Ken Macha won't be back - option for 2011 not picked up

[MessiahRp]

What about a guy like Grady Little?

 

Sure he's had bigger budgets but his teams have never posted a losing record and he spent a ton of time managing in the minors (knows how to develop young players) and generally is well liked by his players (something Macha never has been).

 

He's sort of off the radar at the moment but would he be someone that could work in Milwaukee?

[crewcrazy]

Melvin just met with the media...some of the comments, as tweeted by Tom Haudricourt:

 

Doug Melvin's assessement of Ken Macha's 2 years as Brewers manager: "He did the best that he could."

 

Melvin said he hadn't talked to his coaches yet and therefore wouldn't say if any of them, including Willie Randolph, are being considered.

 

More Melvin: "We didn't meet expectations. Whether our expectations were realistic or now, we'll have to look at. (Macha) understood."

 

Melvin downplayed generational gap between Macha and his players, noting Cox, Manuel and other playoff managers are older managers.

 

As for Macha's interaction with his players, Melvin said, "Is there a communication gap there? There might have been."

 

More Melvin on Macha: "I admire Ken because he's a solid baseball guy. I brought him in here because he had a winning record."

[joepepsi]

I was not a huge Macha fan, but I don't think he did the worst job. I actually think overall his in-game managerial moves were usually well done. My problem with him was he did not seem to be able to get the most out of his players and get anyone to really overachieve. Also his handling of young players specifically Gamel was awful. It also doesn't bode well when your two best players don't get along with you very well.

 

I am not saying the Brewers should go out and get a big rah, rah guy. But someone with a little more personality than Macha might be a good thing for this team.

I pretty much agree with you on all this. Except the part about his handling of young players, but everybody here has been over this about 6 bazillion times, so we'll just agree to disagree at this point. Macha seems pretty average to me. But I think each year the team finished at the low end of the win range that most predicted. Which means Macha really did little to make a difference. He wasn't a crazy incompetent that ruined the team, neither was he an expert leader that inspired his players to eek a few extra wins each season.

 

I also think he and his coaching staff do deserve more than a little of the blame for the bad starting rotation we've suffered through the last two years. He didn't have championship caliber starters, it's true. But it's equally true every starter performed at the low end of their potential.

[PKBadger]

What about a guy like Grady Little?

 

Sure he's had bigger budgets but his teams have never posted a losing record and he spent a ton of time managing in the minors (knows how to develop young players) and generally is well liked by his players (something Macha never has been).

 

He's sort of off the radar at the moment but would he be someone that could work in Milwaukee?

He was responsible for the worst in-game managerial decision that I can ever recall seeing. Doesn't fill me with a great deal of confidence.

[TooLiveBrew]

More Melvin on Macha: "I admire Ken because he's a solid baseball guy. I brought him in here because he had a winning record."

Someone order case after case of champagne -- a groundbreaking managerial hire is gonna be just around the corner this offseason!

[Ennder]

Yet another classy Doug Melvin move. Doug, you are a truly awful GM. I can't believe how bad you are at dealing with your people. You have made it an organization wide problem.

 

I never liked Macha much, but whacking him via leaked reports on the radio? Classy!

 

Ugh! The way this organization has been run over the last couple years has made it very difficult to be a fan!

There are a lot of valid criticisms of Melvin (free agent signings, trades), but I have no idea where this one is coming from. He may waste money on bad pitching, but he is all class.

Ever take a Rorschach test? People who don't like a particular manager or GM or player will always find a way to think something bad about them no matter what happens.

[Invader3K]

I admit I didn't know about Listach's extensive minor league resume. I'm not opposed to seeing him interviewed or whatever, just surprised by the sudden support he seems to have around here.

[Point Beer Is Best]

when an older manager wins, he is a "stabilizing influence", "maturity the team needs", veteran who has been

through "the ropes" such as Joe Torre, Bobby Cox, Buck Showalter, and Cito Gaston. When an older manager

loses, he cannot "connect", "communicate" or "relate" to the younger players. I think Macha's down side was over-rated

much like his up-side. I hope Mark A and Doug do not bring in the "usual suspects" and go out side the managerial box

and sign Pat Listach, Brewers rookie of the year in 1992 and now a third base coach in Washington.

I agree that they should bring in Listach for an interview. Also your post made me think of this guy:

 

http://funrunrecords.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/farley.jpg

Maybe I'm not "the norm," I'm not "a heartbreaker," I don't "own a toothbrush," and "I frighten small children..."

[PeaveyFury]

Like most others, I'm not surprised or upset by this. I'm also not eager to see another manager built basically in the same mold as 99% of the rest of the managers out there, so sign me up for somebody new.

 

I will say that I expect it to be somebody like Bob Melvin or Willie Randolph, and I expect the fan base to be calling for his head a year from now just like they were with Yost.

[MNBrew]

I'd prefer the Brewers refrain from going to the well of baseball manager retreads....

Multiple folks are saying this. The Brewers have to be one of the better teams at NOT hiring retreads. The Macha hire doesn't make me gun-shy of guys with MLB managerial experience. Terry Francona's won a couple World Series in Boston after winning nothing in Philly. Charlie Manuel won in Philly after not winning in Cleveland.

 

Let's see...

 

Ken Macha - "retread"

Ned Yost - rookie mgr

Jerry Royster - rookie mgr

Davey Lopes - rookie mgr

Phil Garner - rookie mgr

Tom Trebelhorn - rookie mgr

George Bamberger, 2nd time - "retread"

 

... the last time before Macha the Brewers hired a re-tread was for the '85 season, and his previous experience was managing the Brewers. Only Trebelhorn had a winning record, and only Garner & Yost also had above .500 seasons.

[ilovebeer]

Back when Pat Listach played here, After games were over I hung out where the Brewer players parked, I got to talk with Pat Listach wife while he was signing autograph, she was not much of a fan of the city of Milwaukee. So I not sure he would take the job.

[RU Rah Rah]

Maybe I'm not "the norm," I'm not "a heartbreaker," I don't "own a toothbrush," and "I frighten small children..."

I have been looking for a signature for five years. This might have to be it....

[Eddiehitsthefoulpole]

I think that both Melvin and Macha are good baseball people. Macha just wasn't the right fit here. I think he would fit better with a mature AL team. I see that there is some real Melvin hatred here. I know that Doug isn't perfect, but I don't want to lose him because I am afraid of what might replace him. Doug is a professional. People got tired of Harry Dalton (the greatest GM in team history) and the organization tanked. Back to the manager position. I think that we are going to form a "triangle of personalities". We replaced Ned Yost with the more laid, and alledgedly better judge of talent, in Macha. Regardless, we were going to hire someone who wasn't Ned. Now we will hire someone who isn't Ned or Ken. This person will be positive, enthusiastic, and a good communicator; someone who makes it fun to come to the ballpark. I think Doug will look for a baseball version of Bill Cowher.

[MessiahRp]

What about a guy like Grady Little?

 

Sure he's had bigger budgets but his teams have never posted a losing record and he spent a ton of time managing in the minors (knows how to develop young players) and generally is well liked by his players (something Macha never has been).

 

He's sort of off the radar at the moment but would he be someone that could work in Milwaukee?

He was responsible for the worst in-game managerial decision that I can ever recall seeing. Doesn't fill me with a great deal of confidence.

True and as a Red Sox fan believe me I was screaming at the TV as loudly as you possibly could. However as a whole Grady's tenure wasn't too bad in Boston and he was doing decent in LA until Ned Colletti decided to scapegoat him to do some CYA. His players genuinely like him and play hard for him and this seems like the kind of media market where he could relax, do his thing and really take a young core of guys and help them get to the next level. I'd like to think that the Pedro decision was more an aberration than anything. Every manager has a few dumb calls they'd like to take back and if there's anyone you make a dumb call on with that team it had to be Pedro since for a 5 year span he was pretty much unhittable. Obviously there are times where you can ride the horse too far and Grady got burned for it but at least he wasn't doing something like that with some of the other starters on that team. It was unforgiveable to Sox fans to say the least but it's at least slightly more understandable when you realize it was Pedro and what Pedro had been to that point.

[clancyphile]

I think that both Melvin and Macha are good baseball people. Macha just wasn't the right fit here. I think he would fit better with a mature AL team. I see that there is some real Melvin hatred here. I know that Doug isn't perfect, but I don't want to lose him because I am afraid of what might replace him. Doug is a professional. People got tired of Harry Dalton (the greatest GM in team history) and the organization tanked. Back to the manager position. I think that we are going to form a "triangle of personalities". We replaced Ned Yost with the more laid, and alledgedly better judge of talent, in Macha. Regardless, we were going to hire someone who wasn't Ned. Now we will hire someone who isn't Ned or Ken. This person will be positive, enthusiastic, and a good communicator; someone who makes it fun to come to the ballpark. I think Doug will look for a baseball version of Bill Cowher.

I agree completely. Doug Melvin's replacement could very well be Sal Bando 2.0. We know how well THAT worked for the Brew Crew.

[thebruce44]

Back when Pat Listach played here, After games were over I hung out where the Brewer players parked, I got to talk with Pat Listach wife while he was signing autograph, she was not much of a fan of the city of Milwaukee. So I not sure he would take the job.

 

I wonder how she enjoyed 10 year of Lansing, Des Moines, and West Tennessee.

[monty57]

You would really have to hate a place to decline a seven figure salary for a position only 30 people in the world hold (i.e. would you rather live in Milwaukee and make $1MM or live in Philly making $100k?) Theoretically, when Listach was a player, he could play in any Major League city for the same amount of money. Managerial jobs don't come around very often, so most people jump when offered a chance. Generally, the only time someone turns a managerial job down is when that person has a lot of MLB managing experience under their belt, or when they're being offered several jobs in the same year. Plus (purely opinion) when someone is in their 20's, the desire to live in a city can often depend on the city's night life. Once that person is well into their 30's or 40's, the night life doesn't matter nearly as much.

[YoungGeezy]

No shock, Brewers knew that it'd be impossible to bring him back with the lack of support the move would get. Brewer Nation would go nuts if he was brought back.

 

So bring on Willie Randoph or (Slightly a joke)Ryne Sandberg as the next Brewer Manager!

 

Why Sandberg you may ask?

1) He will be extremely pissed off at the Cubs if they go in a different direction and just to spite them he could leave to big time nemeis (White Sox and Cards have no openings)

2)He know just as much about baseball as anyone else we could bring in, plus he has attidude and confidence something we have lacked since Ned Yost was fired.

3)This is the main reason.....what a slap in the face to Cubs!!! God could not explain how much enjoyment I would get out of the heartbreak the Cub fans will feel after there belover Sandberg, not only great player but someone they thought would be there great manager of the future ups and leaves them to go to one of the foes....It would be like all those Packer fans who still cry and complain about Favre leaving for the Vikings.

 

Hate the idea all you want, when I first to my dad he was like what? why? like most, then I gave him those reasons and he ended saying hmmmm thats actually not to bad of an idea. Take it as you will

 

In reality though I hope it is Willie because I thought he was great with the Mets and he has everything your looking for: He has personality, players love him, he will have there backs, he knows how to coach/teach actually (that is a great quality). Why risk it bringing in another guy that you have no clue if they will gel with the players or connect. Players loved Ned Yost and even when they were bad they were fighters out there and would battle to the end, with Macha the players didn't gel and seemed to play flat and give up a lot. That could just be me though. Have to bring in a guy that the players all respect and Randolph already has that. Easy choice Dougy..

-Also lets not forget that Willie really likes to run, and our team is really fast! So all these guys who only had like maybe 10 steals this season because Macha hates to run, will be in the 30's to 40's if not higher (Hart and Braun both are capable of 30, David Wright was over 30 with Willie so I think that is fair to say). Just look Escobar, Cain, Gomez, Weeks, Braun, Hart, and even someone like Lucroy could add some more off those heads up steals.

[Gobias Industries]

I don't care who the next manager is, as he's basically gonna make the same exact managerial moves. Sure, he may be more fiery, but I'm not convinced that's a good thing.

 

For that reason, I would just like to see Randolph hired. That way we can retain Svuem, who has done an excellent job with guys like McG, Hart, and Weeks. I'd hate to see the guy let go after the good work he's done here for the last 2 years.

[jerichoholicninja]

I'd like to see Randolph be the manager and keep the coaching staff intact. Get some "young" coach to take over the bench coach role and sort of be groomed as the next guy by Randolph. I wouldn't mind seeing Craig Counsell, Jason Kendall, or Jeff Cirillo there. Maybe Trevor Hoffman.

[Eddiehitsthefoulpole]

I don't think that you will see that Brewers promote from within, even though I think we have some worthy candidates. As a general rule of thumb you don't promote from within when your fire a manager. You look for new ideas from outside the organization.

[YoungGeezy]

I'd like to see Randolph be the manager and keep the coaching staff intact. Get some "young" coach to take over the bench coach role and sort of be groomed as the next guy by Randolph. I wouldn't mind seeing Craig Counsell, Jason Kendall, or Jeff Cirillo there. Maybe Trevor Hoffman.

I think Cirillo would be idea, Hoffman if he wants to stick in baseball could be an excellent pitching coach. Just from listening to how all the other pitchers talk about him and how important he has been to the young guys like Braddock, seems like a perfect fit but his boys are getting older and he will probably want to retire so he can watch/coach them. I'd be happy if they'd bring in some former Brewer for that role such as bringing back Cecil Cooper or Robin Yount as bench coach (I'd assume that they would all get along with Randoph and Yount is best friends with Dale)

 

A coach staff i'd like is:

 

Manager -Willie Randolph

Bench -Robin Yount

Hitting -Dale Sveum

Pitching - Rick Peterson (he can't be blamed for what he was given a deserves one more season)

Bullpen - Stan Kyles

 

1st Base- Ed Sedar

3rd Base- Sandy Guerrero (He has been a good coach in the minors and he can help them better with gomez and escobar)

 

[TooLiveBrew]

Hoffman if he wants to stick in baseball could be an excellent pitching coach

 

Hoffman made some comments about the possibility of coaching that lead me to believe he probably won't. At least not this coming season.

“It won’t be easy (to retire), not when you’ve been doing something since you were seven. I’d like to stay in the game in some form but coaching, you have even more irons in the fire and time away from family. I don’t know if I want to do that.

Link

[YoungGeezy]

I don't think that you will see that Brewers promote from within, even though I think we have some worthy candidates. As a general rule of thumb you don't promote from within when your fire a manager. You look for new ideas from outside the organization.

I think that is true but with Randoph he really is a whole new idea and style of baseball than Macha. To me it is hard to believe that he would have stuck around two years as bench coach here unless he thought he could be in line to take over the team. You'd think given his track record and everything else he would have other options.

[trwi7]

I think that both Melvin and Macha are good baseball people. Macha just wasn't the right fit here. I think he would fit better with a mature AL team. I see that there is some real Melvin hatred here. I know that Doug isn't perfect, but I don't want to lose him because I am afraid of what might replace him. Doug is a professional. People got tired of Harry Dalton (the greatest GM in team history) and the organization tanked. Back to the manager position. I think that we are going to form a "triangle of personalities". We replaced Ned Yost with the more laid, and alledgedly better judge of talent, in Macha. Regardless, we were going to hire someone who wasn't Ned. Now we will hire someone who isn't Ned or Ken. This person will be positive, enthusiastic, and a good communicator; someone who makes it fun to come to the ballpark. I think Doug will look for a baseball version of Bill Cowher.

I agree completely. Doug Melvin's replacement could very well be Sal Bando 2.0. We know how well THAT worked for the Brew Crew.

 

This is just weak to me. We can't get rid of a guy because the new guy might be worse? You can just as easily flip that around and say we should get rid of the guy because the new guy might be better.