Milwaukee Bucks 2010/2011

[monkeyman343434]

I'm actually worried that team team is a little too deep currently. I would think there has to be a trade in the works. There's 240 minutes/game to distribute. Just to throw out some guesses off the top of my head :

Jennings - 32

Dooling - 16

Salmons - 28

Delfino - 28

Maggette - 28

LRMBM - 25

Ilyaslova - 25

Gooden - 28

Bogut - 30

 

That leaves no minutes for CDR, Sanders, Brockman, Gallon, Hobson, or whoever else may be on the team.

[davego]

If things go well, those guy you list will not need to get many minutes this year.

 

I'm not sure what the Kings were thinking, but whatever.

[rwa12]

JJ Reddick would have a hard time being anything but a pure specialist in Skiles system. Given all his improvements, he still can't cover his shadow. We already have one pure offensive player in Maggette. Gooden is signed to a reasonable, movable contract. He strikes me as a Juwon Howard type, who put up consistent numbers forever on bad teams. He may not be "tough", but he is good on the offensive glass, and is an aggressive rebounder, from my observation.

 

As far as the numbers breakdown, I see Delfino taking a more limited role, and LRMAM being used as a stopper. Too much depth is a good thing. I think Gallon and Hobson see significant DLeague time this year. I will also be surprised if Sanders gets a lot of early run. His offense is raw, and against actual players, he should have trouble scoring. I'm glad he had a nice summer league, but I don't believe it has any bearing on his season. He is great defensively, but not sure he can match up well with the bigger NBA 4's right away.

 

I agree with the Ham comparison on Brockman, I expect him to be a 10 mpg energy guy at first.

[Gobias Industries]

JJ Reddick would have a hard time being anything but a pure specialist in Skiles system. Given all his improvements, he still can't cover his shadow.

Stan Van Gundy's system and Skiles' system are nearly identical. Defend the paint with a dominant big man and d up the corner 3, kick it in to your post player on O and shoot the corner 3. Reddick has improved as a defender. I doubt he's below avg. He's still getting a bad rep from his first few years.

[Diskono]

I thought he was our starting power forward? He may not even be the backup center. I don't know if this has been posted here or whether I read it on Real GM but Gooden hasn't been particularly good playing the center position and has stated that he doesn't like playing the center position. I hope the Bucks didn't give him that contract because he physically can play center and backup Bogut. They could sign any stiff to be the backup center, or go with Brockman or Sanders or re-sign Thomas.

I think Gooden's primary role is going to be PF, but he's probably the most qualified to play C when Bogut is not on the court. No point in signing a generic 7' stiff, most of them aren't much better than having nobody out there. I feel pretty comfortable with Gooden/Sanders/Brockman at backup C. At least, it sounds better than what we've had in recent years.

[FVBrewerFan]

Brockman and Sanders are a pipe dream to play center this year or ever. Depending on the team you're playing, you may not even need a center. But teams that DO have a true center, you need someone to play some minutes at center when Bogut is on the bench. Not to mention if Bogut is injured. To expect guys like Sanders or Brockman to fill that role is unrealistic.

 

I'm not even saying Gooden would be a great center on either end of the court, but better than anything they had in that role last year. And to be clear, I understand he may very well start at PF. But depending on the opponent, as the game progresses I would expect him to be on the court when Bogut is on the bench. Actually doesn't even matter on the offensive end what you call him. but on the defensive end, who's going to guard Garnett, Howard, etc. when Bogut is injured or on the bench? Gooden for the most part.

[Paulus88]

Brockman played center last year, even guarding Howard. Also Sanders' greatest defensive skill right now is help defense, which is generally most effective from the center position. I also think that right now both profile better offensively as centers/garbagemen.

 

Frankly the idea that Gooden would be defending Howard or Garnett is just as scary as Brockman or Sanders.

[davego]

Obviously I never coached at anything close to this level, but there are other ways to defend bigs. It doesn't have to be one-on-one. I'd suspect there are viable in-game plans on how to squeeze the opposing center when Andrew is out.

 

If Bogut gets hurt, there is an issue. I wouldn't be stunned if there is another deal for a back-up 5. However, I hope its not to get a big body as was pointed out above.

[brwrsfan]

Does anyone know what Kurt Thomas is thinking of doing? Is it completely out of the realm that he could return? I mean, he's not great but he's definitely a serviceable backup that can give some minutes. He would be pretty cheap, knows the guys, the system and might have some veteran influence or teachings for some of the younger big guys we've accumulated.

[gobrew23]

I don't have a link, but word is Kurt Thomas signed a one-year deal with the Bulls today.

[danzig6767]

OKC and HOU are the best run franchises and probably have the most

advanced FO's in the league. The fact that they stayed out of the

craziness speaks volumes to me.

I hope Gooden buys into the system but I'm doubting it. That's why I

hate going 5 yrs so much. He could very possibly be the #3 or 4 PF

after year 1. Plus, as I mentioned, we need a 3 pt specialist badly.

I'd have much rather given Reddick 5/32 than Gooden. Anthony Morrow,

the best 3 pt shooter in the league, got 3/12 from the Nets. All of the

crazy bad contracts were given out before the big 3 signed, which is

exactly the opposite of what everyone else predicted.

 

Actually Oklahoma City has a full roster and just signed Royal Ivey to put them at 16. Houston matched an offer to pay Kyle Lowry $6M a year to backup Aaron Brooks, and they paid Luis Scola (who may be a better player than Gooden, but he's also 2 years older) over $9M a year for the next five years. Oh and they will be paying a 37 year old Brad Miller $5M a year in the 2012-2013 season. So, they didn't really stay out of the craziness.

 

I'll say it again, Mid Level Exception. If he's the #3 or #4 PF after year 1, it means that the Bucks have a good problem, not really that Drew Gooden = Dan Gadzuric.

I don't like the Gooden signing regardless if it's for the MLE, but do agree to many people are going overboard in calling the signing Gadzuric part two. Gadzuric was a contract that couldn't be moved for so long not just because of the dollars/years on the contract, it was also because he had no skills at all on the court that could be attractive to other teams. Gooden for his shortcomings is at least a good rebounder and can score decently, it's partly why he's been on so many teams. Granted, none of his previous teams ever had to try and trade him while on a long term contract at 6 million per, but if after a year or two the Bucks want to move Gooden, it shouldn't be some near impossible task as Gadzuric and his contract was.

[Roscoe Chill]

Yes, it's funny how if Dan Gadzuric averaged 12 points and 8 boards a game throughout his career, his contract wouldn't have been so unmovable. Weird.

[Gobias Industries]

Gadz averaged 7 and 8 in his contract year at a much more premier position, and was considered to still have some upside. No one could predict the future and know he would be useless for a majority of it.

 

Sure, Gooden's contract might be movable after year 2, but that's only if this current team sinks like the 2006 squad and has to blow it up. So yes, technically he could be traded with an attractive piece in some kind of salary dump. But are teams going to want him outright after year 2? No. Definitely Not. Unless his contract gets reworked during the upcoming lockout.

[jjkoestler]

Off topic question.... Are there any season ticket holders here? Are the perks worth purchasing a full/half season? How difficult is it to sell tickets for games you cannot attend? I typically just buy tickets (way below face) from scalpers, craigslist, or when the Bucks have specials.

[patrickgpe]

the bucks have been trying to get me to sign up for a season ticket plan for a while and i haven't. Until tickets become hard to get I will take advantage of the tv deals and all of the specials the bucks put on their website. There were games last year that we got a 28 dollar ticket and a bucks jersey for 20 bucks.

[greeg35]

No one could predict the future and know he would be useless for a majority of it.

That's funny, I was always under the impression that Larry H was the only one that thought Gadz had any future. Seemed obvious that he had no fundamental skills whatsoever, and I'm not talking about boxing out or post moves, I'm talking about the ability to catch a ball. The day we signed Gadz (and consequently waived goodbye to a VERY solid player in Pachulia) I threw pillows in frustration.

[Roscoe Chill]

Sure, Gadzuric had a decent year that ONE year. Gooden's still done better than that every year in his entire career. It's kind of ridiculous even to compare the two other than the money they make/made. So the Bucks wouldn't be able to get rid of the contract after the second year? Who cares? I don't think they signed him to a five year deal hoping to unload him in two even though I know what you're getting at as far as the 'asset' part of the situation. The bottom line is that it's not that bad of a contract. He's a pretty good player. There are some people that don't like him all that much around here, fine. He's still not going to be a waste of a roster spot making $6M a season.

[Paulus88]

I've made an allusion to the Gadzuric contract in comparison to Gooden's. Gooden is by far the superior player. However in today's NBA the most important thing is to not have bad/unmovable contracts.

 

My comparison to the Gadzuric contract is that I don't think Gooden's contract is going to be moveable in two years. If all goes to plan Sanders and Illyasova eat into Gooden's minutes. In two years he'll be a 30 year old 8 and 5 guy, who's a knucklehead on defense, and has three years at six per left on his deal. I don't see a market for that, especially if the new CBA reigns in mid level deals.

[Gobias Industries]

greeg35: I didn't want Gadz signed either (I was a Zaza guy as well. Bucks thought his game was too similar to Bogut's), but at the end of the day, C's get paid. Even ones who just show a glimpse of potential....Gortat, Jerome James, Amir Johnson, McAlvine. I could go on forever.

 

Paulus88 hit the nail on the head for me. If you believe in the rookie you just spent a 1st rounder on and one of your more clutch players from last year, you don't go out and sign a Drew Gooden for 5 years. If you believe in your prior moves he should be a 3rd stringer playing 18 minutes a game a year from now, which would be a tough piece to unload when the guy's owed 4/26m.

[JJHardy7]

I've made an allusion to the Gadzuric contract in comparison to Gooden's. Gooden is by far the superior player. However in today's NBA the most important thing is to not have bad/unmovable contracts.

 

FWIW, ESPN Insider lists the Bucks as the 2nd best off-season and even notes Gooden's deal isn't bad compared to other comparable players that received deals this off-season. Again, not saying Gooden is an all-star, but I actually think it might be good 'value' given the craziness of other deals. It's easy to knock it, but just look at what other comparable players got in terms of money...

[Gobias Industries]

JJhardy7: I believe that write up was by John Hollinger, who has always been more bullish on Gooden because he has a decent PER and is a good rebounder. Obviously, Maggette scores really high on PER as well.

 

It's gonna be very interesting to see if the new guys are gonna fit into Skiles' system. Very excited for the season.

[Diskono]

Gadzuric was 27 when he signed that contract*, so he really shouldn't have been considered a prospect at that point. Heck, Gooden is only a year older than that now, and he's had a pretty long track record already. I have no doubt Gooden will decline, but I doubt he'll come anywhere near Gadz-like levels of uselessness.

 

Fun fact: Zaza is *still* younger than Gadz was when that extension was signed.

[JJHardy7]

JJhardy7: I believe that write up was by John Hollinger, who has always been more bullish on Gooden because he has a decent PER and is a good rebounder. Obviously, Maggette scores really high on PER as well.

 

It was. I just think it means this isn't some crazy signing that experts are proclaiming was awful. Will it work? We'll see, but given again what others got in the market I don't think it was a bad signing. I'd prefer it not guaranteed or fewer years, but this is a much better player IMO than Danny G. That contract was ripped on immediately.

 

I do wish we would've signed Zaza over Danny G back then.

[Hofbraunhaus]

Bucks open the season at New Orleans on October 27 and the home opener is October 30 against Charlotte.

[trwi7]

The schedule from late November through early January is one of the most brutal stretches I can remember.

 

@ Utah

@ Denver

Orlando

Miami

Indiana

Houston

@ Dallas

@ San Antonio

Utah

@ Portland

@ LA Lakers

@ Sacramento

Atlanta

@ Chicago

Dallas

@ Miami

@ Orlando

Miami