Got threatened with a gun today...

[RightFieldCoder]

paul253 wrote:

---

You are upset they didn't find the person who stole her stereo? I hate to be blunt, but get over it. First off, do you have any idea how common that type of crime is? And second, do you know how difficult it is to catch and charge someone for doing it? What exactly did you expect MPD to do? Take fingerprints? I'd bet she probably has about 10 sets of fingerprints on her car at any given time. And even if the cops do pull a print, what does it prove? It proves that they touched the car, nothing more. You're comparing a big city department's reaction to a property crime to a suburban department's reaction to an ID theft. I don't think that's a very fair comparison. And for what it's worth, I had my car broken into in Shorewood a few years ago. They didn't take fingerprints. They didn't find the guy, as far a I know they didn't do anything. Reports for crimes like that are done more so so the victim can make an insurance claim.

It's not that they didn't catch the guy, they didn't even pretend to try to look for the guy. They never did an investigation. They never sent anybody over. They took the call over the phone, gave a report number, and they were done. She was left with her windshield shattered all over the inside of the car, and all she got was a randomly generated number. Four to five times a week there is a squad on the street of the workplace to watch for speeders. The suburban police actually talked to my girlfriend in person and took notes.

[homer]

I think most people complaining about Milwaukee cops don't realize just how much violent crime they have to deal with in the inner city. If I'm a police department that's stretched thin on resources, I'm going to focus on the violent stuff like aggravated assault, rape, and murder. Not to minimize this particular crime because being threatened with a gun (even though he didn't show one) is really nerve wracking but it's probably not up there with an armed robbery where a gun was brandished or a home invasion or a shooting. In a perfect world, the cops would be able to assign someone to track down this kid with all the clues provided but they can't do it. It's not like they're sitting around playing checkers all day. When I lived in AZ someone broke into my car and stole my stereo. I gave a report over the phone and that was it. Not much the cops could do. Sucks but that's sort of how it goes.

 

 

Just one man's opinion....

[thebruce44]

paul253[/b]]I base this on every time I've had to report something to the MPD.

 

So since you aren't satisfied with the way they handled your incident, you come to the conclusion that the reason they aren't doing more is because they are too busy writing parking and speeding tickets? This isn't based on anything personal though since you've never actually received one of those tickets, it's just a baseless assumption? I know that you don't really mean what you said, but then why say it?

Aren't you the poster who once saw a bum near 6th street so you now think the walk from the Bradley Center to the train station after a night game is dangerous?

 

Most people make cause and effect assumptions based on their own personal experiences, whether or not they are backed up by statistics or the experiences of the majority of the public is another story. In this instance, I think his opinion tends to be fairly in line with the majority of the public.

[adamb100]

Not a big update, rather minor but I recieved a slip from the Police that gave me the detective's phone # and shift hours and all that good stuff.

[dadofandrew]

NYC had lots of luck lowering serious crime by focusing on parking tickets and minor offenses. Cops in the area have an impact on other things, it chases criminals elsewhere, it makes it easier to report a crime, and it builds trust.

 

You can't just ignore minor stuff and focus on big stuff, it doesn't work that way. Proof of that is after years of being on the FBI most wanted list, that scumbag abortion clinic bomber (Rudolph?) was caught by a graveyard shift cop as he looked through a dumpster looking for food. Good police work caught him, while years of having a dozen agents assigned to him did not.

 

You can read about NYC's success here, Rudy G and a new outlook get and deserve most of the credit. If you can't get rid of graffiti and broken windows, you're not going to have any luck with major crime, as those things are obvious signs that the police have lost. That's why the abandoned warehouses and factories visible from 94 in Milwaukee, and to a lesser extent, Mpls, are such a big deal No one looking to open a business is going to look at those areas twice, because they know they are neighborhoods with little police presence.

 

Even on SVU last night, they were bragging how quick their lab is, and that they have no backlog. If you never do the test, you can't catch the stupid scum who left evidence, and they'll keep offending. No idea if it's true about the real NYC, but it makes perfect sense. Van Hollen ran on this for AG also, and has lowered the wait, though it's still far too long.

[homer]

NYC had lots of luck lowering serious crime by focusing on parking tickets and minor offenses. Cops in the area have an impact on other things, it chases criminals elsewhere, it makes it easier to report a crime, and it builds trust.

 

You can't just ignore minor stuff and focus on big stuff, it doesn't work that way. Proof of that is after years of being on the FBI most wanted list, that scumbag abortion clinic bomber (Rudolph?) was caught by a graveyard cop as he looked through a dumpster looking for food. Good police work caught him, while years of having a dozen agents assigned to him did not.

A lot of criminologists have shown there was no cause and effect between Giuliani's "small crimes" initiative and a drop in the crime rate. It was a coincidence. Crime rates dropped all over the place about that time - not just NYC - and not everyone had decided to pursue the little crimes.

[paul253]

I live in

Madison, but even out here, it's common "knowledge" that Milwaukee cops

only care about parking tickets and jaywalking. So either that's true,

or MPD is bad at public relations. Either way, it's their own fault,

not the general public's. Hating people for having an opinion isn't

cool.

 

Apparently it's not common "knowledge" then that "jaywalking" (which just by my own definition means crossing the street while not in the crosswalk, so correct me if your definition is something else) is not illegal in Milwaukee. There are plenty of related offenses that are illegal, such as walking down the street (as opposed to walking on the sidewalk), or not yielding the right of way to traffic at controlled intersections i.e. walking against a red light which causes traffic to have to stop for you. But simply "jaywalking" isn't a violation. Perhaps if you are in the Madison area you could pass that along to some of your buddies so that the common "knowledge" is more accurate.

I think what he was getting at was that MPD spends too much time

dealing with relatively unimportant things, and not issues that citizens

care about.

 

Not to sound like a jerk, but if you have no statistics or anything, how could you possibly know how much time they spend focusing on parking tickets? I won't make a comment on any other "unimportant" things because I'm not trying to be an MPD apologist here, but I will say that MPD has to respond to calls for police, no matter what they are. The response may be a phone call to take the report by phone, or it may be them showing up 5 hours after you call because that's the soonest they could get there, but it still requires a response. My parents have some friends who live in the UWM neighborhood. Apparently the friends were told by their little neighborhood association that if they call the police and demand a citation be issued for noise/parties, the cops have to issue one. That means if someone is playing their music too loudly, the cops have to show up, have to spend time trying to contact the resident, and have to spend time writing a ticket. It may be an "unimportant" call as far as the rest of the city is concerned but it is something they are apparently required to do.

 

I'm not denying that MPD cops write parking tickets. All I am saying is that the vast majority of parking tickets are written by the parking checkers, who don't work for the police department. MPD does not assign squads for parking enforcement. It's mostly a discretionary thing. If they see a violation and want to write a ticket, they can. Take this with a grain of salt, but I was listening to Mark Belling the other day and he was talking about the parking issue. He said, and again no idea how accurate this is, that the parking checkers were moved from the PD because they were showing too much discretion and not writing enough tickets.

 

It's not that they didn't catch the guy, they didn't even pretend to

try to look for the guy. They never did an investigation. They never

sent anybody over. They took the call over the phone, gave a report

number, and they were done.

 

When my car got broken into in Shorewood, they sent a squad. I think it was because I saw the guy and actually chased after him for a bit. Anyway, do you know what they did when they got there? They took my information and gave me a randomly generated report number. I never heard from them again. I haven't ever gotten a subpoena for a case so I assume they never caught the guy. Never talked to anyone in the Shorewood PD again (this happened about 5 years ago). I have no idea what, if anything, was done to look for the guy, just like you have no idea what, if anything was done to find your g/f's suspect. But as I said...no photographs, no fingerprints, no nothing by the Shorewood PD. My question to you is this. What difference would it make if I gave them my information and my story over the phone or in person? They didn't fix my windshield or replace my stereo. I was left in the same exact situation your g/f was. It's not an MPD thing...its a police thing.

Four to five times a week there is a squad on the street of the workplace to watch for speeders

 

And I bet because of that nobody in the immediate area is having their cars broken into? They may be watching for speeders but their presence in the area I'm sure has an overall positive affect on the crime rate in the direct area.

 

Aren't you the poster who once saw a bum near 6th street so you now

think the walk from the Bradley Center to the train station after a

night game is dangerous?

 

If this were posted on "politifact", I'd give it a barely true. Yes, I did say that in the area of the downtown train station there are a lot of bums. To my recollection, though, I never said "dangerous". The extent of the statement was this. When talking about the train issue, someone from out of town asked if the BC was in walking distance from the train station. A poster said yes it was. I then agreed with him, and said yes it's a fairly short walk or very short cab ride. I then added something like this....however there are a lot of homeless people in the area who might give you some problems (there are, I hope you aren't denying that...see what I said about the doors to the actual train station being locked during certain hours to prevent homeless people from using the station as a shelter) so depending on who you are with, you might consider just taking a cab to avoid the possible conflict. I also said that I myself would have no problem walking the area, but I would not want my wife/girlfriend/daughter walking down there at that time of day. Implying that I suggested the area is dangerous because I saw a homeless guy once is grossly inaccurate.

if MPD did a better job of simply acting like they care (as opposed to

being the Big Lebowski cop), we might not be having this discussion

 

I disagree. I don't want them to "act" like they care. I don't want

them telling me "oh yeah we'll have someone out there looking night and

day for these guys". I'm not 7. I want them to tell me the truth. I'd

much rather have them say this: "Look we take about 2,000 of these

calls a year. Occasionally we catch them but usually we don't. I'll do

what I can but don't expect to get your car stereo back. As a matter

of fact, unless you know what the serial number is or have some sort of

personal identification mark, if we catch him with your property we

can't even charge him with the crime because we need to prove that the

stereo is actually yours." This is what insurance is for. You have it

because you know the possibility of this happening is out there and the

chances of your getting the suspect to cover the cost of repair and

replacement are tiny. All I want for them to do is take my call seriously. File the report like you are supposed to so I can make my insurance claim.

 

In this instance, I think his opinion tends to be fairly in line with the majority of the public.

 

But that doesn't make any mention of whether or not it's actually true. Is it fair for the majority of the public to claim all the police n Milwaukee do is enforce jaywalking when jaywalking isn't even illegal? It seems like a dangerous precedent to imply it's ok to think that way just because the majority of the public thinks that way. If they went by facts and personal experience as opposed to "common knowledge" and exaggerated stories, the opinion probably wouldn't be where it is. I can tell you with a fair amount of certainty that the majority of the public has no real idea what being a police officer entails. I think that's mainly because of all the tv and "reality shows" like Cops. Cops always shows the big drug bust, but they never show the 8 hours of paperwork that follows, nor the constant court appearances over the next year. They also don't mention that the patrol cop who got into the high speed chase may never again in his 20 something year career get into another one. They also use terms like "jaywalking' and "breaking and entering" so people just blindly repeat those terms even though in Wisconsin there is no crime called "breaking and entering".

 

My intent here is not to offend people or to sit here and say everyone is wrong. I just hate when people use blanket generalizations like "all they do is write parking tickets and stop speeders", especially when the person then tries to claim they have respect for the police. On the one hand they're saying "they don't do their jobs" or "they only focus on stuff that nobody cares about", then on the other they say "oh yeah but I still respect them". Its like me going up to a firefighter and saying "yeah you don't do anything other than get cats out of trees and go grocery shopping, but I really appreciate what you do". Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

[TracyThom]

My uncle is a cop for the Milwaukee Police Department and for the past 3-4 years his entire job has consisted largely of writing tickets for people who park illegally in handicap parking spots. He told me about how proud he was of the money he was making for the city and how much he loves the feeling of catching someone doing this. So the precedence isn't entirely merit less, but it is only 1(!) person and he has worked numerous types of shifts in his 15+ year tenure with the Milwaukee Police.

This sounds really strange to me. Is your uncle a sworn police officer or is he in a non-sworn position like a community service officer?

Diskono wrote:

---

I live in Madison, but even out here, it's common "knowledge" that Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking. So either that's true, or MPD is bad at public relations. Either way, it's their own fault, not the general public's. Hating people for having an opinion isn't cool.

I also live in the Madison area, and I have never thought about Milwaukee cops only caring about parking tickets and jaywalking. Gee, I thought that Milwaukee PD only cared about the 71 murders, 208 forcible rapes, 3207 robberies, 3853 aggravated assaults, 36562 property crimes, 6409 burglaries, 23615 larceny thefts, 6538 auto thefts, and 317 arsons they handle on a yearly basis. (Source: Uniform Crime Report 2008.)

They handle over 23,000 thefts a year. They simply don't have the manpower to give each person the individual attention that they may deserve.

[Schlitz001]

This sounds really strange to me. Is your uncle a sworn police officer or is he in a non-sworn position like a community service officer?

What about it sounds strange? He is a sworn police officer for at least 15 years now. I haven't spoken to him in a while since I no longer live in Wisconsin, but his specialty was minor infractions like handicap parking. I'd rather not throw his name out there, but there is a nice archived article about him and parking violations on jsonline.com from January 1, 2005.

[dadofandrew]

NYC's crime falling actually made it appear everyone's crime was falling, as NYC is freaking huge.

 

Their ranks have fallen drastically, and others have copied them. It works, and makes perfect sense. I guarantee you if a city leaves graffiti up, they're well behind on other things as well.

[TracyThom]

This sounds really strange to me. Is your uncle a sworn police officer or is he in a non-sworn position like a community service officer?

What about it sounds strange? He is a sworn police officer for at least 15 years now. I haven't spoken to him in a while since I no longer live in Wisconsin, but his specialty was minor infractions like handicap parking. I'd rather not throw his name out there, but there is a nice archived article about him and parking violations on jsonline.com from January 1, 2005.

I'm not familiar with Milwaukee PD at all, but the large police agencies I am familiar with use CSOs to handle parking issues.

 

[DuWayne Steurer]

I live in Madison, but even out here, it's common "knowledge" that Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking. So either that's true, or MPD is bad at public relations. Either way, it's their own fault, not the general public's. Hating people for having an opinion isn't cool.

How would the general populace of Madison have intimate knowledge that Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking? Since it's public perception (in a city 60 miles away) it must be true?

[olliegjw]

MPD is not in charge of issuing parking tickets. I believe it is the Dept. of Public Works that issues most/all parking citations.

[adamb100]

I do not want to this thread to turn into a political one as it will then have a good chance of getting locked/closed.

 

Thanks. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[JJHardy7]

Al,

 

Not trying to be a jerk or anything, but that story is 13 years old. Not saying things have or haven't changed...just sayin'.

[Diskono]

paul253, I think we might be talking about two completely different things. First of all, I never said that I know any of the facts, I thought that was obvious when I said "I'm not really sure if its wrong or not." I never said that I know how much time they spend on parking tickets, or if that number is too high or not. Anyway, none of that is really relevant to what I was trying to say. My point is that, regardless of whether or not its true, many people DO believe that MPD does not have its priorities straight. They will continue to believe that, whether you like it or not...yelling at them and telling them that they're wrong isn't going to change anybody's mind. If anything, it will make them think "my my, aren't we defensive?" and probably reinforce it further.

 

And I completely agree that the police should not be lying to me and giving them false hope when they report a crime. But again, that's beside the point. To give an analogy, my work requires me to research and implement solutions to my customer's technical problems. If my customer calls and asks if something they want to do is possible, I tell them that I'll look into it and get back to them. If I can't find a solution, I need to call them and tell them that it's not doable, or else I upset (and potentially lose) customers. Similarly, a police department is a service, and the people are its

customers whose problems (like a stolen ipod) they are there to solve. Even if there's no news, you need to follow up. That's just basic customer service. I'm not asking them to catch every criminal, I'm asking them to call me

back and say "Sorry, we can't find the guy who took your ipod, but let us know if you find out anything new that might help." The complaints I'm reading here make it sound like theft reports just get filed away, never to be seen again.

 

Because of this, you get stories that go like:

 

Person A: So I went to Milwaukee last week, and my car stereo was stolen!

Person B: Oh no! Did you tell the police?

A: Yeah, filed a report. Haven't heard anything. They must have their hands full, catching those dangerous jaywalkers!

B: Oh, those crazy Milwaukee cops. Hahaha!

 

Re: jaywalking not being illegal - who cares. The other violations that you mentioned are what 99% of the world would consider either jaywalking, or something equally ridiculous. By saying "but jaywalking isn't illegal!", you're just arguing semantics. And if I ever do get a ticket for crossing a street with a red light, I'm going to make fun of that police department mercilessly until the day I die.

 

How

would the general populace of Madison have intimate knowledge that

Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking? Since

it's public perception (in a city 60 miles away) it must be true?

They don't, never said they do. Not arguing that it's true. That's exactly why I put "knowledge" in quotation marks - no idea if its true, but people think it is.

I also live in the Madison area, and I have never

thought about Milwaukee cops only caring about parking tickets and

jaywalking. Gee, I thought that Milwaukee PD only cared about the 71

murders, 208 forcible rapes, 3207 robberies, 3853 aggravated assaults,

36562 property crimes, 6409 burglaries, 23615 larceny thefts, 6538 auto

thefts, and 317 arsons they handle on a yearly basis. (Source: Uniform

Crime Report 2008.)

They handle over 23,000

thefts a year. They simply don't have the manpower to give each person

the individual attention that they may deserve.

Not sure what you're getting at here. You haven't thought about it, so its impossible for anybody else to have?

[homer]

NYC's crime falling actually made it appear everyone's crime was falling, as NYC is freaking huge.

 

Their ranks have fallen drastically, and others have copied them. It works, and makes perfect sense. I guarantee you if a city leaves graffiti up, they're well behind on other things as well.

Taking graffiti down has nothing to do with focusing on small crimes.

[Invader3K]

So, did you track down this guy yet?

[paul253]

Diskono....from what I gather by reading your post, I get the impression that you are just fine with blindly repeating false generalizations about certain groups of people. When I correct you on those generalizations, you basically say "I don't care, I'm going to keep repeating them anyway". I'm not yelling at you or anything, but yes, I am telling you that you are wrong. When someone comes on here and says they got mugged and called the police, and you reply "don't expect them to do anything because they are too busy writing parking tickets" is insulting to the people that put their lives on the line every night to keep people like you safe. Then to come back and claim you have respect for them is an insult to the intelligence to whoever it is you are saying that to. It's not semantics....I am telling you to get your facts straight before you repeat something that is blatantly incorrect. The reason people will continue to believe it is because people like you continue to repeat it even though you admit you have no idea if it's true or not.

If my customer calls and asks if something they want to do is possible, I

tell them that I'll look into it and get back to them. If I can't find

a solution, I need to call them and tell them that it's not doable, or

else I upset (and potentially lose) customers. Similarly, a police

department is a service, and the people are its

customers whose problems (like a stolen ipod) they are there to solve.

Even if there's no news, you need to follow up. That's just basic

customer service. I'm not asking them to catch every criminal, I'm

asking them to call me

back and say "Sorry, we can't find the guy who took your ipod, but let

us know if you find out anything new that might help."

 

I could not disagree with you any more. In your business, you are polite and nice and make call backs and do whatever else it is you do because if the people you are dealing with aren't satisfied they will stop giving you business. You do it for your own sake. If you are not satisfied with how the police handle a case, you are still going to call them the next time you need their services. You are not a customer. You are either a victim or a complainant. And what is the point of calling you back to tell you nothing is new? If I got that call I'd be like "well then why are you calling me?" I go back to my case. The suburban department I dealt with did not call me back. So again, it's not an MPD thing, its a police thing. Some may call you back with updates, but I'd guess the majority would not, especially for something as minor as a car break in. As one of the other posters noted, there are like 36,000 property crimes a year in the city. Do you really expect the police to call back every single victim to tell them they haven't caught the guy yet? You're not being realistic. It seems like you are directing your anger at the police instead of at the person who stole your girlfriend's possessions.

 

The complaints

I'm reading here make it sound like theft reports just get filed away,

never to be seen again.

You know what, I'm sure a lot of them do. You need leads/evidence to proceed with an investigation. If you have none, you're stuck and there's really nothing for you to do. I ask you this, if I come out and see my car was broken into, and there were no witness and no cameras in the area, what exactly are they supposed to do? Keep in mind that fingerprints don't prove anything.

[Point Beer Is Best]

So, did you track down this guy yet?

I came here to find out the same thing, but I somehow stumbled onto the political forum. Maybe those parties involved would like to take this discussion over there?

[adamb100]

I called the officer twice and kept getting kicked to a voice mail. He hasnt called back either.

[bucks2281]

There are plenty of related offenses that are illegal, such as walking down the street (as opposed to walking on the sidewalk), or not yielding the right of way to traffic at controlled intersections i.e. walking against a red light which causes traffic to have to stop for you. But simply "jaywalking" isn't a violation.

 

Actually, IIRC, the MPD conducted a "jaywalking sting" at Marquette last semester after a student got hit by a car.

[paul253]

Actually, IIRC, the MPD conducted a "jaywalking sting" at Marquette last semester after a student got hit by a car.

Well whatever. Who called it "jaywalking"....the cops or the general public? I put my definition of jaywalking out there and I stand by the fact that simply crossing the street outside of a crosswalk is not illegal. If someone can find proof otherwise, I'll gladly admit that I was mistaken. The streets around MU are all pretty busy, especially during the day, so I imagine a lot of the people who cross anywhere other than a controlled intersection do in fact obstruct traffic when they cross, which would be illegal. I never meant to hijack this thread so I'll let it go. I just wanted to point out how irresponsible that one statement was, particularly the part about the parking tickets.

[DuWayne Steurer]

 

 

How

would the general populace of Madison have intimate knowledge that

Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking? Since

it's public perception (in a city 60 miles away) it must be true?

They don't, never said they do. Not arguing that it's true. That's exactly why I put "knowledge" in quotation marks - no idea if its true, but people think it is.

Well, ..........

I live in Madison, but even out here, it's common "knowledge" that

Milwaukee cops only care about parking tickets and jaywalking. So

either that's true, or MPD is bad at public relations. Either way, it's

their own fault, not the general public's. Hating people for having an

opinion isn't cool.

 

So what you're saying is, that the Milwaukee PD should be putting energy towards improving their public perception in Madison, because the "perception" that people in Madison have is that the only thing Milwaukee cops care about is writing jaywalking tickets? By saying "so either it's true, or it's bad public relations", you're opening it up for people to ask the question I did. How would people in Madison (or any other area away from Milwaukee) have this intimate "knowledge" of what Milwaukee cops are or aren't doing? You throw out a gross generalization, back it up with nothing, and then say "I didn't say that" when you're called on it. I don't hate someone for having an opinion, but forming it on baseless heresay is pretty weak. You've basically said that the MPD has done *something* to deserve this reputation, but can back the statement up with nothing, and wonder why some take umbrage at that.

 

When I worked in Milwaukee, my job required regular interaction with Milwaukee city and Milwaukee county officers and sherrifs. I never got the impression that I was in imminent danger of getting a parking ticket (of which I've gotten 3 in Madison) or a jaywalking ticket.

[homer]

Actually, IIRC, the MPD conducted a "jaywalking sting" at Marquette last semester after a student got hit by a car.

Well whatever. Who called it "jaywalking"....the cops or the general public? I put my definition of jaywalking out there and I stand by the fact that simply crossing the street outside of a crosswalk is not illegal. If someone can find proof otherwise, I'll gladly admit that I was mistaken.

It is illegal to cross the street outside the designated crosswalks. Ask White Sox GM Kenny Williams or Manny Ramirez:

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/m...ywalking-?urn=mlb-182055