If we're still out of it in July...

[ELCABALLO45]

Ozzie has had Mark Kotsay, hes THAT Mark Kotsay bat 5th all year. He also has been leading off Juan Pierre most of the year and Andruw Jones lead off last night. Please no Ozzie.

Batting order is rather meaningless.

How so?

 

[nate82]

Ozzie Guillen as Brewers manager would be epic. I would love to see it happen.

No thanks his antics would get old rather fast. I would rather just go with Randolph it looks as though the Brewers palyers respect Randolph more than they do Macha at this time.

[brewmann04]

ok mybe another hint the name in Bristol is B.V

[Funketown]

Batting order is rather meaningless.

Just because it doesn't make as much of a difference as some make it out to does not make it meaningless.

[rluzinski]

I would find it very difficult to root for a Brewer's team with Ozzie Guillen running the show.

 

As for first base, there's a reason why it's the last stop before DH. It's the easiest position to learn and play.

[sheethead]

I would find it very difficult to root for a Brewer's team with Ozzie Guillen running the show.

 

That's how I feel with Ken Macha running the show.

 

And I said rather meaningless, not completely meaningless. It is rather meaningless. With the obvious exceptions, it doesn't really make a significant difference where batters hit in the lineup, just so they hit.

[Funketown]

I would find it very difficult to root for a Brewer's team with Ozzie Guillen running the show.

 

That's how I feel with Ken Macha running the show.

 

And I said rather meaningless, not completely meaningless. It is rather meaningless. With the obvious exceptions, it doesn't really make a significant difference where batters hit in the lineup, just so they hit.

But the thing is putting someone like Pierre in the lead-off hole when you have much better candidates for those plate appearances is like seeing a five dollar bill on the ground and not picking it up. The Sox's optimal lineup might only produce 10-15 runs more than their typical lineups throughout the course of the season, but at the cost of writing players names in different spots, it seems to be a waste of resources not to put out the best line up.

 

Edit: typo

[MJLiverock]

Actually looking at the White Sox lineup, Pierre may well be the best lead off option. His OBP is .316 but there aren't a whole lot better options on that team. Rios is at .378 and Konerko is at .394 but they end up more as the #3 and #4 hitters. The only other guys better than Pierre are Andrew Jones at .340 but he doesn't play everyday and then the 3rd base combo of Teahen/Vizquel who are at .340/.318 in limited AB's. Out of the everyday players Pierre has the 3rd best OBP on the team.

[sheethead]

What MJ said.

[yfinn6]

ok mybe another hint the name in Bristol is B.V

Is there a reason why you can't just say Bobby Valentine?

[craigharmann]

Is there a reason why you can't just say Bobby Valentine?

Because if you do, you will be struck down with a deadly disease!

[Invader3K]

Ah yes, the mystical Bobby Valentine. A manager so amazing he hasn't had a job in MLB in almost 10 years. If you say his name three times, he appears through the nearest mirror and drags you into the puragtory of being a gaijin in Japanese baseball.

[Funketown]

What MJ said.

On base percentage is not the only determinant of a lead-off hitters worth. Pierre projects to be worse than Rios, Konerko, Ramirez, Teahen, Pierzynski, Jones and Quentin. There's no reason to give your 8th worst hitter that many plate appearances.

 

To Ozzie Guillen, Carlos Gomez and Alcides Escobar probably look like ideal leadoff hitters right now.

[JohnBriggs12]

What MJ said.

On base percentage is not the only determinant of a lead-off hitters worth. Pierre projects to be worse than Rios, Konerko, Ramirez, Teahen, Pierzynski, Jones and Quentin. There's no reason to give your 8th worst hitter that many plate appearances.

 

To Ozzie Guillen, Carlos Gomez and Alcides Escobar probably look like ideal leadoff hitters right now.

When Escobar leads off an inning, he's hitting .432/.467/.628. And most of that's been done with the pitcher on deck.

[sheethead]

Escobar looks like a great option at leadoff to me, so don't put me in charge.

[MJLiverock]

What MJ said.

On base percentage is not the only determinant of a lead-off hitters worth. Pierre projects to be worse than Rios, Konerko, Ramirez, Teahen, Pierzynski, Jones and Quentin. There's no reason to give your 8th worst hitter that many plate appearances.

 

To Ozzie Guillen, Carlos Gomez and Alcides Escobar probably look like ideal leadoff hitters right now.

As I said Rios and Konerko are batting 3 and 4, I could see Rios batting leadoff but not really Konerko.

 

Looking at the updated Zips projections for these guys

 

Pierre OBP .323

Ramirez .315

Quentin .321

Pierzynski .298

Jones .318

Teahen .331

 

Looking at that motley crew of suckitude I would still say Pierre isn't some glaring error. Teahen doesn't play everyday and is the only one projected barely better than Pierre at gettiong on base. If he picks someone else to bat leadoff at puts Pierre second there would be complaints there too, but the reallity is the lineup isn't very good and Pierre at leadoff doesn't really stand out as some horrible decision using projections or actual results.

 

But then again there is satisfaction with using Corey Hart as some genius move in the #2 hole for the Brewers when he has a .317 OBP vs. RH pitching even with his hot HR month.

[monty57]

So... if we're still out of it in July:

 

-I try to trade Prince Fielder for a near-MLB-ready SP (I think it can be done).

 

-I would also see what the market is for Hart, but he will probably be more marketable in the offseason, so I'd hope he can keep hitting well and raising his price tag. If someone gives me a good offer for him, I'd do it in a heartbeat (no pun intended) and call up Cain to play RF.

 

-I'd see if anyone would give us something of value for Edmonds, who has been pretty productive (offensively and defensively) and bring up Katin to give him a chance at the major league level. Let Gomez and Cain get most of the starts in CF/RF with Katin getting 1-2 stars a week and being a decent RH bat off the bench.

 

-It appears Lucroy is up to stay, and it's good to see that he's starting to get a lot more starts. I'd make sure that he & Kottaras split time the rest of the season.

 

-Since Bush seems to be pitching better, I'd see if any contenders in need of a 4/5 starter would trade me something for him. It wouldn't have to be too much, as we are going to have a surplus of 4/5 SP soon and we won't get anything for him when he walks at the end of the season. This would give us room to insert Davis once he's healthy, while allowing Parra and Narveson (both of whom are potentially part of the future) to remain in the rotation. No worries about depth, as we still have Capuano and Loe on the MLB roster and Rivas could always be called up.

 

-If we're going to extend Weeks, we should do it soon. That really depends on if they really view Lawrie as a 2B. If he'll sign cheaply enough, I'd say do it.

 

-I'd have to think long & hard about Hoffman. If keeping him means sending someone better back to AAA, it might make sense to release him (or trade him for nothing). I would definitely get rid of the poster of him in left field.

 

Finally, I'm really torn about Macha. I don't like him, and would like to see him shown the door, but I don't really want Randolph or Sveum given the job, as the team is likely better than they've been playing, and if they step it up in the second half, the Brewers might be handcuffed into giving Randolph/Sveum the permanent job. I'd rather see them go on the open market and find the best available man for the job. There has to be someone out there... doesn't there?

[Invader3K]

"Finally, I'm really torn about Macha. I don't like him, and would like to see him shown the door, but I don't really want Randolph or Sveum given the job, as the team is likely better than they've been playing, and if they step it up in the second half, the Brewers might be handcuffed into giving Randolph/Sveum the permanent job. I'd rather see them go on the open market and find the best available man for the job. There has to be someone out there... doesn't there? "

 

This is pretty much how I feel, though it might be viewed as unfair to keep Macha around as a lame duck manager when it's obvious he won't be renewed. On the other hand, I don't want to feel obligated to give Sveum or Randolph a chance next season.

[joepepsi]

At risk of jinxing things...the team is 7-7 in June, 6-4 in the last 10 games. There are signs of stabilizing. It's time to cut Hoffman when Coffey comes back and go with the best 25 players available for the next 30 days. See where they are at that point.

[sheethead]

On base percentage is not the only determinant of a lead-off hitters worth.

 

Yeah, speed helps as well.

[MJLiverock]

Getting back to the main topic, I like Monty57's post. Even if the team could play .500 ball the rest of the year that won't be good enough to get in the playoffs so being a seller at the deadline makes sense. Trading any of those guys makes sense and playing the guys who will be around next year and the year after offers me more interest than seeing old veterans play. Getting Parra innings, Narveson, LuCroy, Axford, Gomez, Escobar playing time may pay off more in the future. Even calling up Gamel and or Cain if any of the Prince, Edmonds, Hart type players end up traded.

 

Edit: Forgot to add, if they are sellers and bring up some young guys I hope Macha isn't allowed to keep them on the bench in hopes that winning 80 games keeps his job or looks so much better than winning 77 games or some such ratio. Parra needs to be in the rotation as a sink or swim now rather than always hoping his potential will pan out given spot starts and bullpen work. If LuCroy is going to be on the ML roster he needs to play more than 20% of the games, a 60/40 split with Kottaras would be OK (I know they are starting to lean this way) If Gamel or Cain are called up they should play more than 1x a week. Last year in September playing Counsell over Escobar in the meaningless games was kinda silly.

[TooLiveBrew]

I'd rather see them go on the open market and find the best available man for the job. There has to be someone out there... doesn't there?

 

I used to believe this, and I guess I still do. I just don't believe Doug Melvin will identify him.

 

 

-It appears Lucroy is up to stay, and it's good to see that he's starting to get a lot more starts. I'd make sure that he & Kottaras split time the rest of the season.

 

This is actually about the only thing I have confidence in with Macha. He's handled the catching situation pretty well all season, aside from being a bit gun-shy to play Lucroy at first. Ken Macha, not comfortable playing a prospect? Gasp!

[logan82]

If we're going to extend Weeks, we should do it soon. That really

depends on if they really view Lawrie as a 2B. If he'll sign cheaply

enough, I'd say do it.

I am not to concerned if Lawrie can actually play 2B if we can extend Weeks. I would try to extend Weeks because it would give us more depth and options for trading.

 

-I'd have to think long & hard about Hoffman. If keeping him means

sending someone better back to AAA, it might make sense to release him

(or trade him for nothing). I would definitely get rid of the poster of

him in left field.

I am not concerned with having to send a guy to AAA if we keep Hoffman. I would be concerned if we had to waive or DFA a guy to keep Hoffman. Sending a guy to AAA keeps his service time down.

 

Finally, I'm really torn about Macha. I don't like him, and would like

to see him shown the door, but I don't really want Randolph or Sveum

given the job, as the team is likely better than they've been playing,

and if they step it up in the second half, the Brewers might be

handcuffed into giving Randolph/Sveum the permanent job. I'd rather see

them go on the open market and find the best available man for the job.

There has to be someone out there... doesn't there?

Definitely agree. I don't want Svuem, Macha or Randolph as a manager.(or Brenly) I would hope they look at nonretreads. I am not hopeful the next manager will be any better than Macha though, just different.

 

 

On base percentage is not the only determinant of a lead-off hitters

worth.

 

Yeah, speed helps as well.

Yeah speed id a big help. Doesn't help much unless you can get on base though. Until Gomez and Escobar figure out how to steal 1B, they need to make fewer outs to be good hitters.

[sheethead]

I think we have to be sellers if we are indeed "out of it." There is still a small window to get back into it. Its not like the Reds and/or Cards are running away with the division. If the Crew can climb back to .500 and be within 5 games of the division lead by the All Star break and are showing signs of playing good baseball, I don't think Melvin is going to sell.

[logan82]

I think we have to be sellers if we are indeed "out of it." There is still a small window to get back into it. Its not like the Reds and/or Cards are running away with the division. If the Crew can climb back to .500 and be within 5 games of the division lead by the All Star break and are showing signs of playing good baseball, I don't think Melvin is going to sell.

I think you are probably right and I think it would also be a huge mistake.