Ken Macha won't be back - option for 2011 not picked up

[bigredrobbo]

I am not saying the Brewers should go out and get a big rah, rah guy.

But someone with a little more personality than Macha might be a good

thing for this team.

 

 

C'mon, you are gonna have to be a bit more specific - that's pretty much everyone!

[DuWayne Steurer]

I honestly believe Hoffman wouldn't coach somewhere away from San Diego at this point. His comments about family make that abundantly clear.

[Eddiehitsthefoulpole]

In response to the comment on Melvin, I just meant that DM is a solid GM. He has made some mistakes. All GMs do. He doesn't get do-overs the way that larger revenue teams do. The difference between us and Twins has been the development of pitching. Some of that has to be on Jack Z. A new GM might be better, but in my opinion he is more likely to be worse.

[YoungGeezy]

In response to the comment on Melvin, I just meant that DM is a solid GM. He has made some mistakes. All GMs do. He doesn't get do-overs the way that larger revenue teams do. The difference between us and Twins has been the development of pitching. Some of that has to be on Jack Z. A new GM might be better, but in my opinion he is more likely to be worse.

Development of pitching is not DM's job so all that falls on Jack Z (brought them in) and Reid Nichols (develops them) 100%. Doug's job is to promote the players who are ready for the bigs, to bring in FAs, make trades, resign players and so on. I always see people complain about DM and his crappy draft record with pitchers or how he can't develop minor league arms (large majority are the brain dead commentors from jsonline not on here so much, we actually have some intellegence ha) but it's not his job. His worry is the big league stuff. Sure, he knows what every player is doing and is ultimately Nichols and now Seids boss and has say but he lets them do there job and he does his. I actually think that Ash oversees the minors day to day stuff out of the two.

 

So I agree as a GM he does a good job, he works off a much smaller budget than most get to, he keeps the team competetive, and there are plenty of GM's who are much worse. Who would you rather take Sal Bondo, Dean Taylor or Doug Melvin.... I think it is a pretty easy choice.

[MNBrew]

Some of the more consistently strong organizations are ones w/ tendencies toward stability. For that reason, I think Randolph makes tons of sense: A different approach but not totally starting over.

 

- Peterson was his pitching coach in NY, so there's already a time-tested trust level there...and besides...

- They've only just begun implementing the organization-wide pitching plan, in which Peterson has a huge role.

- Sveum's hitters, while all have room for improvement, still had a pretty strong showing this year overall.

- The rotation needs much more talent, to be sure, but the majority of the players are young and could well be here for awhile.

- Per something I read, Randolph was seen as having a pretty good rapport w/ the players. And (if it truly makes a difference) he certainly ought to have much more "cred" with Prince & Braun than Macha did.

 

Randolph as mgr. New bench coach -- whomever Willie likes. Cirillo as 3B coach? That'd replace Randolph's role as IF coach, though there would be plenty of qualified options.

 

I just don't think the Brewers need to throw the baby out with the bathwater and start totally over again. Stability counts for something.

 

The last 2 times the Brewers actually promoted from within (non-interim situation) were Harvey Kuenn & Tom Trebelhorn. There are no guarantees, but those two circumstances turned out better than most any other managerial hire they've had not named Bamberger (1st time, mind you -- NOT the 2nd time).

[brewmann04]

why not Willie Maybe 3rd time a charm with him finally getting the Job that way when the brewers fail both he and Melvin wiil be replaced at the same time.

[And That]

There was a moment towards the end of the season, in the game where Escobar was pulled for not running out a wild pitch strike out. FSN showed Randolph sitting next to Escobar on the bench, and it looked like Randolph was calmly but sternly describing to Escobar why he had been pulled. Escobar was nodding as Randolph talked, and it looked like he was actively taking in the advice, as opposed to just taking it. I don't know how much better Randolph's rapport is with the players, but I'm guessing it has to be better than Macha's.

 

I thought Macha's strategy was generally sound, and unlike Yost, the problems I had with his decision making were generally just nits. If Randolph could be about as good with decision making and be that much better with the players, I'd have no problem with him as manager.

[jerichoholicninja]

Maybe it's selective memory but during games there were always players talking with Randolph and Svuem. Macha was almost always standing by himself, sometimes with Peterson and that one time with Dale practicing his swing. Players seemed to like Willie and avoid Ken.

[YoungGeezy]

Like I said before Willie is actually a coach/teacher. The two years of work that he has put in with Weeks defensively (this is counting before injury) his defense actually has really improved. The whole can't spell weeks with out 2 E's and a K is now you can't spell Weeks without out a K. It seems like every play on that team has taken to him and Dale. If you want to be successful you can't continue to flush out people players trust, bond with and improve under. As a football coach I see some teams in our conference coaching coaches every couple of years and the teams never develop.

 

The thing that I like most is we have an explosive offense, that will only improve when a manager like Randoph lets those players use their biggest strong....there speed! To have the speed we do and have as little as steals as we do is just absurd. I'm biased Randoph was one of my managers with the Mets so naturally I love the thought of him taking over the Crew. Plus health willing he is in a good situation with pitchers getting pretty close to knocking on the door and some that are (Rogers, Jeffress, Rivas all could factor in Braddock was outtstanding outside of one horrible outting and will continue to get better with age) Then you got Odorizzi, Scarpetta, Peralta and Heckathorn getting closer. Not to bad.

[WestSideWillie]

I'd prefer the Brewers refrain from going to the well of baseball manager retreads....

Multiple folks are saying this. The Brewers have to be one of the better teams at NOT hiring retreads. The Macha hire doesn't make me gun-shy of guys with MLB managerial experience. Terry Francona's won a couple World Series in Boston after winning nothing in Philly. Charlie Manuel won in Philly after not winning in Cleveland.

 

Let's see...

 

Ken Macha - "retread"

Ned Yost - rookie mgr

Jerry Royster - rookie mgr

Davey Lopes - rookie mgr

Phil Garner - rookie mgr

Tom Trebelhorn - rookie mgr

George Bamberger, 2nd time - "retread"

 

... the last time before Macha the Brewers hired a re-tread was for the '85 season, and his previous experience was managing the Brewers. Only Trebelhorn had a winning record, and only Garner & Yost also had above .500 seasons.

 

Bamberger turned the franchise around, Kuenn won a pennant, Buck Rodgers was a winner, Garner had a winning season, Treb had a winning record, Dave Bristol was a retread. That is why I was a Harry Dalton fan, outside of Lach, all were first timers and pretty successful. If we cannot pay a Showalter or a Torre, go with a new guy. Davey Lopes was a politically correct hire, Royster a fill in--Crandall a familiar face, Alex Grammas? Now---he gives us wonder on why not to hire a new guy as a manager. Point taken.

[WestSideWillie]

Pat and Lisa are divorced, she is living in Texas so she is not an issue.

[RockCoCougars]

I'd prefer the Brewers refrain from going to the well of baseball manager retreads....

Multiple folks are saying this. The Brewers have to be one of the better teams at NOT hiring retreads. The Macha hire doesn't make me gun-shy of guys with MLB managerial experience. Terry Francona's won a couple World Series in Boston after winning nothing in Philly. Charlie Manuel won in Philly after not winning in Cleveland.

 

Let's see...

 

Ken Macha - "retread"

Ned Yost - rookie mgr

Jerry Royster - rookie mgr

Davey Lopes - rookie mgr

Phil Garner - rookie mgr

Tom Trebelhorn - rookie mgr

George Bamberger, 2nd time - "retread"

 

... the last time before Macha the Brewers hired a re-tread was for the '85 season, and his previous experience was managing the Brewers. Only Trebelhorn had a winning record, and only Garner & Yost also had above .500 seasons.

 

Bamberger turned the franchise around, Kuenn won a pennant, Buck Rodgers was a winner, Garner had a winning season, Treb had a winning record, Dave Bristol was a retread. That is why I was a Harry Dalton fan, outside of Lach, all were first timers and pretty successful. If we cannot pay a Showalter or a Torre, go with a new guy. Davey Lopes was a politically correct hire, Royster a fill in--Crandall a familiar face, Alex Grammas? Now---he gives us wonder on why not to hire a new guy as a manager. Point taken.

The Brewers also don't hire from within. Since I don't consider guys like Lefebvre (remember him?) and Royster to be former Brewer managers due to their interim status, you have to go back nearly 25 years to Trebelhorn to find the last internal hire. I'm pretty sure he wasn't expected to get the full time gig either, until the team finished like 7-2 under his watch. As far as I know, Trebelhorn, Kuenn, Rodgers and Crandall were the only managers in franchise history who were internal hires, and at least 3 of them started on an interim basis.

[TooLiveBrew]

Noticed this in a recent TH blog post:

I just spoke with Brewers hitting coach Dale Sveum, who interviewed for the managerial vacancy in Pittsburgh today. Sveum, who once managed in the Pirates' farm system, said he thought it went well. Oddly enough, recently dismissed Brewers manager Ken Macha interviewed for that job earlier in the week.

 

"It was my first interview and you never know what to expect," said Sveum. "But I felt right at home. The interview lasted about four hours and I thought it was only two hours. We talked a lot of baseball and the time went by."

I'm guessing TH means that it was odd both Sveum & Macha interviewed for the Pirates job, because Macha played for the Pittsburgh organization for 7 seasons (drafted out of the Univ. of Pittsburgh) & is a native of the Pittsburgh area.

 

I'll be interested to see where Dale, Ken, & Willie end up.

[dlk9s]

Maybe it's selective memory but during games there were always players talking with Randolph and Svuem. Macha was almost always standing by himself, sometimes with Peterson and that one time with Dale practicing his swing. Players seemed to like Willie and avoid Ken.

It definitely sounds like the players weren't too high on Macha, but it might have been the assistant coaches' responsibilities to do the talking/teaching during the game while Macha takes care of in-game management. No idea if this is correct, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some delegation of responsibilities.

[BrewCrewForever]

While watching the Sports 32 Roundtable show the other night, Trenni was on the panel and she confirmed that a Brewers player (of course name not mentioned) told her that Macha had lost the clubhouse. No real surprise, but I had never heard anyone say they actually heard that from a player.

[hawing]

While watching the Sports 32 Roundtable show the other night, Trenni was on the panel and she confirmed that a Brewers player (of course name not mentioned) told her that Macha had lost the clubhouse. No real surprise, but I had never heard anyone say they actually heard that from a player.

I'd be interested to know how long ago they reached that point.

[RockCoCougars]

I'd be interested to know how long ago they reached that point.

To kinda quote Jerry Maguire, 'He lost them at hello'. Say what you want about the 2008 team backing into the playoffs, losing C.C., whatever. At the time, it seemed that the team had very good chemistry with Sveum. The players really seemed to be having fun out there. Flash forward to this season, where it looked like they were mostly going through he motions.

[logan82]

Flash forward to this season, where it looked like they were mostly going through he motions.

 

Teams tend to look that way when they are not winning. It was different when we were not expected to win.

[BrewCrewForever]

Flash forward to this season, where it looked like they were mostly going through he motions.

 

Teams tend to look that way when they are not winning. It was different when we were not expected to win.

I would say they looked like they were going to the motions this entire season. It seemed to me they lost their swagger that they had in 07', 08' and even most of 09'.

[logan82]

Of course it looked like we were going through the motions. We started poorly and really were not in contention from the first week on. In the 3 previous years we were in or close to first place for at least half the season. 2007 we missed the playoffs by one game. 2008 we made the playoffs. 2009 we ere in first place into July. There was little to get excited about this year. We are expecting to win as opposed to just being excited about having good players coming up like we were before 2008. They were flat because they were losing or looked flat because of our feelings about the team.

[dlk9s]

The players really seemed to be having fun out there.

Impossible. Brett Favre was never a Brewer.