is anyone concerned about Gamel?

[dadofandrew]

It is recommended you use a 3 year sample of UZR because of its small sample nature. If you look at a month, a couple phantom Miller Park errors can make a huge difference. That's why Weeks, being almost at 0 is a huge accomplishment, and indicates his vast improvement. He's now very quick at turning two and accurate, while he used to be slow and often off target.

 

Those that still want him moved to the OF are living in the past. He's now plenty capable, if not average. I always find it ironic so many want to promote players before they are ready, and then complain when they make mistakes of immaturity in their first 2-3 seasons, and want to move them to yet another position they have to learn. Escobar is 23 and already a solid player, albeit a bit below average with the bat. As he nears his peak of 26-29, he'll be better. Considering he costs near the minimum, slightly below average is perfectly acceptable.

 

UZR has the Brewers -6 runs on defense this year. Every team in MLB is between +10 and -10. You can argue their defense is horrible and has cost them dozens of games, but the numbers do not show that to be the case. SEA has proven defense, at best, is a distant 3rd to offense and pitching.

[Never Outhustled]

Colby Rasmus has a negative UZR/150 in CF this year.

Yet just like with Carlos Gomez you'll tell me that a partial season of UZR is useless and that Rasmus is playing great defense as always and that I know nothing about UZR right?

Carlos Gomez has a career UZR/150 of 13.5 over about 2660 innings in CF. Colby Rasmus has a career UZR/150 of 4.6 over about 1720 in CF. I would say Rasmus is about average and Gomez is above average.

 

Both players numbers are down this year because both players have defended poorly. Now, this isn't meant to be an indicator of future success, but the results have been correctly reported by UZR is both cases.

[colbyjack]

I've always thought of Gamel as somewhat of a Lyle Overbay hitter, one that works the count, gets on base, drives in runs, but likely will hit a lot more doubles than home runs over the course of his career, and yet still have the power potential to hit 20-25 a season. I know Overbay's career started pretty late, as he was first called up when he was 24 but didn't play full-time until he was 27. He was a college draftee, so his career in relationship to Gamel's was roughly 2-3 years off since Gamel attended junior college.

 

Anyway, here are Overbay's numbers at AAA and AA, as he spent quite a bit of time in the upper levels of the minors before finally sticking at the MLB level, getting his chance to do so with the Brewers replacing Richie Sexson:

 

AAA, 2 seasons, 644 total AB: .332/.400/.519

AA, 2 seasons, 776 AB: .350/.422/.530

 

And here are Gamel's across those two levels, up to yesterday's performance:

 

AAA, 3 seasons, 523 AB: .289/.370/.474

AA, 2 seasons, 536 AB: .332/.399/.539

 

Gamel's AAA numbers are down from Overbay's, but he has also been dealing with injury earlier this year. Overbay also played at for two teams, El Paso (AA) and Tucson (AAA) that have always been known for inflated offensive numbers.

 

Of course how the numbers finally translate has nothing to do with how similar they are to Overbay's, I just bring it up as some solace to the likelihood of losing Prince, particularly since Overbay is a player we're all familiar with. Hopefully moving forward we'll see an increase in production in CF, SS and C due to the progression of Cain, Escobar and Lucroy to help make up for the loss in Fielder's productivity, not to mention the improvement in pitching that we're all expecting to receive in return.

[Never Outhustled]

I still don't see the point of moving Gamel to another position when the 3B is the very mediocre Casey McGehee.Get a top defensive RF, move 1 of the 1Bs we presently have playing the OF to 1B, and trade McGehee for a pitcher.

[dadofandrew]

Gamel is certainly the odds on favorite to be starting in MIL somewhere next year, 1B/LF/RF. Overbay is likely a good comp, as he won't hit 40 HR's, but may hit 25 HR's and 40+ doubles, and have a solid OBP.

[uwisfan]

Gamel is certainly the odds on favorite to be starting in MIL somewhere next year, 1B/LF/RF. Overbay is likely a good comp, as he won't hit 40 HR's, but may hit 25 HR's and 40+ doubles, and have a solid OBP.

I dont know where LF came from... did you mean 3B? Braun aint going anywhere. If Melvin can deal Prince, then Gamel comes up; otherwise, he'll be blocked. I doubt they get much for McGehee, and I dont think the Crew should deal someone that cheap that is average. If they cant deal Prince or McGehee, he could end up at 3B again until he forces the issue.

[Never Outhustled]

 

I dont know where LF came from... did you mean 3B? Braun aint going anywhere.

I could see Braun at 1B, but your right that it won't be so Gamel can play LF.

 

 

I doubt they get much for McGehee, and I dont think the Crew should deal someone that cheap that is average.

I think they could get something for McGehee, because he's cheap and average. That could appeal to a team like Florida, with a tight budget, no 3B, and arby eligible starting pitchers.

[HiAndTight]

If Hart goes to first, then suddenly Gamel's defense will improve dramatically. Having a fat 5'10" first baseman with a small wingspan is a huge disadvantage when Hart is 6'6" with a longer wingspan. Hart could be like a Derek Lee at first base.

Agreed, I understand that 1B is pretty far down on the list as far as defensive value goes, but I think it's pretty highly underrated. You look at what Derek Lee does for the Cubs, or did as I haven't paid as close of attention to them this year, but he saves that IF a lot of outs and a lot of runs. Now it's obviously a bit ambitious to expect Hart to be able to do that right out of the gate, but he should be a substantial upgrade from Prince after he gets back in the groove.

[wibadgers23]

Maybe I'm alone here, but it's sad to see Gamel still in the minors. I can't help but think if he doesn't get an opportunity in Milwaukee at some point next year, then maybe it's time to trade him to an organization that will give him a legit chance in the big leagues. I guess it all hinges on whether Prince is traded in the offseason. If not, Gamel will spend another worthless year in the minors.

[TooLiveBrew]

If Prince isn't traded this offseason imo Gamel will be, which would probably be a mistake.

[pete]

Both players numbers are down this year because both players have defended poorly. Now, this isn't meant to be an indicator of future success, but the results have been correctly reported by UZR is both cases.

 

 

You think Gomez has been a poor defender and that Rasmus has played differently than other years? What makes you think that?

[dadofandrew]

He's just using UZR improperly, as defined by Fangraphs themselves.

 

It'd be like using data from Cain right now.

[Never Outhustled]

He's just using UZR improperly, as defined by Fangraphs themselves.

 

It'd be like using data from Cain right now.

 

 

There ya go, 3 games is equal to 3/4 of a season, that seems logical.

[TooLiveBrew]

Awesome to see Gamel continuing to rake. If only the org. could find a way to get him on the MLB field. I don't think McGehee is anything special but he has started hitting again lately.

[HiAndTight]

Maybe I'm alone here, but it's sad to see Gamel still in the minors. I can't help but think if he doesn't get an opportunity in Milwaukee at some point next year, then maybe it's time to trade him to an organization that will give him a legit chance in the big leagues. I guess it all hinges on whether Prince is traded in the offseason. If not, Gamel will spend another worthless year in the minors.

I don't think they'll keep Gamel in AAA again next year unless his play in ST'ing obviously warrants it, ie, getting hurt again and not telling the team or taking care of his properly or just having an awful camp.

 

I do really hope the Brewers don't view McGehee as their future 3B though. To me it'd be foolish to put McGehee at 3rd and Gamel at 1st. They have to see how much Gamel's improved, and how much brighter his future looks than McGehee's(though Casey's proven me wrong so far, I still can't find it in myself to be convinced he's just going to be a perennial .280-ish/.350 ~.800 OPS guy who can hit 25 or so a year.

 

Not to mention I think those are the low ends for Gamel.

[HiAndTight]

He's just using UZR improperly, as defined by Fangraphs themselves.

 

It'd be like using data from Cain right now.

 

 

There ya go, 3 games is equal to 3/4 of a season, that seems logical.

No, of course not. But it's pretty much universally agreed that 3/4's of a season is NOT enough time to get any useful information from UZR.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Well Gamel is crushing AAA pitching. He is hitting .368 and has a .444OBP and an OPS of 1.181 in his last 10 games. Is Gamel still playing RF/1B? or is he back at 3B? It's a matter of time till he is called up... He has to be back at top prospect status, right?

[Invader3K]

Checking recent box scores, it looks like he's back to playing 3B primarily.

[Tedaldtada]

Yes, Mat Gamel is, and pretty much always was, a top hitting prospect.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Checking recent box scores, it looks like he's back to playing 3B primarily.

I thought he was moved for defensive reasons to RF/1B.. Why move him back? Considering that McGehee is doing very well at 3B it makes no sense. Gamel is blocked at 3B.

[And That]

Gamel is going to receive playing (and practice) time at all three positions for the remainder of the year. He was never "moved" to 1B or RF.

[PrinceFielderx1]

Gamel is going to receive playing (and practice) time at all three positions for the remainder of the year. He was never "moved" to 1B or RF.

Thanks for the clarification.

[kramnoj]

Bref has Gamel with 2 games at 1B and 4 games in RF this year.

[thebruce44]

Checking recent box scores, it looks like he's back to playing 3B primarily.

I thought he was moved for defensive reasons to RF/1B.. Why move him back? Considering that McGehee is doing very well at 3B it makes no sense. Gamel is blocked at 3B.

 

I don't know if I can agree with the bolded part.

[TooLiveBrew]

Once he got back to full health, Gamel has ripped apart AAA pitching just like he did last season prior to getting called up & sent back to AAA. It's good to see and all, but this guy belongs in a major league lineup, not AAA. I just hope it's the Brewers' lineup & not someone else's.