I am kind of hoping for Brad Emaus. He's played mostly 2B, with a fair amount of 3B as well. His numbers suggest he's a solid hitter and defender (at both 3B and 2B), and I could see bringing him in allowing us to trade Lawrie/Rickie for pitching, or giving us another possible at 3B if we trade McGehee.

Looking at the list of Toronto's rule 5 eligibles, Emaus is the guy I want too. I could see him platooning with Gamel at 3B if we moved McGehee.

[adaozzy]

I'm no expert on these things, so maybe it can't be done. But instead of being one of the Jays rule 5 guys, could the player to be named later be some other team's rule 5 guy that the Jays draft at our direction and then trade to us?

[Sage]

I'm no expert on these things, so maybe it can't be done. But instead of being one of the Jays rule 5 guys, could the player to be named later be some other team's rule 5 guy that the Jays draft at our direction and then trade to us?

Entirely possible. I'm not sure that would be the plan, since we would have a higher pick in the Rule 5 draft than Toronto (correct?). It could make sense, though. For example, we could pick Emaus in the Rule 5, and then have Toronto pick up, say, a pitcher that we also want from the draft, and send that pitcher as the PTBNL.

[TooLiveBrew]

I could see him platooning with Gamel at 3B if we moved McGehee.

 

Gamel has hit lefties really well in the minors, that's one of the things I like most about him. A LH bat that doesn't get just shut down by LHP.

 

Emaus looks like an attractive option. I wonder why Toronto didn't feel like he was worth a 40-man spot if he's indeed a good defender.