Should the Brewers retire Trevor Hoffman's number someday?

[dadofandrew]

Fingers was 4, Sutton was 3. The Brewers, by not retiring Cecil Cooper's number, and Gantner's too, I suppose, have all but said the HoF is the deciding factor. I suppose Aaron's was related to the Braves, but that's strange, as so many fine players, Spahn and Matthews, are ignored because they did not finish up with the Brewers.

[Invader3K]

Well, Aaron his hit final home run as a Brewer and held that record for many years, so I think it was worth retiring his number.

[BrewCrewForever]

I would retire Cooper's #15 before Hoffman's #51. Not a knock on Trevor, but he has only been here two seasons and this year he really wasn't even all that good.

[dlk9s]

A more interesting question would be Edmonds, if he were to make it.

Wait, are you saying that you are wondering if Edmonds' number should be retired by the Brewers if he makes the HOF?

[MNBrew]

Don Sutton is in the HOF -- pitched three seasons, and in the WS for the Brewers -- I don't ever think the Brewers even considered retiring #27

Uh, Sutton wore #21 as a Brewer, not #27. Pete Ladd wore #27.

 

He would've worn the #20 as he did for all those years w/ the Dodgers except that that was Gorman Thomas' number.

[trwi7]

I would retire Cooper's #15 before Hoffman's #51. Not a knock on Trevor, but he has only been here two seasons and this year he really wasn't even all that good.

 

I would retire pretty much every player who played 5+ years for the Brewers over Hoffman. Playing two years for a team in your 20ish year career, no matter what you accomplished in those two years does not warrant retiring a number. Considering Hoffman has a 3.75 ERA and 107 ERA+ as a Brewer, there shouldn't even be consideration.

 

Maybe we should retire Francisco Cordero's #48 someday.

[TheEndless7]

I agree, his number shouldn't be retired.

 

That said, I think I'd be somewhat disappointed if they didn't put up something in the concourse somewhere about his career and his 600th save being here. Like one of those plaque's and small exhibits. Because while he will always be a Padre, he did reach a rather huge milestone as a Brewer, and I think we should honor that somehow.

[Fatter than Joey]

Don Sutton is in the HOF -- pitched three seasons, and in the WS for the Brewers -- I don't ever think the Brewers even considered retiring #27

Uh, Sutton wore #21 as a Brewer, not #27. Pete Ladd wore #27.

 

He would've worn the #20 as he did for all those years w/ the Dodgers except that that was Gorman Thomas' number.

Whoops -- you are right -- Sutton wore #27 for the Angels and not the Brewers -- actually Sutton wore #20 once Gorman got traded to Cleveland.

[MNBrew]

Sutton wore #27 for the Angels and not the Brewers -- actually Sutton wore #20 once Gorman got traded to Cleveland.

One of my best friends from HS of course argues that the trade of Gorman was actually the beginning of the end. Not sure if it was Sutton taking #20, Manning taking over CF, or just the Curse of Stormin' Gorman.

 

(Side note: I was at the game on Sunday, June 5th, 1983, against Cleveland solely for the white RC Cola-sponsored commemorative batting helmet giveaway which also happened to be Gorman's last game before being traded. So if you've ever seen those batting helmets, now you know they were given away at Gorman's last game as a Brewer (prior to his brief return in '86 -- I was also at his first game back at County Stadium). I gave away the batting helmet many years ago but just happened into another recently solely by chance -- and also for free -- and that's now a family keepsake that's not going anywhere.)

 

Sorry for the digression. I love what Hoffman did last year. But the one great year alone is not worthy of retiring a number, even though he also accomplished #600 as a Brewer.

 

Added point: Also, if Fingers' couple great Brewers years hadn't overlapped the team's best 2 years, or if he were only going into the HOF now vs. when he did, or if there were already some career Brewers already in the HOF when Fingers got inducted, I'm sure there'd still be Brewers wearing #34. Rollie was great for 2 years, but in hindsight, the Brewers really shouldn't have retired his number.

[Bikeage77]

I asked this earlier in the thread, with no answers. I went to two games since the 600th save, and called the ticket office for some answers.

 

The Brewers have no plans on giving out a 5x8 or 8x10 card stock that reads "I was there for Trevor Hoffman's 600th save" as they did with Robin Yount's 3000th hit, and Nolan Ryan's 300th win. I went into all three major gift shops and asked about them, mostly to tell the employees to tell their boss or manager that the Brewers should do that, for the fans at the game.

Most of the employees had no idea that they did this for Yount or Ryan. So it took some explaining for them to figure it out.

 

The Brewers waste all that money on printing up coupons and give out free Game Day programs, how much could it really cost to print up 30,000 pieces of cardstock? 500 bucks? maybe?

 

Oh, but you can by a 300 dollar signed lithograph. Grrr.

[Invader3K]

Bikeage, I guess I don't see that as being a big deal. I'd have no interest in some cheap little cardboard sign, personally.

[Bikeage77]

I dunno, they didn't have a giant banner counting Yount to 3000....granted Yount is Mr Brewer, but they still made a huge deal about Hoffman reaching 600...the least they could do is hand out a piece of paper at the end...i guess I'm just dissapointed since I was at those other two games, and both were milestones, but 600 saves hadn't been done before

[CheezWizHed]

Just happened to read that Wade Bogg's 3000 hit was a HR. So to commemorate it, the TB Rays changed that seat from the normal blue to yellow and left a plaque at the spot the ball landed.

 

Something on that level would seem appropriate. The fact that the memorable event took place here by our team has more meaning in this instance, IMO.

[Invader3K]

Just happened to read that Wade Bogg's 3000 hit was a HR. So to commemorate it, the TB Rays changed that seat from the normal blue to yellow and left a plaque at the spot the ball landed.

 

Something on that level would seem appropriate. The fact that the memorable event took place here by our team has more meaning in this instance, IMO.

Yeah, and the Rays retired Boggs' number eventually as well (the only "Ray" to have his number retired so far). Just sayin'...

[endaround]

A more relevant question is would the Brewers retire Sabathia's number if he makes the HoF

[Invader3K]

A more relevant question is would the Brewers retire Sabathia's number if he makes the HoF

Well, now that would be a real stretch. Three and a half months as a Brewer...probably not.

[endaround]

Right, but it was a lot of innings and there were really important innings. If he got the no hitter....

[DuWayne Steurer]

Someone else said it first, but I'll repeat it. No Don Sutton, no Trevor Hoffman. Sutton helped us get to a World Series. Hoffman helped us........stay below .500 two years in a row. Granted, he was very good in 2009, but still, achieving a milestone that was mostly achieved in another city is not worthy of number retirement.

 

At least Sutton helped the TEAM achieve a goal.

[GAME05]

I agree with RoCo. it's out of the player's control, but if a player's number were to be retired, i'd like there to be some strong memories attached to it, like being able to tell your kid about 15 years later and beam with nostalgia about how great he was. Hoffman getting his 600th with Milwaukee goes down more in the annals of a trivia question than a player who was so good for Milwaukee that we can't use his number anymore.

[gregmag]

I think retiring Fingers' number was a mistake. As great a career as he had, and as important as he was to the team, I just don't think he was here long enough. I would go with the "Hall of Famer who spent a substantial amount of his productive career with the team" standard. Aaron is a special case, because you can fairly substitute "in the city" for "with the team." Jackie Robinson is a designated special case. That gives you Aaron, Yount, Molitor, Jackie Robinson. I don't think anybody else is close.

[GAME05]

an AL Championship is a special case, too.

[dlk9s]

I think numbers should be retired if the player was terrible. Like he stunk so badly that the team doesn't want another player to suffer through wearing the same number.

 

So...Ben Hendrickson's #40 shall be hoisted to the rafters!

[gregmag]

an AL Championship is a special case, too.

So what's your point? Do we require Cooper's number as well? Thomas' number? Those guys had much more (per WAR, the naked eye, whatever you like) to do with that championship than Fingers did. So did Oglivie, Simmons, and Vuckovich, although Fingers was closer to them than to the other guys.

 

I guess you might mean "HOF + key role in one championship = retired number." I've always thought that was the logic with Fingers, and I get it. I just don't agree; I don't think it's enough. The case for Fingers is only slightly stronger on that basis than the case for Sutton, and I wouldn't retire Sutton's number either. Would you retire Simmons' number if the veterans' committee put him in the Hall of Fame? Could happen.

[Fatter than Joey]

I've always thought that was the logic with Fingers, and I get it.

 

Fingers was an insanely popular Brewer as well. Hoffman isn't even close to that level. Sutton was never that popular. Fingers may have been more popular than any other Brewer that played in 1982.

[WestSideWillie]

however, there should be a spot at the ball park or on the walk for special achievements, 600 saves, Vuke's Cy Young,

Listach Rookie of the Year, Sutton's Hall of Fame, etc. Some special location or interest, that would be neat.